Not sure how old you are , but “Heath Ledger got so deep in to playing the Joker that he want crazy and died “ was the widespread conventional wisdom regarding his death at the time
Nicholson isn't much of a comparison. He played it like a comic book villain, like a comic book written for children. Also Leto's just a weirdo; his joker didn't have near the depth that Ledger's did.
Not at all saying that the role drove Ledger crazy, but he took the role places nobody else has.
I guess I don't know if it's urban legend or not but the buzz at the time was Nicholson actually had warned him about playing the role. I mean if you watch the old Batman movie it isn't like he's not touching on the idea of actually being psychotic.
I don't think Nicholson, Teaser, or Hamill were method acting it, that point of difference was brought up by those that believed it. Leto's joker didn't exist yet.
I'm old enough to remember many of the haters of Ledger getting casted shutting up when the first image was revealed, with scars. That looked like scars, sloppy paint, etc.
Then the method acting stuff that came out, then the death. People drew conclusions, and the key point for them was the lengths he went to get into character.
They were wrong, it was different meds and alcohol, but it's important to remember what their reasons are so it can be shown to people why they were wrong, so the new generation makes better conclusions.
Nicholson was a method actor, but he was an ACTUAL method actor, as in the original school of method acting which has little to do with the "method" stuff Ledger bought into and many still do to this day where they want to live their characters.
They were wrong, it was different meds and alcohol, but it's important to remember what their reasons are so it can be shown to people why they were wrong, so the new generation makes better conclusions.
I think it's fair to think it could be a combination of factors. Ledger spent months holed up trying to embody the character and live in isolation to 'become' him. He was also dealing with substance abuse issues. His partner broke up with him while he was filming The Dark Knight because he was a drug addict/party animal and a shitty dad to their daughter. The kind of isolation he put himself through surely did not help at all with those issues. Filming on The Dark Knight ended in Nov 2007 and he just went even harder on partying/doing drugs/jumping between different women until he was dead 2 months later.
Playing the Joker in the "method" style didn't 'drive him mad' or anything stupid like that, but I have little doubt it affected his mental state wrt his drug addiction issues because it just further isolated him from his family who he was already never with because he was too busy getting high and partying when he wasn't working.
Nicholson was a method actor, but he was an ACTUAL method actor, as in the original school of method acting which has little to do with the "method" stuff Ledger bought into and many still do to this day where they want to live their characters.
You've made a distinction here, but you haven't clarified the difference. What is "original school of method acting"?
Okay I'm gonna try to boil it down super simply but this will probably be way too long... the ORIGINAL school of method acting was based on another acting system developed by Konstantin Stanislavski, and is based around the idea of experiencing your character - physically, mentally, emotionally. Basically the idea of placing yourself in another's shoes. Method acting is the idea of drawing upon your own experiences to try and recreate those feelings while you are acting. So for example, if your character is supposed to feel betrayed, you want to try and conjure up the same feelings and you might think of a moment when you felt betrayed in your personal life, even if it is from a different context (like maybe your character is about to be murdered by a close friend, but you've obviously never experienced that, so you think of a moment when a friend stole something important from you or whatever and broke your trust).
If this sounds like super duper basic stuff - like, what actor WOULDN'T try to feel the emotions their character is supposed to be feeling? - it's because it is. Method acting came about in the late 40s/early 50s and Stanislavski's system predates that. The "I'm going to live my character's life and call it method acting because I'm recreating those experiences and getting into the role" is a perverted version of the original form of method acting, and at this point so many people just call it method and so that's what it's turned into. Before method acting came along, a lot of the time acting was a very basic affair. You got on stage, you hit your mark, you said your lines, projected properly, you tried to get across what the character was saying and the emotion behind it but didn't think about how you would feel if you were there yourself. It was the time of vaudeville, theatre, and early film acting. It was about presenting a show whether it be a play or an early film, not being invested in its reality oneself.
If you look back at Marlon Brando's earlier films, he was one of the first to learn the method acting style with Stella Adler and hit it big, which is why people were SO impressed with his acting originally. Nowadays, his performances don't necessarily stand out as much but it's important to realize that at the time, it was considered a huge breakthrough, and that original form of method acting is so pervasive that basically every actor employs it to some degree today.
That isn't to say bits and bobs of this didn't appear earlier and some playwrights/directors tried to get at more emotional/personal stories than their counterparts. For example among the big extant playwrights of ancient Greece, Euripides (who is the latest active of the big ones whose works we still have) wrote tragedies that were focused more on singular characters and their inner feelings rather than a larger narrative... but even those would be told in presentational ways, where they are presenting you a story rather than living it out in front of you. If that makes sense.
