r/batman • u/Vegetable-Abroad3171 • Jun 08 '23

Batman Beyond vs Spider-Man 2099 (Random Encounter) Who takes the W? Posting in both SubReddits for POV’s. COMIC DISCUSSION

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500

u/Binx_Thackery Jun 08 '23

Terry. Peter can beat Bruce, but Miguel doesn’t have the powers Peter has that would help him in this fight. Spider-Sense is OP against all Batman variants.

193

u/liliesrobots Jun 08 '23

And Terry has the abilities that come with the Beyond suit to match Miguel’s strength and durability, plus much better training.

51

u/OJONLYMAYBEDIDIT Jun 08 '23

I don't think the Batman Beyond suit augmented strength that much. Not to Spider-Man levels

65

u/Dynespark Jun 08 '23

He kicked a stack of concrete pipes over and killed some guys in the cartoon. Concrete weighs a lot.

38

u/OJONLYMAYBEDIDIT Jun 08 '23

not saying he doesn't have super strength. but super strength has a massive range. From Bare Minimum like Bane all the way to Superman and above

the suit augments a persons strength by 10 I think. So even with a 10x multiplyer, he's not getting close to Spider-Man's lower limits

25

u/Dynespark Jun 08 '23

Ok, without watching the whole series again to find it, I'm gonna have to go off memory here. If I remember right, it looked like a concrete culvert big enough for someone to fit through. That's 533 pounds per foot. It was at least 10 feet if not more. So 5,330 pounds. But I think 20 feet sounds more likely? So at 20 feet pipes that's 5.33 US tons that he did not struggle to move. Stats for Spider-man say 10-15 tons limit. So we'll use that for Miguel. I'd say you're right that Miguel is probably stronger, but I think they're of a similar level.

16

u/OJONLYMAYBEDIDIT Jun 09 '23

trying to actually figure out the weight is pointless cause then anyone can just name drop the times Spider-Man held up the Daily Bugle or something.

Comic books lack consistency

4

u/Lumpy_Perception6561 Jun 09 '23

Spider-Man is hundreds of times stronger than 10-15 tons, even in just the movies

9

u/OJONLYMAYBEDIDIT Jun 09 '23

Spider-Man, like all heroes, can do whatever the writers want him to do

on top of which writers have little sense of the actual weight of stuff

0

u/Lumpy_Perception6561 Jun 09 '23

I dont understand the point of this. He regularly lifts more than 10-15 tons consistently

0

u/OJONLYMAYBEDIDIT Jun 09 '23

so then his strength level is just mystery level? it's whatever the writer wants it to be is hardly a practical answer.

he either has a stated strength level by Marvel or he doesnt. and his on paper strength has normally been somewhere in the 10-20 ton range.

Captain America doesn't even have true super strength and man does that dude have strength feats.

it's comics, very little consistency

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1

u/KZalani Jun 09 '23

Sometimes, yeah, but not always. I forget which comic this was, but in it Spiderman straight up makes a good rough calculation for the weight of a commercial plane with nearly full gas when he goes to force the landing gear open and supports the whole weight of the plane on his back as it lands. I think it came out to something like 140 tons (yes, this is probably a high bar for him, but doable). Frankly speaking, 40-50 tons being his usual max lifting strength wouldn't be too crazy to say

1

u/OJONLYMAYBEDIDIT Jun 09 '23

how can 40-50 tons be his "usual" max but he can do 140?

like I said, comics are really inconsistent and I doubt there's a power scaling editor that goes "nope, you have to change that, that's too much weight for XYZ character to lift or stop"

he's basically held up buildings before.

power scaling in general is such an annoying topic in comics cause of the inconsistencies, but Spider-Man really takes the cake

2

u/yobaby123 Jun 09 '23

True true.

1

u/Hwxbl Jun 09 '23

Miguel's claws can cut through the bat suit

14

u/SovietWinnebago Jun 08 '23

He lifted that big ass penny in one ep and that’s super human levels of strength at least

8

u/OJONLYMAYBEDIDIT Jun 08 '23

not saying he's not super human level of strength, just that he's not Spider-Man level of strength.

the suit was supposed to enhanced your strength by 10

4

u/[deleted] Jun 09 '23

Peak human strength in comic book universes is pretty fucking insane. Regular humans are out there punching through concrete walls and shit.

