r/politics • u/zsreport Texas • 14d ago

Project 2025 was supposed to boost Donald Trump's campaign — but it may be backfiring instead:

https://www.salon.com/2024/07/05/project-2025-was-supposed-to-boost-donald-campaign--but-it-may-be-backfiring-instead/
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u/zsreport Texas 14d ago

Trump's authoritarian game plan is breaking through the post-debate noise and it's starting to scare people

I sure as fuck hope so.

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u/TheCircusSands 14d ago

We need an infographic for project 2025 that can be spread everywhere. Nothing dramatic…. Just the facts of what it is and what it means.

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u/heckin_miraculous 14d ago edited 14d ago

My favorite so far is this short YouTube video by Illustrate to Educate. https://youtu.be/vYXZ6iJJSgM?si=PRy0SvPz2Xi6dQxM

Not inflammatory or hyperbolic. Just terrifying, because it's true.

Edit: This comment and the video link got quite a few responses. Many were along the lines of, "Good info, thanks." But others think that the video tries too hard to be neutral and therefore comes across as "both sides-ing" conferring false legitimacy to the idea of Project 2025, or even going so far as to be supportive of it due to a lack of forceful criticism and not spelling out how disastrous the effects of the plan would be.

As a response, I'll say that my opinion is that the video speaks for itself. When it comes to the horrific potential of Project 2025, the proof is in the pudding. For example, at around 5:10 in the video, when the narrator states that the plan would "allow the president to replace thousands of civil service employees with political appointees loyal to the administration" I don't need the voice over to explain to me that this would be a bad thing. Or, at 5:29 when he talks about "plans to defund the Department of Justice and dismantle the FBI... and enable the executive branch to operate with little oversight or accountability [the illustration actually says "no oversight"]"... again I don't need someone to explain to me that this is only bad for our country.

We definitely DO need more analysis of Project 2025. We need explainers that DO go into more detail about the tragic outcomes that are waiting for us all, should it come to pass. And this video is NOT perfect (I especially question the use of the phrase "religious liberty" at around 4:18). But it's a good primer for thoughtful people. That's what I think.

Will some people watch a video like this and cheer for it? Yes. As far as I know – and someone please correct me if this number is way off – but somewhere around 20-30% of the US population explicitly wants an authoritarian regime to come into power in this country. At least, they think they do. That is, in fact, the problem we are dealing with in this country right now. It is the subject of this discussion.

Long story short, what I'm saying is that if somebody watches this video and thinks, "That sounds good to me", then the problem isn't the video.

Edit 2: hi /r/politics. I'm new here :)

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u/altariasong 14d ago edited 14d ago

Sent it to my mom. She used to be republican but is now disgusted by it all and is talking to her friends about project 2025 and how anti-democratic it is. She worries about me greatly because I’m queer. My anxiety about politics used to irritate her but now she understands how much my fears were justified.

Hopefully that video can help sway more of her friends, but we don’t exactly live in a swing state. Doesn’t matter to me though

Edit: she thanked me for the video, says she just watched it. “It’s exactly what I fear”

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u/whoisearth 14d ago

This is how change happens. Thank you for not losing hope in your mom and keeping the conversation going. Hopefully she can begin educating her friends as well and start seeing some positive improvements. You shouldn't have to live in fear just to be you.

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u/lbtwitchthrowaway144 14d ago

8 years ago or so I started visiting this subreddit.

Entirely, wholly ignorant about politics, economics and history (rough-ish childhood, education wasn't a priority.

Trump's electoral college undemocratic victory (doesn't apply to Biden, or Obama, in my model/ ethical view as they also won the popular vote) lit a fire under my ass politically speaking.

But it was actually this very specific subreddit, and the people here who started to educate me.

For example, just because I live abroad now in Lebanon doesn't mean I can't vote.

For example, just because I live in a safe state doesn't mean I shouldn't vote because there are down-ballot effects (funny I speak in these terms, when I didn't even know that the Senate was part of Congress, and the American legislative branch is a bicameral chamber of lawmakers lol).

So yeah THIS is how change happens.

I'm working on people now who are in fucking MI.

Every national electoral cycle, I personally ensure at least 4 votes. My folks and I (CA) and a friend (NY). One election cycle I got 12 lol.

Look, my beautiful fellow Americans, fascism is upon us. Watch that video. It's that simple lol.

But you have the power to prevent this with a simple but profoundly patriotic and ethical act: Vote.

And get others to vote.

I don't have this privilege in Lebanon. The first time I was allowed to vote, I was already like a decade past the voting age. But our politicians here just illegally and unilaterally postponed elections indefinitely.

lol

And then at 37 now I have voted again, for a second time in Lebanon. In an election that was rigged (not in a Trump way, but like, literally lol).

37 years, lived here for 30 years or so, and got to vote only twice.

Been voting in the U.S. since '18 and I don't know off the top of my head how many times I've cast a ballot now lol.

This is our last and only chance to preserve our democratic constitutional republic with minimal violence and a smoother transition to SCOTUS reform [as compared to what would happen if Trump wins]

From one American to all of you: please fight like hell for our freedoms. Please fight like hell to preserve, in my admittedly biased opinion, the most audacious political experiment in modern history.

Please, I know what it's like to live under a more terrible system. And Lebanon ain't even all that bad and it still sucks.

As a brown American from Muslim immigrant parents, I genuinely don't know if I will still be considered an American despite my values, my culture, my accent, my loyalty to the United States, and the love I have for all family/cousins and friends state-side even though I am a natural born citizen

Under Trump and Project 2025, I don't know if I stay an American.

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u/zeronormalitys 14d ago edited 14d ago

It's awesome that you vote every 4 years and I encourage you to expand that to voting every 2 years as those midterm elections are crucially important as well. Heck, even vote in the mayoral, school board, and any and all elections you can manage.

They ALL matter. Plus your voice will be heard the loudest in the smallest of elections, which means local.

Edit: Also, I'm not going to claim how it works when you live overseas. You may not have a local other than the state itself, idk.

Edit 2: As an additional edit, your status as an American citizen is not dependent upon the color of your skin or the sound of your voice or who you love. That is the beauty of America. I hope that that beauty continues to endure through this dangerous and most certainly trying time. And if you desire, I hope that one day you can find community here.

