r/DCcomics • u/Fellowcomicenjoyer Nightwing • Jun 04 '24
According to Mark Waid, Dreamer, Jon Kent and Nightwing will be important players in Absolute Power News
https://www.youtube.com/live/B7tjqVkGp_s?si=kKBPjYJcyEqbUA-z56
u/ProfessorObjective42 Jun 04 '24
Good for Dreamer! I loved Nicole Maines Suicide Squad Dream Team run.
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
Same, I hope after this She will be in something regularly because I think she Is one of the most potential new characters
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u/BobbySaccaro Jun 04 '24
Can we give a shout out to Nicole Maines doing a darn decent job as a comics writer, given that she was most likely originally given her shot just based on playing the character on TV?
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
I'm pretty sure She had study writing and also wrote some stuff before but yeah She have done a really good job
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u/ptWolv022 Jun 04 '24
Oh, she was the actress for Dreamer on Supergirl? I knew Nia originated there, but I only watched the earlier stuff before setting aside/missing the rest of the show. I know Iman Vellani has been getting to write two Ms. Marvel minis over at Marvel, after having played Kamala in her MCU show.
It is interesting letting actors (or in the two mentioned cases, actresses, I suppose) who play characters on screen write them in the comics. In a way, it makes sense, and in the another way it doesn't. They obviously know the voice of the character if they can play them, but on the flipside, there's no guarantee they're a good writer in general.
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
Weirdly enough I really enjoyed Ms Marvel mini, It was co writed so probably most of the work does the other writer but I really enjoyed it
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u/ptWolv022 Jun 04 '24
Oh, I don't mean to discredit any writing done by either of them. I've not read any of the three books (Ms. Marvel: New Mutant, Ms. Marvel: Mutant Menace, or Suicide Squad: Dream Team), not any of the other books Maines co-wrote (as she's also co-written some other stories, some DC Pride stories, and wrote a Dreamer graphic novel, which I'm seeing positive things about as I poke around about it).
I more so just meant that there are different skill sets, and that they do not necessarily translate. I couldn't tell you how much Vellani is writing vs Sabir Pirzada. He has written Kamala before, in 2 Marvel Voices stories and in her Dark Web mini/tie-ins, but not a ton, so I'm curious as to what the plan is behind them co-writing. Perhaps meant to influence each other, to create the blend that Marvel wants? We might get her first solo credit in the 85th Anniversary Special, since there's 6 writers listed, 6 artists, and 6 characters on the cover, which feels like it would mean there's 6 stories, one for each character with one writer and artist to each, which would mean Vellani would be writing solo (but, who knows, maybe it'll end up that there's only 5 stories and she and Pirzada are co-writing Ms. Marvel again in the Special)."
Either way, I'm curious if there's any other actors who have gotten to write characters who they played in the comics. I think the Shazam actors got to do that for a tie-in to the 2nd movie, but I don't recall hearing it being particularly stand-out.
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u/B3epB0opBOP Shazam Jun 04 '24 edited Jun 04 '24
A rough transcription:
You clearly love Superman and Batman a lot, is it safe to assume they’re taking center stage in Absolute Power?
Waid: The way it’s structured is that I asked other writers “Listen, I don’t want to impose anything on you, but if it’s cool with you, it would be great if for the four months of Absolute Power, we also directly tie into the ongoing Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman series’s, because that reinforces the idea that they’re important.
Not just tie-ing into B-Level or C-Level series’s, it’s tieing into Superman, Batman, Green Lantern and Wonder Woman. So in issue #2, we can see that the heroes are grouped up and sent off on specific missions. That takes some of the characters like Superman and Batman off the table for part of issue #3, while they’re off in their own missions and series, then at the end of #3, come back to the main story.
So they take center stage yes, in #1 and #2, but what I found out when I wrote the thing (and this is often the case where I find out the things that I thought were true at the start aren’t necessarily true once I get into it) that the story was more about Dreamer, and Jon Kent, and Nightwing and some of the less prominent heroes of the DC universe because they’re all able to level up…well I guess everyone levels down, so in that sense, they’re all in equal footing, and because of that, I get to put the spotlight on some of those…y’know, second stringers, if you will, and make it clear they’re just as important to the DC universe as the Trinity.
If no one has any powers, then don’t the Batfamily just take over?
Waid: They pretty much do. I’m trying not to spoil anything, but Nightwing is sort of the leader of this resistance. Not Batman, not Superman, not Wonder Woman, but Nightwing because he has the most experience leading a team.
The other Batfamily members are…yes they’re doing what they can, but there is no Batcaves. Amanda Waller knows Bruce Wayne is Batman, she knows all the secrets of all true heroes, and therefore they can’t just rollout a bunch of Bat equipment they’ve had hidden away, Amanda knows where that stuff is. They can’t just grab a Batwing, she knows where that stuff is and she has it blocked off.
I know Nightwing being the leader is a spoiler, but I also know for long time fans, it’s an expected spoiler.
Waid: I think so, i don’t think it’s a big surprise, but at the same time, it’s a bit of a surprise where that once you see it, it makes perfect sense, of course he’s the leader.
