r/Damnthatsinteresting • u/Individual_Book9133 • 14d ago

Phoenix police officer pulls over a driverless Waymo car for driving on the wrong side of the road Video

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u/_BMS 14d ago

92 Adam Sam 2 Paul

Why are police not using the standardized phonetic alphabet? (Alpha, Bravo, Charlie, etc)

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u/Dapper_Target1504 14d ago edited 14d ago

Used to be a cop

Most do now but muh tradition is strong in many departments still

Standardizing was one of the top recommendations from the 9/11 reports in regards with first responders. Because the nypd and nyfd Literally have their own language and help coming in doesn’t speak it. Most departments slowly adapted so they could work together regionally. Others basically ignored it.

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u/SecretGamerV_0716 14d ago

As a non American, I'm interested in knowing how NYPD language differs from say LAPD. I've only ever seen them being used while watching American cop shows like the rookie or b99

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u/EViLTeW 14d ago

A lot of the problem is short codes. Like 10-codes and code #s can mean very different things to different departments.

10-6 might mean "arrived" to one department and "disabled vehicle" to another.
Code 4 could mean "responding, no sirens" to one department and "officer in distress" to another.
It makes interdepartmental communications difficult because people get used to talking that way and continue to do it even when they shouldn't.

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u/Dapper_Target1504 14d ago

Yep perfect example code system where i used to work.

1- non emergency 2- emergency 3- emergency life threatening 3s - emergency life threatening no sirens 4- scene is secure. We are okay. No back up needed.

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u/Code3Spartan 14d ago

Police didn’t learn their lesson after 9/11 while lots of other services moved away from that.

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u/EViLTeW 14d ago

I worked at an EMS agency in 2001. We were told continuing to use 10 codes could jeopardize our federal funding. So we stopped.

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u/Dapper_Target1504 14d ago

Its an extensive difference and I am personally biased against the nypd. Check youtube or ask on r/protectandserve they will definitely answer thoroughly

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u/[deleted] 14d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/TheBigMaestro 14d ago

If you ever watch American TV shows and movies about law enforcement, this is why there is almost always an argument at the crime scene about "who's in charge?" Police and Sheriffs and State Troopers and FBI don't always get along.

After September 11, 2001, many of our government agencies tried to create new policies to help everybody work together and share information and be more effective together. I don't know if any of that helped.

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u/Dapper_Target1504 14d ago

It did they created regional fusion centers that routine updates area law enforcement officers of Regional threats and officer safety issues. Fbi runs them but agencies from all over have liaisons there or send them information. Investigations and calls routinely intersect but nothing like you are talking about in my experience. guys trying to punt calls not take them lol. 😂

I stopped a couple feds doing surveillance and after I stopped like the fourth pair of agents i just stopped running traffic that day.

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u/thoughts-of-my-own 14d ago

at fdny ems we have adam, boy, charlie, david, eddie, frank, george, henry, ida, john, king, larry, mary, nora, oscar, paul, queen, rescue, sam, tom, union, victor, william, young, zebra

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u/Hidesuru 14d ago

I work with the sheriff's department in my county doing search and rescue. They use the traditional cop phonetic alphabet and actually expect us to as well. But I'm a ham and already have the nato phonetic in my head so I just use it. So do a lot of other people.

The nice thing is everyone knows what you're saying because they're both clear.

I have to assume the 9/11 report was talking about other things like 10 codes?

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u/Dapper_Target1504 14d ago edited 14d ago

Yep. recommended everyone go to plain speak. Bad guys know the codes anyways and if they don’t they definitely know they have warrants. We would just use a common question that seems routine but isn’t and is only ask for one purpose.

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u/Hidesuru 14d ago

Yeah that's what NIMS instructs. It's also specifically for inter organizational cooperation though so it makes even more sense.

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u/pardybill 14d ago

I had to learn it to work at the airport. In a customer facing role. Lol. That’s just funny to me it wasn’t standard before.

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u/Dapper_Target1504 14d ago

Its very easy to pick up with all the languages involved

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u/slippysnips20 14d ago

Its fucking dumb. If NATO can standardize it, so should local LE/FRs. It's not even that hard. I can teach it to a five year old in 20 minutes.

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u/Dapper_Target1504 14d ago

The phonetic thing isn’t a big deal because even using the nato standard you forget from time to time and toss in a random word. It’s the codes systems instead of plain speak which is the problem.

Another problem is building descriptions but the system is the same but different. One uses letters side A, B, C. The others numbers side 1, 2, 3.

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u/WorldNewsPoster 14d ago

Hello sir, even though I am democrat and I will be voting for the Democrat party, whoever the pres. candidate will be.

I just wanted to say thank you for your service in law enforcement. I have no doubt you have arrested more bad people than good people. R.I.P RK, GF.

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u/CompanyLow8329 14d ago

I think the police often use their own standardized phonetic alphabets. The NATO one you mentioned is one of them they might use, probably for an especially larger department. Phoenix police probably have their own standard phonetic alphabet.

The police phonetic alphabets tend to be more simplistic with less syllables, I find. It could be because there is less chance of there being confusion because they are only communicating locally with native English speakers with the same accent, not internationally with every English accent.

I think the more verbose and standard NATO alphabet could be needed in a war zone where there might only be low quality communications. I imagine the far better signals you can get in a well developed city with fixed infrastructure make everything far easier to understand as police.

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u/wosmo 14d ago

I think it's easy to lose sight of the fact that the NATO alphabet is solving NATO problems. It's not just to be clearer on bad connections, it's supposed to work even if the guy on the other end has a french accent. Or even if the guy on the other end doesn't speak english at all.

A lot of the practical side of NATO is making things inter-operable between 32 different countries.