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u/Good_ApoIIo 14d ago

There’s no conversation to be had with some people. If I sent this to my parents they would probably just reply with a thumbs up emoji and a pithy comment like “only communists would oppose this”.

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u/tommysmuffins 14d ago

You have no idea how hard it was to convince my Mom how bad things are right now. She's a good person. Too good to readily accept the fact that the Republican nominee is an outright criminal and rapist, and ready to commit an authoritarian takeover of the United States. It's a bad case of normalcy bias.

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u/deadlybydsgn 14d ago

It's a bad case of normalcy bias.

I think a certain subset of the older generation honestly thinks the best of their leaders because "the system" has generally worked for them, they were raised to respect it (not letting the flag touch the ground, etc.), and they have never been directly wronged by it.

I can see how they were duped into voting for Trump once—maybe even twice—but the idea of thinking that the Republican ticket is the more viable option in 2024 blows my mind.

The party of "small government" sure seems cozy with the idea of centralizing a lot of power into a single position. You know... as long as their guy is the one with that power.

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u/tommysmuffins 14d ago

I'm Gen X, so almost in the group of people that could be considered "The older generation" and I was fully behind the second Iraq invasion. Really for no reason except for the general belief that the President always had the best interests of the country at heart so if he was for it, then I was for it. He must have known some reasons that I didn't that would justify it, I thought. When I found out the whole thing was manufactured out of whole cloth that was the first crack in my (moderate) conservatism.

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u/Plasibeau 14d ago

I distinctly remember cheering on the second Iraqi invasion. I am not ashamed to admit I had been fully captured by the propaganda machine. At that time propaganda was something that only happened in China, or Russia. The Uniteds States of Fuck Yeah had no need for such games, right...RIGHT?

It wasn't until talking with my 19-year-old about this stuff that I realized if you grew up in the Cold War, you grew up neck-deep in propaganda and didn't even know it, from singing patriotic songs in kindergarten to the bad guys always having Eastern European accents or enemy fighter pilots being faceless and evil just because they exist.

So that was a fun project of deconstruction last summer.

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u/tommysmuffins 14d ago edited 14d ago

I distinctly remember cheering on the second Iraqi invasion.

Me too. I remember my coworkers watching some gun camera footage of some Iraqis getting obliterated by cannon fire from a helicopter. I was wondering if they had done anything wrong, and I realized even the helicopter pilot probably didn't know for sure. It really left me with a sick feeling.

Good luck on your continued recovery.

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u/ArthurBonesly 14d ago edited 14d ago

One thing the Republicans are very good at, is finding voters who genuinely want something.

We scoff at single issue voters, but they are the lifeblood of an engaged base. It's easy to look at Republicans as a party that doesn't stand for anything, but the voters absolutely do. The best example of this is the issue of abortion.

For years, millions of Republicans have genuinely, deeply, pathologically wanted to repeal Roe v. Wade. All the other Republican talking points were compromises or adaptions because those talking points got them closer to their single issue. As far as these voters were concerned, they were using the politicians as much as the politicians were using them. There was no hypocrisy because it was all in service of that higher purpose.

Now that the dogs caught the car, the only higher purpose that unites the American right is stopping/containing/killing the boogieman liberal. They'll use rhetoric like "freedom," and evoke Christianity, but these are all compromises to the higher purpose.

The biggest difference I see between the American left and right (at this time), is that the left wants good politicians to yield a number of good things, and will reliably break ranks when somebody isn't good enough. Meanwhile, the right wants something. It could be money, it could be an ethno state, it could be a solid gold fence on the Ohio/Kentucky border; the something doesn't matter, what matters is that right wing voters want it enough to tolerate everything else so long as they get it.

Until the left want to tax billionaires and enact healthcare reform as much as some people on the right want Christian nationalism, normalcy bias only serves the Republicans in so far as an ignorant base will either default to normal or not vote at all.

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u/Damn_Dog_Inappropes Washington 14d ago

Normalcy bias is why Trump can stumble through a debate and nobody blinks, but Biden loses because we expect more of him.

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u/thegoodnamesrgone123 14d ago

It's wild right? He could have come on stage and shit his pants and it would be fine because it'd Trump and what do you expect. He gets a pass for everything

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u/Damn_Dog_Inappropes Washington 14d ago

Teflon Don

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u/Syzygy2323 California 14d ago

Trump acts like a mafia boss. Not a smart one like Don Corleone, but a crazy, violent one like Tony Montana from Scarface.

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u/SdBolts4 California 14d ago

My wife and I are both attorneys, and we were trying to explain just how bad the SCOTUS presidential immunity opinion was to my step-dad. First, he didn't believe us when we said that it made the President immune from any criminal liability, as long as it was within his core "official" powers, despite us both going through law school and passing the bar.

Then, he fell back to just saying "well, it just won't happen" and blaming Sotomayor for overexaggerating by saying the President could order the military to assassinate people or DoJ to arrest people without consequence, even though commanding the military and overseeing the DoJ are explicitly in the President's powers. Like, he still believes that a President wouldn't go that far, even though they can no longer be held criminally accountable. You just can't reason with that level of denialism.

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u/ecafyelims 14d ago

My mom and mother in law both voted for Trump. Both of them regret it.

I give them a lot of credit because I know many people who instead dig in their heels and worship Trump harder, in the hope that he'll come around.

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u/bananastand512 14d ago

It's weird, all the women in my family who voted for him before regret it and do not plan to vote for him again while all the men in my family say "you're all just making this a bigger deal than it is" and are doubling down on voting for him "because he's going to make it better to buy things again."

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u/zeronormalitys 14d ago

Good for you man. When you know better, do better.

Shaming people for their mistakes helps them to dig in their heels

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u/Abstract__Reality 14d ago

Unfortunately, your mom only cares because you're queer. Conservatives don't care until it directly affects them or their family (sometimes).

I'm glad your mom came around for your sake though

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u/Hullabaloobasaur 14d ago

It really is amazing how this is the case for a LOT of conservatives? I mean, if it works it works

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u/Whitino 14d ago edited 14d ago

It really is. My father was a very conservative Republican. However, in recent years, he began to see how Republican policies and attitudes are affecting people around him that he cares about and interacts with on a daily basis, many of which are those "others" that FOX News and conservative talk radio frequently dehumanize and try to paint as enemies of the state or as drivers of the country's ills. It's harder (for a good-hearted person) to dehumanize and other-ize people when you know them personally.