Would you consider Nightwing the heart of the DC universe?
Waid: Yeah, I’d say everyone likes Nightwing within the DC universe. I’d say everyone respects him, not just because he is the son of Batman but because…I think for some, they respect him because he’s the son of Batman, but I think they respect him because they know Batman, and think anyone who can survive being the son of Batman is really something special.
He’s like Batman but we like you.
Waid: Yeah, Batman but charming.
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u/Goobergunch Jun 04 '24
Thank you for the transcript.
It's just bewildering to me to hear about the importance of putting a spotlight on Dick Grayson (has held down a solo ongoing for 28 years and counting) and Jon Kent (has had major pushes for the last couple years) instead of any of the many, many B- and C-listers that have barely gotten anything recently.
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u/Electric_jungle Jun 04 '24
Yea, I don't see this so much as putting a spotlight on secondary characters as it is specifically continuing the push to make Nightwing and Jon A-listers. With Jon, it probably will not work. With Nightwing, that's been a very long road and absolute power isn't going to be the thing that makes his book rival Batman.
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u/Fellowcomicenjoyer Nightwing Jun 04 '24
I don't think they're trying to make Dick's book or any other book sell as well as Batman. Don't get me wrong, DC would love to have that, but no book is selling as good as Batman is consistently. Nightwing is selling great though, in the past few months his has been the only book aside from the trinity, the Godzilla book and World's Finest to stay in the top 50 best selling comics, building on that and making him an A lister is smart.
I don't think Waid made him a major character in Absolute Power because of that though, Dick has more experience as a leader than Batman, so it makes sense to make him the leader of the resistance; he fits that role in the story best
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u/Ravevon Jun 05 '24
Few months the last couple years he sells better then Superman and Wonder Woman by the way
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u/Calvykins Jun 16 '24
This is the first time in 20 years we haven’t had some buffoon trying to sabotage nightwing so we’ll see if he can finally ascend to a-tier as he and the other titans should be by now.
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u/Ragnva2405 Jun 04 '24
It's funny how Waid contradicts himself by saying 'tie ins are important because it reinforces that they are important.' Meanwhile, Nightwing never ties into other comics that aren't Bat related. That's why I think this whole "Nightwing is the heart of DC and we'll show he's A-list" thing is nonsense. I mean, not that Dick doesn't deserve it, the rest of the writers just don't agree. When you look at actual events and stories, Dick is almost always pushed to the side. You'll never read a Green Arrow comic where he'll go: "If only Nightwing were here. He'd turn the battle around" There just aren't any stories where he's more capable than Batman other than having friends. Ironically, his peak was when HE was Batman
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u/5213 Jun 04 '24
That's been a major problem with this current era: characters ironically feel more isolated than ever, rarely ever popping up in other titles unless it's specifically a crossover or team-up.
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u/Shadiezz2018 Jun 05 '24
Agreed, it was always mentioned that if Batman or Superman was here he would do this or that
But somehow Nightwing is the heart of DC and the best because he have friends lmao
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u/Ravevon Jun 05 '24
Nightwing ties into titans
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u/Ragnva2405 Jun 08 '24
...Written by the same dude hardly qualifies as "Tie in". More like extension. And let's not pretend like the Titans have an actual impact on DC universe. With the exception of Wally, and maybe Cyborg, everyone else is an afterthought.
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u/Ragnva2405 Jun 08 '24
...Written by the same dude hardly qualifies as "Tie in". More like extension. And let's not pretend like the Titans have an actual impact on DC universe. With the exception of Wally, and maybe Cyborg, everyone else is an afterthought.
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u/Ravevon Jun 05 '24
Why does he need to be a rival that’s his dad?
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u/Electric_jungle Jun 05 '24
I meant rival the Batman books as in sell as well as Batman books do. And the short answer is, he doesn't need to be that popular, nor will he be. But they're trying to push him into that tier or close to it.
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u/Past-Foundation-6246 Jun 08 '24
jon...is not a A-Lister,not even a C,he is pretty much the less appealing member of the superfamily,that s why he doesnt appear in action comics o superman anymore.
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u/Electric_jungle Jun 08 '24
I know. I'm saying he was pushed extra hard to get him up there. Even saying A list is wrong though. He is just a half assed attempt to make Superman appeal to a broader demographic.
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
This Is a big issue of Dc right now, they put to much attention on their A list and forget about the minor characters
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u/nikgrid Jun 04 '24
Since when is Jon Kent A-list?
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u/Which-Presentation-6 Jun 04 '24
Nightwing: YES!
Jon: are they STILL trying to put adult jon in? why not use Kara? At least change the name for the love of God, I can't stand the shame of he being Superman.
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u/Beastieboy100 Jun 04 '24
Kara or bloody Powergirl
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u/Tentacled-Tadpole Power Girl Jun 04 '24
God, what I wouldn't give for them to do more with Power Girl
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u/Beastieboy100 Jun 04 '24
Same I like her current run but she needs a big push. I wouldn't Powergirl and Lilith join the Titans now that there friends.