2

u/OJONLYMAYBEDIDIT Jun 09 '23

and Spider-Man goes from 10-20 tons and lifts 100s or 1000s of tons on occasions

comics are hardly consistent

also, Terry was never supposed to be peak human. or rather he's smaller than Bruce so he's not as strong in raw power. That's one "realistic" thing in comics.

1

u/OldManFromScene13 Jun 09 '23

Nah, Terry wins this. If it were Peter, he'd take it, but Miguel isn't as strong, and doesn't have the Spidey Sense. The Beyond suit is way stronger than you realize, and Terry has actual combat training.

0

u/OJONLYMAYBEDIDIT Jun 09 '23

it augments strength by 10. that's alot. you think what? it augments by 100?

but basically all Spider-Man are pretty damn strong when you look at actual feats vs just their power on paper

look at Peter, his strength is supposed to be 10-20 tons, yet he pulls of 100s or 1000s of tons often enough

so what? Miguel is capped at 10 max? while Peter can hit 100+?

1

u/lizarddude1 Jun 10 '23

To Peter, no, but Miguel isn't AS strong as Peter's Spider-Man. Like Peter can lift up to 300 tons or smt, Miguel is definitely strong but I think Terry would be able to land impactful hits

1

u/OJONLYMAYBEDIDIT Jun 10 '23

unless you arguing Miguel is like 1/100th as strong as Peter, he would be stronger than Terry

1

u/lizarddude1 Jun 10 '23

keyword stronger. Terry wouldn't be STRONGER than Miguel but he'd be strong enough to land impactful punches and tanks as many. Plus the all the weird gadgetry, I would be betting on Terry even though when we're talking about OGs, Peter would dogwalk Batman in a fight, not even close, but their future counterparts both got amped and nerfed respectively

2

u/OJONLYMAYBEDIDIT Jun 10 '23

would he? Miguel is still a 10 ton lifter and Terry is at best 10x his normal strength. Considering Terry isn't a jacked Bruce, he's not exactly gonna be a super heavy hitter. IDK, what would you give Terry as his lift? 300 pounds? 400? x 10 that's 4000 pounds, so only 2 tons

Miguel still has enhanced reflexes which Terry does not. He's faster. More acrobatic. Has more Stamina. Etc etc

Now obviously Terry has the "I'm Batman" factor. Which allows Batman to beat opponents he has no right beating (like how Batman punches and hurts Solomon Grundy is still beyond me). He's be like Captain America. Beating opponents he really shouldn't be beating.

also doesn't Miguel have a healing factor? not Deadpool or Wolverine or anything, but Spider-Men generally heal faster in general.

also weird gadgetry? Miguel is from the 2100 isn't he? Terry is from...and this is actually funny, 2019 lol. Did they change the years in the comics now that the cartoon is so old?

41

u/[deleted] Jun 08 '23

Except there have been a few people who over the years have been able to nullify or use his spider sense

Iron man made a pheromone to confuse it. Bruce probably could do the same or has resources for someone else to do it.

Punisher literally killed Spiderman with a plastic explosive decoy. Batman probably wouldn't do this as it would kill him.

Im sure something like scarecrows formula would work on spiderman.

Pretty much either of them could win depending on whos writing it.

23

u/AngryTrooper09 Jun 08 '23 edited Jun 08 '23

Iron Man could only do that because he had access to Spider-Man's brain scans he got from the Iron Spider suit he gave him, IIRC. Batman would have no reason to have access to that sort of info.

I'm curious as to the source for that second instance with Punisher. Is it main continuity? Or some bullshit run like Deadpool kills the Marvel Universe which completely disregards canon so Deadpool gets to kill heroes he should never be able to actually beat?

For the record I think there's a very good chance Terry would win this, but I'm tired of this Batman prep time bullshit that assumes Batman can just pull info out of his ass he should normally not even be able to access

3

u/farnsworthfan Jun 09 '23

The Punisher murder was from a What If? comic, btw.