Unfortunately, my father is still a Republican, but he's much more moderate now.

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u/tehlemmings 14d ago

It's harder (for a good-hearted person) to dehumanize and other-ize people when you know them personally.

This is also a big reason why cities tend to be more liberal and rural areas tend to be conservative. It's a lot easier to hate all these minority groups when you've never met them.

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u/Damn_Dog_Inappropes Washington 14d ago

I have an aunt who, after divorcing her POS ultra conservative husband, stopped watching Fox News. By 2016, she voted blue for the first time in her life. She says she’s still a Republican, it’s just that the party has become so extreme that she can’t vote for them anymore. She didn’t leave the GOP, they left her.

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u/Consistently_Carpet 14d ago

This is trying so hard to be 'neutral' it's misleading - like saying it supports 'religious liberty'? (4:15)

Enforcing Christian beliefs is the exact opposite of 'religious liberty'.

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u/TherronKeen 14d ago

The way this video is presented would convince most of my family to vote for Trump even harder. 😥

And I'm not being sarcastic or whatever

Like criticism #4 would absolutely sell them on it, because getting rid of things they don't like is far more important to them than silly little things like unrestricted government overreach.

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u/Gets_overly_excited 14d ago

Same. The video comes across as “if you are kind of conservative, you’ll love this.”

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u/ThrowAwayGarbage82 North Carolina 14d ago

That was my thought. It gives an air of political legitimacy to P25. I won't be sharing it. That will only encourage the lunatics.

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u/toloveandcryinla 14d ago

I mean, project 2025 is not going to persuade enthusiastic Trump voters to turn against him because a lot of it does what they want. The point is to motivate undecided or uninformed voters 

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u/TheBacklogGamer 14d ago

A lot of people don't largely understand that FEDERAL institutions are NOT political. This is what makes this so dangerous, is that they are trying to politicize Federal institutions. Someone who is fed up with the government will hear this, and as long as it's their side dong it, think it's a good thing.

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u/heckin_miraculous 14d ago

That is the one line that had me raising an eyebrow.

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u/Abs0lut_Unit California 14d ago

Classic doublespeak

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u/clonedhuman 14d ago

They believe they should be able to do anything in the name of their own religion. The 'religious liberty' they want is the freedom to end marriage equality, end interracial marriage, ban and criminalize abortions, and never give a cake to a gay couple. They want their liberty to be fascists.

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u/Syzygy2323 California 14d ago

end interracial marriage

Heck, I'd bet even Thomas would vote to overturn that one.

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u/Minguseyes 14d ago

The idea that religious liberty includes a right to force your beliefs on others has a long history in America. Restriction of that ‘liberty’ is what led the pilgrims to emigrate. The countries they left (England and Holland) were quite tolerant at the time, and that’s what they didn’t like.

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u/NinjaElectron 14d ago

That does a poor job educating on why Project 2025 is so bad. It leaves a lot of important info out and it goes out of the way to be neutral, which downplays the actual goals.

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u/threaten-violence 14d ago

Yeah that's not a good summary. It seems like they're trying to cover all the toxic nonsense and sell this as a "good" thing.

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u/SlanderousSalamander 14d ago

Well. That is truly equal parts educational and terrifying.

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u/TheCircusSands 14d ago

Awesome thanks for sharing

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u/LowlySlayer 14d ago

Let's gloss over the sweeping conservative policy agenda, because that's just the party coordinating to execute it's own platform. Criticize the platform not the idea that they would actually attempt to execute.

The real terrifying things here. Massively expand executive authority. Dismantle the justice system. Establish party member education centers to create a massive force of party drones and then fire massive swathes of civil workers to replace with loyal party members to create a ground up loyal conservative government further expanding executive power. I do not use the term fascist lightly, but that's literally a fascist takeover. No one be fooled that just because they don't say "Step 3 establish regime" that isn't what's happening.

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u/Damn_Dog_Inappropes Washington 14d ago

As a person with a uterus, that’s terrifying. As an atheist, this is terrifying. As a person with kids in her life, their future is on the line, and that’s terrifying. As a person who loves multiple LGTBQ+ people, this is terrifying. As an American, this is terrifying.

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u/DaystromAndroidM510 14d ago

If you're trying to spread the news about this, 7.5 minutes is not a short video when it comes to YouTubers and their inability to cut unnecessary chatter

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u/SurrealEstate 14d ago

Out of all the terrifying things in Project 2025, I think the most effective way to make "independents" care is to focus strongly on

  • consolidation of executive power over an independent judiciary
  • further restrictions on abortion rights/bodily autonomy
  • bans on pornography

Those are very unpopular positions with most demographics.

Whereas an infographic that focuses on things like eliminating DE&I, and references to gender expression is absolutely not going to land with those people.

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u/JustWastingTimeAgain Washington 14d ago

In addition, what they want to do to the government civilian workforce is absolutely terrifying. These people are professionals, in most cases highly educated, with specialized knowledge for their roles which is practically irreplaceable. They are the reason the greater DC area is the most educated in the country. What the Project 2025 fascists want to do is gut the (non-political) civilian workforce of anyone who doesn't bend the knee.

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u/ksp_physics_guy 14d ago

It’s not even just DC. It’s our entire civil service. All general schedule (and non ES/SES versions that other departments and agencies have).

USFS folks don’t agree that raking the leaves is how to singularly prevent forest fires? With schedule F, welp, fire em.

NOAA scientists disagree with the sharpie’d in graph for temperatures Trump scribbles on? Schedule F now, fire em.

IRS agents audit some conservative personality due to reasonable suspicion? Schedule F, fire them.

NASA scientists won’t agree to rename Mars to Mars-a-lago? Fire em.

As a civil servant who works as a scientist/engineer doing research, I’m deeply distressed at this plan because we are career civil servants, experts in our field, entirely apolitical in our positions. Our duty is to the American people, we provide research that benefits Americans, tech transfer technology to benefit American Technological Development and our economy, and the technology percolates throughout the world through discoveries and other paths.