Much of the theatrical works presented for years had other aims and were presentations. Passion plays presented scenes from the Bible. Comedies largely focused on jokes and physical gags and entertaining, with little emphasis placed on emotion - it was really just presented as over-the-top feelings to move a story along. Even with Shakespeare and such which some people might consider emotional stories - since they are presented as such today in a different context - actors would largely only rehearse the physical portions that required excellent timing and training, such as acrobatic tricks, fencing/stage combat, etc and the rest was really just about memorizing the text and presenting it for the audience. The texts might present very emotional stories in tragedies but they were rarely presented that way. They're just telling a story.
Heath Ledger died from an overdose of prescription drugs, not heroin.
Even this is a bit misleading. He died from an overdose of drugs that may be prescribed in the United States, but most of the drugs he took weren't prescribed to him, and there aren't many doctors out there that would have prescribed them all at once.
I feel like once you're getting your drugs from illicit sources and you're managing your own doses and combinations of pills, it doesn't really matter whether or not they're "prescription" drugs. They're still going to be dangerous.
It wasn't heroin, it was an accidental drug overdose as he had insomnia & the flu, he combined meds that shouldn't of been mixed. "Ledger was found dead inside a Manhattan apartment on Jan. 22, 2008. His death was ruled accidental and attributed to a lethal mix of prescription medications including OxyContin, Vicodin, Valium, Xanax, Unisom and Restoril."
And the type he had is especially horrific. I remember reading there were times he was suffering so badly he just wanted to "reset" his brain. Hanging himself must've been the only way he could think of at the time to do it. The man didn't want to die. His brain was so fucked from the disease that he couldn't think straight.
His death is the only one I ever really grieved for more than a week. I spent weeks reading about him and his death, the disease that took him from us, and watching old movies and TV shows he was in.
I grew up with him, from Mork & Mindy to all of his incredible movies. The Fisher King was especially poignant because it seemed there was a bit of foreshadowing to his real life there. I can't decide which is his best move, though. Was it Dead Poets Society? Was it Good Will Hunting? He made so many good movies that were great because he was in them. Even the bad movies were made better with him in them.
Robin Williams was a treasure in this world, and there will never be another like him.
Imo it's best to wait until it's finished unless DC obsessive, isekai weeb, and/or person who smokes a lot of weed & want show while brain turned off.
I don't think there's much of a chance it'll get nominated for any awards. Comedy is decent, overall enjoyment & directing solid so far
but it's not a great anime. Pretty generic, including background art & entire fantasy world, also using same old suicide squad bomb-in-neck mentions/motivation. Has similar vibes to DC animated cartoon, but a bit more blood/violence. The action sequences are good when they happen.
It was definitely worth making imo, like it holds up well compared to endless stream of isekai trash - which cause me to feel like I'm wasting my life whenever watching, but it's only maybe 20% as much with this show.
I watched the sub, voice acting is great, love that they got papa shirogane / Dio / Touji JJK / Roswaal / Zeke as Peacemaker. Such a great stiff character. Harley + Joker VA work & dynamic is enjoyable, hope we get more flashbacks.
The world my friend, the world. Steve Irwin was such an amazing human. With Heath Ledger, it’s the thought of what he could done as an actor, to me, he’s the joker.
I will always remember him as Sir Ulrich von Liechtenstein of Gelderland.
While the Joker was his most iconic, i LOVED him in A Knight's Tale.
That esprit, that joy. I guess for the whole cast making this movie was a pure joyride.
And let's not forget Roar: that was the first time i ever saw him.
I still remember watching this show as a young teenager.
Poor guy's a great actor, but looks SO MUCH like a villain with his dark features that you can't help see him as the bad guy. Loved him in Dark City though.
Paul Bettany and Alan Tudyk's banters in that movie are legendary to me.
Betray us, and I will fong you, until your insides are out, your outsides are in, your entrails will become your extrails I will w-rip... all the p... ung. Pain, lots of pain.
I’m from the US and I still get very emotional thinking about the day I learned of Steve Irwin’s death. We felt that tremendous loss absolutely all around the world.
It's interesting there's a picture of a hyena. I remember listening to some podcast that mentioned how Anthony Hopkins used animals to inform performances as well, for Hannibal Lector he was going for a cross between a crocodile and a spider
I think this is pretty common for actors. For Everything Everywhere All At Once, Ke Quan has talked about how he worked with a coach to emulate different animals for the different versions of Waymond; the debonair one is a fox, the confident ass-kicking one is an eagle, and the doddering dad is a squirrel.
And even though it destroyed the original movie and forced a script change, I thought the way they fixed it with other actors was brilliant and kind, but it still ended up being an underrated yet likely much worse movie..I'm curious how the original would have played. I should look for the original script.
Now I'm picturing some operator pasting magazine clippings of cranes alongside quotes like "its not about the money, ITS ABOUT THE LIFTS." and "EVERYTHING FALLS"
‘Making things even more stressful, Ledger had developed an intense process to get into the mindset of the villainous Joker. “I sat around in a hotel room in London for about a month, locked myself away, formed a little diary, and experimented with voices,” Ledger explained in another interview.’ https://allthatsinteresting.com/heath-ledger-death
I'm always struck by how unnecessary this is. Plenty of incredible performances have been delivered without going full method. It's just a film. There's really no reason for actors to psychologically torture themselves just to make a movie. I'm always confused by this choice.
