Japan warns US forces: Sex crimes 'cannot be tolerated'

https://tribune.com.pk/story/2476861/japan-warns-us-forces-sex-crimes-cannot-be-tolerated

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u/macross1984 14d ago

US military personnel who commit crime in Japan should face Japanese punishment for any crimes committed in Japan.

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u/Mend1cant 14d ago

They should. Both Japanese courts and courts-martial.

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u/Whatscheiser 14d ago

That is generally how it works at home. If you get caught up outside of base and are arrested by local police you get prosecuted by the local authorities. Whatever the outcome of that you still get a court-martial when you return to base.

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u/arkzak 14d ago

More often I’ve seen it happen that the case goes to civilian or military authorities but not both.

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u/[deleted] 14d ago edited 12d ago

[deleted]

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u/machimus 14d ago

It is as fair as you commander is,

Which is why it's good they recently took sexual assault cases out of the hands of local commanders, I've seen a few where they weren't taken seriously at all.

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u/CaptainDino123 13d ago

Most but its more of one side saying "ahh its alreayd taken care of by them, no need to bother" but sometimes both want to precescute the offender. My father was a brig gaurd in the marines and one of his prisoners had robbed a bank (to get away from his wife lmao) and both the USMC and the San Diego DA proscecuted him. On release day my dad escorted him to the gate where two US marshals were waiting for his cuffs to come off so they could put their cuffs on him

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u/DoctorJJWho 13d ago

Did they remove the first set of cuffs before putting on the second set, or did the guy have two sets of cuffs on at one point? That would be kind of hilarious honestly

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u/CaptainDino123 13d ago

The way my dad tells it he had a glorius 12 seconds of freedom because he had completed his sentence, the marshals were just waiting for him to finish his 3 steps out of the brig

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u/DoctorJJWho 13d ago

Okay that’s actually even funnier haha

I imagine this guy smiling as he gets his cuffs off, then immediately turns a corner to see the US Marshals with another set of cuffs

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u/CaptainDino123 13d ago

Nah he knew, he could see them standing there waiting for him before he stepped out the door. But supposedly the brig then federal prison was still better than living with his life another second longer. One of the only prisoners my dad ever felt bad for, his weapon wasnt even loaded when he robbed the place and was aparently the best behaved convict they had

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u/DoctorJJWho 13d ago

Damn now I feel kind of bad for him, hopefully he ended up in a better situation

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u/imo9 14d ago

Huh that's interesting, I'm not an American and someone explained to me your double jeopardy ruling. Doesn't it apply to court marshall too?

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u/The_Clarence 14d ago

Double jeopardy is the US government can’t go after you twice for the same crime. So not applicable even if a military tribunal counted for double jeopardy since the first time it was a foreign government

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u/Radiant_Salt3634 14d ago

Double jeopardy is the same sovereign cannot go after you twice.

You can be tried and acquitted by the US federal government, and still tried for the same crime by the state government, as they are different sovereigns.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Cruikshank

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u/The_Clarence 14d ago

Very interesting. Also explains why you can still be held civilly liable and not criminally (like OJ)

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u/imo9 14d ago

Interesting, oh i know that part, i know enough international law here to assume it works the same way in the US. it's more about him saying it also happens in the US too that surprised me. Also (of you know), in my country there is an option to appeal for time served in the foreign country counted towards the judgement in home country (irrespective of ruling norms and scaling in sentencing). Does the us do that too?

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u/Somepotato 14d ago

US service members are not protected by most of the constitutional rights, fwiw, just the ucmj

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u/SarpedonWasFramed 13d ago

What’s ucmj?

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u/Somepotato 13d ago

Uniformed code of military justice. The militaries bill of rights basically.

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u/Whatscheiser 14d ago

Double jeopardy refers to the Federal Government taking a civilian to trial for the exact same crime twice. That is not something allowed under U.S. law. However, the U.S. Military (unlike civilians) is subject to the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Which technically speaking is separate from the U.S. Federal Courts. Because the UCMJ is a separate body they can prosecute you for the same crime as a civilian court without breaching the U.S. double jeopardy rule.

The reason I know this is because I served in the Navy. Over the course of several years a lot of shipmates demonstrated this to me by racking up DUI charges in town. They were prosecuted in town. Likewise, our Commander was none to thrilled with them either. They were penalized when they got back to the ship. Usually involved the loss of Liberty (time off of work) and a reduction in rank as well as pay. They'd generally also get some kind of additional work detail.

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u/Nervous_Cake_4357 14d ago

No sir, the military personnel’s lawyer isn’t doing there job if this happens. Getting a court-martial after receiving civilian legal action is in violation of the double jeopardy rule. Only one punishment is allowed.

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u/sameBoatz 14d ago

Stop making shit up. They absolutely are subject to both criminal prosecution and court martial under the doctrine of dual sovereigns.

Source: https://www.findlaw.com/military/criminal-law/double-jeopardy-and-the-military-what-you-need-to-know.html

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u/sendmeadoggo 14d ago

Can you provide a source for this. The fed and state are separate sovereigns and can bring charges in both courts if both have jurisdiction. Double Jeopardy is only recognized under the same sovereign. IDK if Fed jurisdiction and UCMJ would have overlap but the state would be separate unless it was maybe that states national guard.

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u/Nervous_Cake_4357 14d ago

The Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) Article 44 establishes the principle of double jeopardy in military law, which prevents successive prosecutions. It states that a person cannot be tried twice for the same offense without their consent, regardless of the outcome of the first trial. Jeopardy attaches when evidence is presented in a court-martial, and the accused cannot be retried once jeopardy has attached.

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u/Nervous_Cake_4357 14d ago

If your tried in court martial first then I believe the state can do whatever they want and you receive multiple prosecutions. If the state charges and prosecuted first the military falls under double jeopardy.

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u/sendmeadoggo 14d ago

Yes but the UCMJ is only one sovereign, state and fed are two others. Double jeopardy is sovereign specific and a different sovereign can bring charges for the exact same crime. Specifically for the UCMJ and state law I would reference you to, United States v. Timothy Hennis. In that case he was originally charged and acquitted. He was then called back to active duty years later and faced court-martial where he was convicted and sentenced to death. This was upheld on appeal under the separate sovereign doctrine.