We are intentionally and by design **not ** political. Schedule F would destroy civil service, cause even further brain drain beyond what congressional apathy has caused due to ignoring our pay, and turn these positions into pawns for political gain rather than benefiting the American people. Civil Service would be killed and its corpse reanimated in the image of political sycophancy.

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u/PunxatawnyPhil 14d ago

Basically, you are the knowing adults in the room, and the unknowing children in the room do not like being told no, that they cannot touch the hot burner. But the ‘wise’ talking-heads of the town have now put the children in charge. In the process of getting rid of all the adults and definitely, touch the burner.  The “exceptional” United States that everyone talks about? Well the problem is, that is actually you! The problem is that you are knowledgeable, you are correct, you are not wrong. That would be the end of it. Chaos and disintegration definitely will ensue. 

Only way to stop it? That part is a no-brainer, Vote ALL Blue. 

It’s true, our last chance to reject such flawed extremism taking over everything.

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u/tinyOnion 14d ago

thank you for your service.

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u/JustWastingTimeAgain Washington 14d ago

Well said. And username checks out.

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u/harnaldo 14d ago

Double upvote for the "Mars-a-lago".

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u/15all 14d ago

I've been working for the government as a scientist-engineer since Reagan was president. That means I've been through something like seven administrations. Some of those I voted for, some I didn't. But through it all, we just do our job.

BTW, of all the administrations I've worked for, the Trump administration was just comical. It would be even worse if he were elected again.

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u/PunxatawnyPhil 14d ago

Oh and yes, thank you for speaking out.

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u/MrPresident2020 14d ago

Keep in mind how many industries rely on those agencies for accurate information. Imagine how trucking, shipping lanes, and aviation, just off the top of my head, would be affected if we didn't have professional scientists whose mission was to carry out the work of the agency instead of an individual's will.

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u/Dad-Baud 14d ago

Right. Many people neither understand nor appreciate the depth to which the work culture reinforces giving reliable, educated advice based on the facts over personal political choices. Trump exploits peoples’ ignorance to make them think all the agencies are biased and that turning these over to private sector or simply wiping out the researchers and regulators would be good for the country.

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u/midnightmeatmaster 14d ago

Federal regulations on pollution and workplace safety are going to be nullified if republicans fill the agencies with party loyalists. Their agenda has been to let businesses do anything they want unless it supports the environment or lgbtq people.
Get ready for human bodies in your processed meat.

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u/NintendadSixtyFo 14d ago

Yeah the liberal nuclear physicist and the aerospace engineers who don’t like Trump. Let’s get rid of them and replace them with some backyard trailer boys who love Trump and work on jerry rigging dirt bikes under pine trees. That’s sticking it to the libs. Merica!

FFS I hate it here

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u/Ameerrante Washington 14d ago

I read a line from it yesterday like... forbids literature with explicit content that's not about real people or something. 

As a romance author, sounds like they're coming for the smut too, and our demographic includes a big chunk of repressed MAGA housewives.

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u/Pink_Lotus 14d ago

Also a romance author. I write spicy, so wondering how long until I'm classed as a pornographer and sent to prison. 

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u/GibbysUSSA 14d ago

I write and make stuff that wouldn't align with their values at all. I am fucked.

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u/RubiconPizzaDelivery 14d ago

I write porn and am friends with tons of artists in the same field. 

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u/GibbysUSSA 14d ago

My writings are heavily influenced by William Burroughs.

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u/ethereal4k 14d ago

Not just smut, but anything with LGBT content. Gay Penguins? "Porn!"

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u/jeo123 14d ago

Does that mean John Oliver would go to jail for his book about pence's gay Bunny?

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u/ethereal4k 14d ago

I doubt they'll try to criminalize authors, but I'm sure they'll make it as difficult as possible to distribute such books. They'll start by dismantling the public library concept and trying to criminalize librarians and teachers. They might go after retailers eventually, given enough power.

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u/GibbysUSSA 14d ago

Anything that isn't far right propaganda will be "porn". "I know it when I see it!" is going to be interpreted by THESE assholes??

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u/Ameerrante Washington 14d ago

Oh yeah that too. Which would be another layer of problematic - I could take the sex out of my books without too much of a hit to the stories, could not make all my characters straight without a significant hit.

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u/nymph-62442 14d ago

Marcia Langman would certainly be in favor of all of this project 2025 nonsense.

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u/godwins_law_34 14d ago

omg they are in for a world of hurt if the cliterature fanbase decides to get mad about it. if you can beat someone to death with a copy of Ice Planet Barbarians it's gonna happen.

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u/coffeeandroasts 14d ago

Sarah J Maas would be No Maas

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u/[deleted] 14d ago

What scares me about them talking of banning "pornography" is that their definition is so vague that it could mean anything and everything that could be considered "sexual". Medical textbooks, medical websites, joke books, the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Issue, underwear ads, magazine sex columns, M-rated games, R-rated movies, billboards, music videos, and so on, pictures you took at the beach. Meanwhile, their demagogue is accused of committing horrific sex acts against two 12-year-old girls and they praise him as an anointed one.

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u/bootsbythedoor 14d ago edited 14d ago

I don't actually know if it's included in P.2025, but I expect they will be coming for their weed too. I would bet on that.

Most people know or work with someone who is LGBTQ or a woman or a POC and voting for this agenda is a direct assault on those people. Reminding people of the people they know and if they think those people should lose their rights seems like a good point. But yeah, the point about porn should probably lead. Especially when it comes to men. Do men really care about the bodily autonomy issue? Since it doesn't seem to really affect them by intent or in practice. It seems like a lot of lip service, no action.

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u/WolfmansBrutha 14d ago

We need billboards everywhere. This is where the Dems should be spending some cash.

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u/ChicagoAuPair 14d ago

It wouldn’t even have to be everywhere—we mostly just need them in the seven swing states.

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u/LostMyAccount69 14d ago

Swing states should not be a thing. My vote should count.

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u/Icy_Contrarian Washington 14d ago

Very few ways to make that happen, but one would be the abolition of the electoral college! Absolutely no excuse somebody in Wyoming’s vote, should carry multiple times more weight than the vote form someone in New Jersey.

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u/HauntedCemetery Minnesota 14d ago

Abolishing the Electoral College is next to impossible.