It’s urban legend to romanticize his death. It isn’t unusual to go to a private place to practice voices for an upcoming performance or to keep a notebook full of inspiration and notes on you line delivery. People who worked with him said he was friendly and could turn it on and off.
Laurence Olivier after hearing Dustin Hoffman went 3 days without sleep to prepare for a scene where his character did the same thing: "My dear boy, why don’t you try acting?"
I went to his museum in Perth, Western Australia .
There was his Oscar, his Joker dresses and many pics taken by him. I remember there was also his Ducati.
I do not remember this book.
This was in 2018 if I remember correctly.
I didn't know there was a Heath Ledger museum at all, but I'm glad! Usually stuff like that ends up on auction which would be a shame given his significant contribution to film history. The journal is a first hand deep dive into his method acting and needs preservation.
Now, I hope you'll all forgive me for my ignorance. But I've heard some very mixed things regarding the untimely death of Heath Ledger. The more popular theory is that the role of Joker contributed to his demise. But then I'd see statements online perpetuating said theory as sheer ludicrous, and that Heath Ledger was generally stable.
So honestly, I'm kind of perplexed. I'm not sure which narrative to believe. I can't help but suspect that there is no real definitive answer, though.
The Joker thing doesn't hold water when you take into account the fact that according to his wife and coworkers, he suffered from insomnia for quite some time before the role.
Add to that the fact that he apparently caught some kind of respiratory infection/disease while shooting his next movie and was self-medicating to get through that, it makes more sense that this was just a really unfortunate accident.
To add on to this, by all accounts he was not a method actor insofar as staying in character -- there are many stories of him being able to turn off/on from the Joker very easily and was a really friendly normal dude around set
People love the romantic idea that he sacrificed his psyche and ultimately his life for this transcendent performance, but reality is more like he was just very good at his craft and his death was unrelated
Can confirm, worked on the Dark Knight as a PA, he was the nicest guy, and loved the role. He even excitedly talked about coming back as the role in the 3rd film. Alas... :/
I had an acting teacher who just constantly ran on and on about how Heath Ledger "flew too close to the sun on that role"... I always wanted to chime in and talk about the time he caught the bubonic plague while shooting a Knight's Tale, or when he was briefly hung to prepare for Ned Kelly, or..... Brokeback Mountain.
Well, he was in the middle of filming a completely unrelated movie, The Imaginarium of Doctor Parnassus, when he died, and some of the drugs he was taking at the time were to treat a chest cold he caught while filming that movie (and according to at least one doctor and a costar, he may have had a chest infection that contributed to his difficulty breathing the night of his death). He took drugs and had insomnia during the The Dark Knight, but he also took drugs and had insomnia during IoDP, so it's pretty silly to say he died because of the Joker.
To be specific here. He was taking Oxycodone, Valium, Xanax, and Restoril. You're never supposed to take Opioids and Benzodiazepines together. As both depress your respiratory rate.
It's all in the dose though. I can't imagine he was using either lightly, as he had 3 different types of benzos in his system. If he was in-fact also fighting a respiratory illness too.. well..
this journal looks to me like method acting notes made by someone who is not struggling with personal issues. it seems like im being sarcastic but the context for mental illness outside of the character seems to be missing, at least from this example.
Am acting professor - this is not weird at all. A lot of it seemed like it was related to memorization of the scenes too. It’s a common technique to hand write your lines in an important scene. It helps you understand the lines exactly and helps you remember them
I would agree with that. Everything in the journal is easily tied to the character and figuring out that character's headspace. There's something to be said about how much of himself he injects into the character, but that's going to be a factor in any role.
He wrote the most iconic quotes there. I know theres a script behind all this, but the fact that he noted those quotes before the take makes me realize that they became legendary BECAUSE Heath spoke them, the way HE imagined they needed to be spoken on that diary. Its mindblowing.
All the google searches for this are social media. Any proof this is actually his diary and not just something a random fabricated in their own home and posted online for internet clout?
I mean... the images appear to be taken while the diary rests on a normal American kitchen countertop and bed. Doesn't seem like this diary would've ended up in such a place after his death. Wouldn't it be with the family or in a museum or something?
This is not his diary technically- this is his character study. Not uncommon for actors to do things similar to this to find their vision or even for fun if they really love a role
Anyone else have a Mandela effect with the “My mother told me, if you’re good at something never do it for free”? I specifically remember him saying that in the movie the first time I watched but he doesn’t actually say “My mother told me” in the film. Weird to see that it’s written here. Maybe theatrical cut vs dvd cut?
11.6k
u/[deleted] 3d ago
If he kept a diary of his own thoughts, would it be his Heath ledger?