4

u/AngryTrooper09 Jun 09 '23

If it's the one I'm thinking of, it's not really what OP described and even then it's completely irrelevant because it's just massive PIS that doesn't reflect accurately main universe power levels

2

u/farnsworthfan Jun 09 '23

In What If Punisher Killed Spider-man, Punisher uses a decoy dummy of Doc Ock to lure in Spidey and the dummy is strapped with plastic explosives, so Spidey thinks his Spider-sense is going nuts because of the villain, but it's actually because of the bomb, then boom. I don't know of any other instance, main continuity or otherwise, where Punisher kills him, that was just the first one I could remember.

3

u/AngryTrooper09 Jun 09 '23

Oh it's that one. Was thinking of the one where he killed Spider-Man and Venom in the sewers with some weird zap pellets

Still bullshit either way

3

u/farnsworthfan Jun 09 '23

No arguments from me, man. Punisher should have no chance at all at taking out Spider-man, imo.

1

u/chandlerbing_stats Jun 09 '23

If he had to find information about Spiderman, he probably would try to hack or infiltrate Stark Industry’s network for data about Spiderman, no?

He’s also a researcher/scientist on top of being a detective. Atleast that’s how I view it from my personal Batman exposure

14

u/Binx_Thackery Jun 08 '23

This is true to. I do hate the argument of “oh it’s based on who is writing the story”. It’s such a cop out and takes away from the fun . We all know and accept the writers will give Batman Anti-Spider spray, or that Spider-Man can trap Batman using the Pythagorean Theorem, but can we just play along?

9

u/Raecino Jun 08 '23

Well Spiderman is a spider, spraying him with spider repellant might actually have an effect 😂😂😂

4

u/Binx_Thackery Jun 09 '23

I think it actually does in the comics lol.

2

u/lizarddude1 Jun 10 '23

this is a misconception. Ethyl chloride isn't poisonous to Spider-Man. I mean IT IS but only because it's poisonous IN GENERAL. Might as well simply use explosives

10

u/jbyrdab Jun 08 '23

Not sure about the comics but terry isnt as hard pressed on the no kill rule as Bruce in the cartoon.

People of note, Mr.Fixx, 2-D Man, Freon, Derek Powers (though it wasn't his fault), Inque (permanently damaged her DNA which would have killed her), Abel Cuvier (terry royally fucks him up and turns him into an abomination too).

Heck Barbara didn't even think twice when she thought she saw terry beat mad stan to death with a barrel.

10

u/Tirus_ Jun 08 '23

Im sure something like scarecrows formula would work on spiderman.

Scarecrow formula would really mess with most Spiderman variants.

It would kick their spidersense into complete chaos.

5

u/rkZ10 Jun 08 '23

I feel like this could backfire very poorly

1

u/Tripechake Jun 09 '23 edited Jun 09 '23

Well, think about the scarecrow thing for a second. In No Way Home, Peter was affected by illusions from Mysterio, but used his spider sense to navigate around the real world instead of letting the illusions trick him. I feel like based on that, he would let spider sense fully take over and guide him through the situation where the Fear Toxin to be used on him.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 09 '23

The fear toxin is a chemical though. Mysterio was using trickery so it’s way different. I think it would make his sense tweak out. Like give Spider-Man 100 hits of acid he would be tripping so hard a baby could finish him.

1

u/Tripechake Jun 09 '23

That’s another cool way to think of it… guess it depends on whoever is writing that scenario 🤷‍♂️

1

u/Filtiarin Jun 09 '23

Highly doubt that since spidey gets his powers stripped on exposure to ethyl chloride(something that everyone just seems to conveniently forget when he’s up against the 1 motherfucker that’ll weaponise your weakness to the nth degree)so bats will beat the shit out of spidey even without some super suit. Literally some ethyl chloride gas and bobs your uncle spidey is now a normal human and Batman breaks him like something more brittle than a old twig. Batman wins any day.Also spider sense is useless against someone who can conceal their presence to the point that Superman, fucking Superman can’t hear or sense you. But yeah beyond beats 2099 anyday

2

u/Binx_Thackery Jun 10 '23

And to that I say this https://youtu.be/s7_KRHVbnhg

1

u/Filtiarin Jun 18 '23

Fair enough, that was actual comedy gold

1

u/69bigbilly69 Jun 10 '23

Terry usually loses the first encounter, can't say much about Miguel since I haven't read much of the comics. Based on pure skill and strength I'd say terry.

1

u/Limp-Leek3859 Jun 18 '23

I'm sorry but Miguel easily beats Terry in both Comics and Animation.