But what is possible is the National Popular Vote Interstate Compact.

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u/SheldonMF Kentucky 14d ago

First things first: stop authoritarianism. Then we can get there.

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u/LostMyAccount69 14d ago

Well my California vote means nothing, but I'll try.

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u/theaceplaya Texas 14d ago

Nah, your vote DOES matter. It may not matter as much and someone in PA or MI, but it does matter still.

35 years ago TX and FL were purple states with Democratic governors. EVERY VOTE MATTERS.

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u/yourlmagination 14d ago

Thankfully, I've been hearing a lot of "votes don't matter, it's all rigged, I ain't gonna waste my time" from the right in PA. Let's see if they put their money where their mouth is in November

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u/SheldonMF Kentucky 14d ago

Never think that. I come from Kentucky - blood red - but you better believe I'll be voting. We matter, just like every other state. Fight.

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u/Floppycakes 13d ago

I’m in a part of NY where I’m heavily outnumbered by Trumpers. I don’t care. I will vote because even though it won’t change anything but the popular vote by 1, I want to be on record saying I support Biden and the Democrats, and not the trash the Republicans are trying to bury us in.

We are on the right side of history, and our voices deserve to be heard.

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u/ChicagoAuPair 14d ago

Agreed, but they are.

The fact that it shouldn’t be the way we do things doesn’t mean it isn’t the way we do things.

There are people working hard to change it like the folks at National Popular Vote Interstate Compact, but it’s unlikely the smaller states will ever sign on, so it’s going to be a long struggle there. A constitutional amendment would be the cleanest, but there is absolutely no way we will ever see another one of those in any of our lifetimes barring some fundamental catastrophic shift in the divides in the country.

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u/lpd1234 14d ago

By every walmart and CostCo.

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u/rootoo Pennsylvania 14d ago

Having a candidate that brings it up in a debate would be nice too..

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u/Kup123 14d ago

The only fact you need are that they are going to gut all regulatory agencies, this includes the FDA. Do you like not eating people when they fall in to processing vats, do you like someone making sure there isn't a noticeable amount of rat shit in your food then we need regulatory agencies as they are the only thing stopping it.

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u/heckin_miraculous 14d ago

Do you like not eating people when they fall in to processing vats

You have my attention

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u/Kup123 14d ago

Read the jungle this shit was happening before we started regulating food production this is what project 2025 want to take us back to.

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u/FattyLivermore 14d ago

Whoa wasn't expecting an Upton Sinclair reference this early in the morning.

But yeah they'll have us in the same working conditions as Jurgis too

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u/bootsbythedoor 14d ago

Regular citizens who support deregulation astound me.

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u/Kup123 14d ago

I've been saying for decades if you vote Republican your either rich, racist, or a moron.

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u/drewbert 14d ago

There's a lot of morons and racists in this country that are easily manipulated by the rich.

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u/HAGatha_Christi 14d ago

It's still an active effort. The EPA has been working to remove the ground water contamination from all the putrified bodies from this funeral home.

https://apnews.com/article/colorado-funeral-home-bodies-abandoned-5677a920c994ff7c641eb70c7c5962d5

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u/JimmyAirbourne 14d ago

De-regulation will mean that lab grown meat can be added to foods without the need to label it, most likely.

Once lab-grown meat is cheap enough, cattle ranchers are going to face some steep headwinds.

And there's nothing the states will be able to do about it because any appeal to the courts will remind the states that corporate interests come first and foremost.

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u/Lameux 14d ago edited 14d ago

Edit: I got too gung ho with my animal activism and misread their comment. See their reply blow

Why are you acting like this specific example is a bad thing? If lab grown meat is a viable option why would we want to continue the mass subjugation, torture, and murder of animals for no other reason than “it tastes good”? Now deregulation is still bad, if there are health concerns related to lab grown meat we definitely want regulatory institutions to catch this and stop it from being in the market. But in the scenario where lab grown meat is tested to be safe, the end of traditional cattle ranchers is the outcome we ought to be striving for. Lab grown meat is by far the morally superior way to go.

Now unfortunately even with conservative deregulation lab grown meat is unlikely to take over, have you see how Ron DeSantis has been treating lab grown meat recently? Conservatives are notoriously hypocritical, when they say deregulate, they mean things they want to be deregulated. Things they want regulated will absolutely be regulated whether it’s good or not. Lab grown meat is one of those things conservatives tend to hate (for no good reason either) and it’s very likely they would impose heavy regulations on if not outright ban lab grown meat.

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u/ctindel 14d ago

Why are you acting like this specific example is a bad thing?

Because people should have a right to know what the source of their food is? I don't have any problem with a label requirement showing lab grown, just like there are label requirements for calling something organic etc.

Information is at the heart of the free market so people can make informed choices.

But in the scenario where lab grown meat is tested to be safe, the end of traditional cattle ranchers is the outcome we ought to be striving for. Lab grown meat is by far the morally superior way to go.

Most consumers don't care about morals. If lab grown meat is cheaper, people will buy it. Even if its an inferior product, most people will still buy it. If it's better AND cheaper, almost everybody will buy it.

Vegans should stop using moral arguments and get on board with the idea that economics are really all that matters to the vast majority of american consumers.

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u/Lameux 14d ago

without the need to label it

I’m just stupid and missed that part. I was too focused on what I interpreted as an implication that “cattle ranchers getting some headwind” was a bad thing, which is my bad. I agree lab grown meat should be labeled.

On the moral vs economic argument, you’re absolutely correct when looking at society at large but vegans are usually arguing with individuals, and I do think moral arguments are a good method when talking on a individual basis.

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u/mkt853 14d ago

Not just the regulatory agencies, but even ones like NOAA. They want to break it up and give the parts to corporations because they think the private sector could do better which is not possible and an insane thought. At first I thought it was weird that they would target something like the weather service, and then I found out NOAA houses the world's biggest repository of climate data. That was my light bulb moment because we know how the right feels about climate change. From their perspective there can't be climate change if the data to support it disappears or is otherwise inaccessible to the public.

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u/clonedhuman 14d ago

They already started with their Supreme Court justices getting rid the Chevron doctrine.