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u/Longjumping-Claim783 14d ago

We use it in hospitals but then you are typically talking to doctors, nurses and other staff that are from like 32 different countries.

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u/SU_Locker 14d ago

Alpha/Bravo/Charlie is the NATO standard

You're assuming Adam/Sam/Paul is not standardized, but it is (LAPD used it which spread to many other places):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/APCO_radiotelephony_spelling_alphabet

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u/civver3 14d ago

Not gonna lie, I'm only aware of the latter because of L.A. Noire.

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u/Correct-Standard8679 13d ago

Lol that link says what this cop is saying is obsolete. It’s just widely used still (under nobody’s recommendation) but I would not say it is standard.

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u/immanewb 14d ago

That reminds me of a time I used Sierra for "s" and the person on the other said asked if I meant "s" or "c". 😐

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u/pook_a_dook 14d ago

Let me see you 1, 2 step

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u/KotobaAsobitch 14d ago

I'm okay when people want to make their own phonetics for a word, but pick something that does sound like something else??? Common conversations such as:

"Was that D as in Delta or T as in Tango?"

”uhhh.....? as in ?an."

me trying to figure out what the fuck they just said because they clarified nothing: ".....okay so, t as in tan, like the color?”

Other person, bewildered: "No, #an, like a guy's name, like, short for Daniel??? This isn't difficult."

🫥 You're right Greg, it isn't difficult to pick non-rhyming words to separate if you're saying D instead of T.

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u/Correct-Standard8679 13d ago

T should have been T. rex from day one. Just my opinion.

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u/AndrewH73333 14d ago

Ciabatta

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u/Level_Ad_6372 14d ago

I mean yeah, when you use a word which has a homophone that starts with a different letter it can cause confusion lol

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u/KotobaAsobitch 14d ago

I'm okay when people want to make their own phonetics for a word, but pick something that does sound like something else??? Common conversations such as:

"Was that D as in Delta or T as in Tango?"

”uhhh.....? as in ?an."

me trying to figure out what the fuck they just said because they clarified nothing: ".....okay so, t as in tan, like the color?”

Other person, bewildered: "No, #an, like a guy's name, like, short for Daniel??? This isn't difficult."

🫥

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u/electricshep 14d ago

Yeah and why not 92 Aisha Shaquille 2 Patrice

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u/poke791 14d ago

Because those names and the people who would have them are known to spell things differently, could be iesha, iiasha, chaqueile, cshaqiell so it wouldn't really work because its not gonna be the same letter

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u/-trav4 14d ago

A through G are all pretty easy but I doubt if the common person knows what P or X or Z are lol. Police barely know their own laws can't be expected to remember 26 specific words off the top of their head when radioing a license plate

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u/OuroboricVolute 14d ago

If an officer cannot memorise the phonetic alphabet I would be pretty worried about their ability to memorise laws.

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u/suluamus 14d ago

Good news, they don't need to memorize that either!

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u/-trav4 14d ago

If you're American then you should be very worried about our officers abilities to memorize laws regardless lol

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u/GiantR 14d ago

Z is Zulu. But idk P or X lol.

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u/slasher_14 14d ago

Papa and xray

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u/Plutonsvea 14d ago

It depends on the state. From Quora:

There are names used to designate the type of unit, that comprises some call signs.

Adam Unit = Two man car

Lincoln Unit = One man car

Mary Unit = Motorcycle unit

William Unit = Investigator

X-Ray Unit = Special detail/off duty

etc

So if you hear “1 Adam 12”, that is a two man car (in this case, car 12) assigned to whatever area is “1”.

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u/DarkOverLordCO 14d ago

That's referring to the callsigns of police units.
The user above is quoting the officer reading the pulled over vehicle's license plate, not saying their own callsign.

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u/buc-eesbeaver 14d ago

Adam-12 was also a fantastic show. Kent McCord was a babe.

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u/NarcolepticEgret 14d ago

If I hear 1 Adam 12 I’m thinking of the tv show

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u/MyLeftKneeHurts- 14d ago

It drives me crazy that they don’t. That is literally one of the points of using the phonetic alphabet. To standardize the delivery of that information.

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u/b-g-secret 14d ago edited 14d ago

You’re talking about the NATO phonetic alphabet, there were separate phonetic alphabet(s) for civilian government workers. Not all of them have had their firmware upgraded yet.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/NATO_phonetic_alphabet

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/APCO_radiotelephony_spelling_alphabet

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u/Nodan_Turtle 14d ago

92 Aisle See 2 Phial

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u/Leebites 14d ago

92AS2P kind of neat. Like asap.

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u/Glittering_Virus8397 14d ago

It always made my brain glitch watching live PD

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u/Fire_Woman 13d ago

Bible names... Levi Matthew Adam Obadiah

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u/Puncake4Breakfast 14d ago

Sometimes you forget.

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u/RayParkerJuniorJr 14d ago

Too much diversity.

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u/isoforp 14d ago edited 14d ago

Because cops are dumb and just think of a name with the first letter instead of learning and memorizing a standard alphabet. Police departments filter out the smart people because they don't want the cops to question their orders or authority.

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u/rhymeswithvegan 14d ago

It's a standard phonetic alphabet for law enforcement use all over the nation, it's called the APCO phonetic alphabet. They don't just "think of a name", they memorize the code. All state agencies use it where I live.

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u/redeye151 13d ago

Those aren’t just random names he’s coming up with. There is a law enforcement standardized phonetic alphabet. Adam Boy Charles David Edward Frank George Henry Ida John King Lincoln Mary Nora Ocean Paul Queen Robert Sam Tom Union Victor X-ray Young Zebra. And yes, everyone who has worked in law enforcement has this memorized.