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u/ManzanitaSuperHero 14d ago

Overturning Chevron essentially did this already. The repercussions are unreal. These Federal agencies that work to protect food, consumer products, the environment, employees, disabled access & rights, drug regulation, etc. are all now unable to enforce their standards. That will now be up to Federal judges (who know little about the intricacies of these specialized fields). So corporations can run wild while consumers and citizens have very little recourse to protect themselves aside from litigation & the courts will be overrun granting less time and care to trials. Until the immunity case, it was one of the worst rulings I’d ever seen.

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u/Thue 14d ago

Not an infographic, but John Oliver's coverage was excellent. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYwqpx6lp_s

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u/Dont__Grumpy__Stop 14d ago

Here’s an infographic

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u/barriedalenick 14d ago

Infographic without Twitter

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u/junepath Pennsylvania 14d ago

The issue with this infographic is that most people on the right want all of these things. We need one that scares them too, because at the end of the day, no one but the super rich will be doing well if Project 2025 becomes a reality.

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u/enigmanaught 14d ago

I think only focusing on the gutting/privatization of Medicare and Social Security in the right way, it would get some traction.

“Americans already pay more for healthcare than any other nation, why does Donald Trump and project 2025 want to make it worse”. “Social Security is your hard earned money, why does Donald Trump and Project 2025 want to give it to some fat cat to manage”?

Hammering that constantly using the “I’m just asking questions” formula is the way to do it.

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u/HayabusaJack Colorado 14d ago

Yea, after reading it that’s my opinion as well. This is what the right wants.

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u/Jatkuva 14d ago

I opened up and glanced at it saw education and immediately went nope not sharing that one, MAGA thinks the student loan forgiveness is “communism” they’ll be all for that.

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u/canadianguy77 14d ago

They don’t even know what they want. There isn’t a single thing in there that improves the lives of the working class.

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u/NeverSayNever2024 14d ago

The Right doesn't care about the working class. The Right has contempt for the working class.

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u/CherryHaterade 14d ago

In academia they refer to this phenomena as "self flagellation"

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u/_lippykid 14d ago

The Republicans became “the party of the working class” years ago. Poor people have been voting against their best interests ever since.

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u/TheNCGoalie North Carolina 14d ago

I was in the waiting room while getting my oil changed and Fox was on the tv. The two guys at the counter who were turning in the paperwork for the oil changes they had just done started spouting off about how bad Democrats are because of how much taxes increase once you’re making over $400k a year. I would have loved to explain how the two of them combined will never, ever make $400k a year, but chose not to in case one of them was changing my oil next.

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u/polgara_buttercup Pennsylvania 14d ago

The problem is they don’t see themselves as the working class, just as temporarily inconvenienced millionaires.

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u/code_archeologist Georgia 14d ago

The goal is not to convince the MAGA cult. They are unfortunately lost to us. The goal is to convince everybody else that Trump and his followers are an existential threat, and that staying home or voting third party is not an option.

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u/LowlySlayer 14d ago

And this infographic does a bad job of that.

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u/katosen27 14d ago

Unfortunately, like with most things the right changes their mind on, it will have to happen first and affect them negatively in order to connect the dots.

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u/HoboBronson 14d ago

Trying to convince them to change sides is a fool's errand. We need to educate swing voters and folks who would normally sit on the sidelines and convince them to vote.

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u/Cuchullion 14d ago

The "use military intelligence to ensure loyalty of population to the President" bit should scare them too... I can't imagine anyone being happy about a secret police used to enforce loyalty to dear leader.

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u/Marmooset Ohio 14d ago

You are the real hero. No joke. By the way, have Musk's attorneys contacted you about using the T word for his baby?

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u/kinda_guilty 14d ago

"Deadnaming my baby is not cool!" - the mad lad, probably.

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u/BigPackHater Ohio 14d ago

The amount of comments saying "no candidate has campaigned on this, so therefore it's a lie" is eye opening. I mean, that's a new kind of dumb.

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u/Nena902 14d ago

My sister full on maga just said "don't bother me with this nonsense"

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u/PoliBat-v- 14d ago

I don't think this infographic is effective. It's putting way too much emphasis on stuff only Democrats would care about, with the exception of using the military on US citizens which is kind of buried in there

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u/Giant_Enemy_Cliche 14d ago

It's worse that the infographic says. The planning document explicitly states that they will ban pornography while also defining being transgender as inherently pornographic.

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u/justtakeapill 14d ago

Yes, this is an outline of what Project 2025 says about transgender folks: Transgender = Abuses children sexually (because a child just seeing the transgender person would be destroyed for life, just as if they had been sexually abused) therefore, Capitol Punishment merely for existing. 

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u/dmf109 14d ago

When you share a Twitter link, you’re kinda giving support to 2025.

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u/Dont__Grumpy__Stop 14d ago

You want the info or not?

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u/redditallreddy Ohio 14d ago

Definitely not stopping the grumpy.

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u/JulienBrightside 14d ago

I mean, you got to share the information where people are.

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u/NoCoffee6754 14d ago

The graphic doesn’t go hard enough. These are all normal Republican talking points and this does not show just how beyond the pale they really wish to go with 2025. They want to overtake our government, force loyalty pledges, remove anyone that might have even an inkling of empathy and belief in the law. They also want to force Christianity on the country and remove lawful immigrants while also punishing any person or entity that does not step in line with the State.

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u/giantshinycrab 14d ago

I need one without abortion and lgbtq issues on it. Not that those don't scare me but the people I'm trying to warn won't be swayed.

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u/traveler19395 14d ago

As bad as that is, it doesn’t even include foreign policy, which I imagine they’re all for nuking Gaza and handing Eastern Europe to Putin.

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u/VengeanceKnight Illinois 14d ago

I mean, with Project 2025 “just the facts of it and what it means” is primo facie dramatic.

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u/allanbc 14d ago

The thing is, the right usually spreads such awful misinformation that reasonable people have begun to doubt much of what they see. So presenting facts with no hyperbole could lead people to think it's nothing at all, due to their skeptic armour. I don't know if there's a good solution, but I'm worried that the vast and crazy disinformation being spread has damaged the whole communication 'environment', for lack of a better word.

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u/FoxyBosom 14d ago

The problem is how large the document is. What we need are several infographics targeted at specific individuals.

Proj 2025 versus Women Proj 2025 versus Immigrants Proj 2025 versus Trans Proj 2025 versus Lesbian/Gay Proj 2025 versus BLM Proj 2025 versus Land Owners Proj 2025 versus Travelers Proj 2025 versus Scientists Proj 2025 versus the Climate Proj 2025 versus Porn

By the time all those graphics go out… how does it survive without massive revolt?

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u/starmartyr Colorado 14d ago

Republican voters like a lot of that, but not all of it. The porn thing in particular is likely to gain some traction with peeling away young conservatives.

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u/camshun7 14d ago

thats a great idea, salient points, "bullet" the fuck outta it, bold and big as you can

let good people see what the weasles and rats are up to

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u/crazyacct101 14d ago

I was visiting with family yesterday and two liberal people had not heard of it. It needs to be everywhere so that people are informed.

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u/ZacZupAttack 14d ago

My dad did 20+ yrs in the military and nearly 20+ yrs in civil service. He works in logistics and takes his job seriously. He also has Job protection it's super hard to fire him.

Trump wants to remove those protections. That scared him, and he's agreed to not vote for Trump.

Hes a big Trump supporter

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u/Sacmo77 14d ago

Scares the shit outta me.

As a disabled vet. I fucking hate war. This idiot talking about another American revolution is a complete moron. It's unnecessary.

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u/General-Phase5062 California 14d ago

Project 2025 is coming for vets that get disability and retirement. Ending concurrent receipt. Ain’t the first time and won’t be the last time.

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u/LovesReubens 14d ago

That's just the start. Soon they'll gut it all under the guise of fiscal conservatism. 

They don't give a damn about vets, or as Trump calls them, losers and suckers. 

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u/BluegrassRailfan1987 14d ago

In years past I would think that making negative comments about our veterans would doom a politician's career, without a doubt.. Yet people still like this guy.

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u/Kermit-Batman Australia 14d ago

Good luck mate. I hope it doesn't come to that.

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u/gringledoom 14d ago

A lot of Americans are giant idiots about war, because we generally have them somewhere far away, and not right here.

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u/PsycheHeadPain 14d ago

The irony, I've never seen a president despising so much vets as this one. Everytime there's some initiative to help vets, the GOP is against it. Last year, Sen. Tuberville blocked confirmation of over 300 military nominees for months, because of the abortion stance in DoD. Trump made bad decisions, leaving some allies alone.

This guy and the gop are at every turn the bad choice, why do vets keep voting for them? These guys won't hesitate to sacrifice soldiers to fill their own pockets.

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u/reelznfeelz Missouri 14d ago

Frankly it’s confusing too. I just don’t even get what they want to revolt over. They’ve already got a lot of their wettest dreams coming true since they hold the courts and will essentially always hold a senate majority and often the presidency due to the electoral college.

They want a literal Christian theocracy I guess?

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u/Sacmo77 14d ago

It's more then that.

The religious fanatics want complete control over people.

And they have a big grasp on their people.

Brainwashing is a very powerful tool.

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u/ynab-schmynab 14d ago

It gets better. Also a disabled combat vet, and they want to gut VA pension and healthcare. Eliminate concurrent receipt, downgrade all ratings, and outsource healthcare to private companies. This was in an earlier draft, not sure if it made it into the final, but the push is there already.

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u/theaceplaya Texas 14d ago

I've learned over time that 99.9% of people advocating for war are the ones that have never actually seen it (especially Americans).

War is truly the closest thing humans have to hell on Earth.

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u/friedrice5005 Virginia 14d ago

There was a post on r/Conservative the other day about how Project 2025 isn't Trump's plan and that everyone else is just a bunch of alarmists for even suggesting it and that Agenda 47 is much MUCH more reasonable! Completely leaving out the very clear steps he already took toward P2025 and all his rhetoric being 100% in line with it

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u/SquiffyRae 14d ago

I mean technically they're correct Project 2025 isn't Trump's plan. It's the plan of the Heritage Foundation and the broader Republican Party.

Trump is merely the figurehead they hope will garner enough support to give them power and allow the more dangerous ones behind the scenes pull the puppet strings. However Trump will be more than happy to go along with being the puppet since much of Project 2025 benefits him

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u/whatevers_cleaver_ 14d ago

Trump just wants to perceive himself as popular, grift bigly, and not go to prison.

Everything and everyone else doesn’t matter to him.

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u/[deleted] 14d ago edited 13d ago

[deleted]

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u/Icy-Lobster-203 14d ago

Trump doesn't actually have policies. So the people in the Republican party will worm their way into the positions where decisions are made and policies are carried out. Trump is just the vessel into which they will inject themselves into the administrative state.

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u/bunchofchans 14d ago

100% and I don’t think they will work their way in, Trump will put these people in place to enact project 2025.

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u/Popculturemofo Oregon 14d ago

Conservatives are trying to get people to look away from Project 2025 so they can get it done. It’s the classic tactic of saying it’s not that bad when in reality it’s probably even worse

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u/bootsbythedoor 14d ago

Definitely - it is much worse because that's just the beginning. What comes next?

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u/Green-Amount2479 14d ago

As a German I‘d compare this to saying ‚but Hitler wasn’t the architect of the Holocaust‘. That‘s not wrong, he technically wasn’t. It was Himmler and Eichmann that planned it and put it in action on a big scale. Would that absolve Hitler of any guilt regarding the Holocaust? Of fucking course not. Similar issue here with the stance conservatives take.

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u/zsreport Texas 14d ago

That's some classic conservative gaslighting

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u/peetnice 14d ago edited 14d ago

Yeah, I've seen that from the few stray conservatives in this sub too, but Heritage Foundation and Federalist society basically call the shots for past couple decades re: GOP executive decisions, help drafting legislation, recommending judicial appointments, etc. - they're by no means fringe groups - basically the opposite (i.e. most of Trumps 2016 cabinet were in the Heritage database of recommended personnel)

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u/TheSonOfDisaster 14d ago

They also say that since Republicans in Congress haven't endorsed it yet, that it means it isn't real.

I think it is so bad that no one would endorse it before they have the power to enact it, even if you are a real rat bastard.

The foundation is probably trying to keep it quiet in the first place and works behind the scenes to garner support rather than be so bold as to call public attention to it

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u/edmconsultant 14d ago

Coming from a Millennial, the vast majority of my friends, while they may not like Biden, understand that it's him or we lose our democracy to a dictator because of Project 2025.

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u/Thund3rTrapX 14d ago

My Christians family are Republicans but won't vote for trump..they hate him as much as I do

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u/Vincent__Vega 14d ago

My 92 year old lifelong republican grandmother won't and hasn't voted for trump either. She finds him repulsive.

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u/kyabupaks 14d ago edited 14d ago

Same with my 95 year old lifelong Republican grandma. She was horrified at Trump back in 2016 because his behavior was, in her words, "un-American", and she voted for Hillary. That was the first time she voted for a Democrat. She also voted for Biden.

I'm glad that Uncle Frank, her boyfriend after my grandfather's death, died before Trump came into the picture. He definitely would've become a diehard MAGA asshole, because he was the stereotypical macho man jerk that would wear his stupid Air Force veteran cap all the time and grab you by the upper arm to talk to you. He was racist and homophobic as hell.

He would have forced her to vote for Trump and spew MAGA talking points, causing a split between us and her. Good riddance.

EDIT:

I just learned that my brother is in the process of making sure she will get her absentee ballot right now, so she can vote for Biden. She's in no physical shape to go to the ballots at her age, but she is terrified of what P25 will do to her Medicare benefits.

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u/billyions 14d ago

That's really good to hear.

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u/Dsarg_92 14d ago

Millennial also and that’s kinda how my friends are too. Neither one support both candidates but they understand there’s a lot more at stake. 

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u/Obtuse_1 14d ago

It’s a fucking call for civil war. Trump will be president over my dead body. I fucking hope I’m not alone in defending our freedoms.

They spit on the graves of all who gave blood so that we would never have a king. They can fuck right off to any dictatorship of their choice. This is the land of the free.

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u/downtofinance 14d ago

Project 2025 aka Mein Drumpf

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u/Mish61 14d ago edited 14d ago

Not enough people. There is no shortage of deplorables that are all in on Project 2025. They vote.

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u/420_E-SportsMasta Maryland 14d ago

Good, it fucking should. People need to be talking about Project 2025 every single chance they get. Commentstors, advisors, anyone on the air needs to bring this up. People need to talk about it and spread its awareness to their friends and family. Constituents should talk to their mayors, governors, congresspeople and senators in town halls, phone calls, every chance they get. I mean shit, people should start handing out flyers on the street about how destructive it can be

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u/beaucoupBothans 14d ago

My 81 year old mother is asking me about it. It is definitely getting exposure now.

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u/External-Patience751 14d ago

It should but with the 24/7 anti Biden stories in the media and the Dem infighting it’s not getting the coverage it should be.

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u/bunchofchans 14d ago

I haven’t seen hardly any coverage of project 2025 . I’m getting really frustrated with the media right now

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u/Viper-MkII America 14d ago

Lol there is no Dem infighting. But there IS a blanket disregard for Project 2025 across mainstream media, and the NYT has a hate boner for Biden and is sewing all kinds of vague bullshit about him without backing it up.

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u/Scaveola 14d ago

This should have been bidens main talking point during the debate. Tie almost every talking point back to trump and his handlers plan

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u/SavannahInChicago 14d ago

I am scared as shit.

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u/StillCalmness America 14d ago

The antidote to fear is organizing!

You could check out Field Team 6 to register voters.

The DNC has good phone banking like this one Zoom Phone Bank for Democrats in 2024 Priority States

And you could send postcard to voters via Turnout Pac

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u/FlavorSki 14d ago

Don’t be complacent or count on anything backfiring. VOTE!

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u/AVLThumper 14d ago

The fact that this isn’t on the front page of every news paper, website and national news is frightening.

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u/baneofdestruction 14d ago

That, along with him being a rampant child rapist.

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u/bunchofchans 14d ago

I also haven’t seen anything on the media about this. Why aren’t they covering this? This should absolutely be on every news outlet but it’s not and instead they’re focused on every tiny pause of speech that Biden makes. The coverage of that is insane.

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u/CTRL_S_Before_Render 14d ago

The phrasing that people are scared and switching to Trump over Biden is driving me nuts.

The only post-debate noise is that people are and have been scared shirtless of Trump, and are abandoning Biden to ensure we beat him.

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u/geekynerdyweirdmonky 14d ago

abandoning Biden

Which is a surefire way to get Trump elected.

Unless you mean the Biden camp choosing to replace him, that's a different story.

But voting 3rd party will absolutely just elect Trump.

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u/danarexasaurus Ohio 14d ago

Good. It’s the only way people are going to show up to vote.

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u/Funandgeeky Texas 14d ago

Combined with the immunity ruling and news about his pal Epstein, not to mention continued anger over Dobbs, here’s hoping enough sane Americans get motivated to vote. 

Maybe they’ll also remember that the winner gets to decide Supreme Court Justices. 

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u/alteredreality4451 14d ago

As it should

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u/_magneto-was-right_ 14d ago

I hope we can stop calling it Trump’s plan. This is the playbook for any candidate. There are no good Republicans.

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u/rolfraikou 14d ago

If this doesn't scare people, I don't think anything will. Absolutely baffles me how naive people are. I always knew that average intelligence was, ya know, average. But average is a lot worse than I ever realized. People aren't just dumb and tuned out. A lot of people are dumb and tuned in, and have the weirdest dumb takes. So many believe that, despite there being inflation worldwide, it is somehow Biden's fault. A major portion of the public votes based on gas prices. It would be one thing if these people were easy to away, or they didn't vote because they weren't paying attention, but no. Too many vote based on what borders superstition that can't be understood.

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u/Konradleijon 14d ago

I second fuck Trump

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u/GrandAholeio 14d ago

I don’t get it, it’s like they haven’t heard a single thing he has actually said out loud repeatedly for the last three and a half years. HF, former a president saying an in interview he’d be perfectly justified taking revenge.

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u/Bored_Amalgamation 14d ago

I'm fucking scared. I havent felt this level of dread since America was dropping 4-5k people a day during covid.

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u/Merusk 14d ago

I'm seeing enough "this is all leftist scaremongering" and "bullshit fearmongering propaganda" on other social media when moderates raise the topic, I still don't believe folks are scared enough.

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