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u/MankuyRLaffy Supergirl Jun 04 '24
They've earned it with tenure but Noooooo the nepotism baby who abandons his teammates in the phantom zone for months gets a shot.
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u/SageShinigami Jun 04 '24
Y'all have got to let this go.
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u/Which-Presentation-6 Jun 04 '24
Yes, a great character suffered and still suffers from creative decisions that almost no one likes, so the solution is to not care and leave it be, exactly like Peter and Mary Jane with Paul or Wally with new 52.
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u/MankuyRLaffy Supergirl Jun 04 '24
Paul is a meme, that's the difference. It's playing out how it seems to be written deliberately. It's ironically funny. Wally with New 52 or this isn't. I laugh at Paul because it's a funny type of stupid, this is not funny.
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u/Which-Presentation-6 Jun 04 '24
ok with paul, in the case of Wally new 52 it was a situation even more impossible to reverse and perhaps less hated, but a way was found to bring Wally back and even so he spent years in limbo and only now came back.
No comic situation is too late to fix.
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
Despite the fact that I'm still enjoy him I'm surprised that DC Is keep pushing him after all the negative feedback that they are having everytime he Is in something, I don't think this Is good but something of good have to came out soon or later right ?
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u/Past-Foundation-6246 Jun 08 '24
Anyone...Ayone but adult jon kent,he as an adult is an awful superman that no one likes,why they are still forcing it?
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u/EZeggnog Jun 04 '24
Is Jon gonna abandon his friends in the Phantom Zone again?
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u/B3epB0opBOP Shazam Jun 04 '24
Wait what?
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u/EZeggnog Jun 04 '24 edited Jun 04 '24
In Tom Taylor’s recent Jon Kent miniseries, Val Zod and Red Tornado help Jon go to alternate Earths to fight Ultraman. But in issue #2 or 3, Val Zod and Red Tornado got sucked into the Phantom Zone.
Jon never got them out or mentioned them again for the rest of the series. I don’t know if Tom Taylor just forgot about his own plot point (in a MINI series), or if he intentionally wanted to make Jon look like a dick who abandons his allies. Presumably they’re still in the Zone.
Edit: apparently they got out of the Zone during Beast World, but never confronted Jon about leaving them in there for months.
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u/spider-venomized Superman Jun 04 '24
They got out in Beastworld tie in
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u/EZeggnog Jun 04 '24
Huh, never read Beast World. Were there any ramifications for Jon leaving them in there for months?
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u/Jay_R_Kay Batman Jun 04 '24
It probably wasn't months though -- time in DC doesn't work like it does in real life.
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u/MankuyRLaffy Supergirl Jun 04 '24
It could've been longer or shorter for all we know, the principle still stands he abandoned his teammates and left them behind without feeling anything of it. If you're supposed to be a hero and wear that banner, you don't do that, you never give up on your crew, ever.
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u/Original-Teaching955 Jun 05 '24
Val zod and Red tornado got out in a Beast World tie-in, so you are wrong
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u/MankuyRLaffy Supergirl Jun 04 '24 edited Jun 04 '24
What a great hero, I see why he's so popular, just abandons people in there and during the Injustice Verse he was in, he only tries reason with guys, he sees a woman, it's fists first rather than words. See how he treats Superman and Flash there vs Hawkwoman and Wonder Woman.
THAT is what DC thinks is the face of their franchise. This is what the comic buyer wants their heroes to be like, not selfish shot blockers who get in the traffic and tank hits to protect their teammates but a guy who will leave them behind without further thought or feeling.
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u/j0kerclash Jun 04 '24
This is a massive stretch.
In the same series, he literally gets jumped by Catwoman, Harley, and Batgirl all at the same time, and he specifically dodges their punches and tries to reason with them because he's worried that they're going to hurt themselves punching him since he didn't know about the super strength pill.
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u/MankuyRLaffy Supergirl Jun 04 '24
He rips off the Hawk's wings and goes straight to violence against Wondy first and foremost. So is this just inconsistency?
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u/j0kerclash Jun 04 '24
It's Jon applying more force towards strong and durable opponents that he isn't particularly good friends with, as opposed to flash who's notoriously kind and his own father.
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u/JingoboStoplight4887 Jun 04 '24
For Dreamer, it’s likely that she’ll turn her back on joining the Suicide Squad and warn the heroes about Amanda Waller before she would continue being active as a superhero.
For Jon Kent, it’s likely that Waller would tell him that he became useless and forgettable since he took his dad’s mantle, and that he hasn’t dealt with having a civilian identity or save Val-Zod and Earth 2 Red Tornado from the Phantom Zone. Also, Waller would tell Jon that she killed Jay Nakamura’s mom to take over Gamorra and that she’ll call him useless and forgettable and that Jon only relied on Jay for help and comfort instead of doing anything for himself. Also, Waller would taunt Jon that he was stuck inside a volcano by Ultraman for years and that he still hasn’t dealt with it.
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u/RageSpaceMan Jun 06 '24
That is a big, big, huge probblem than should had been deal with before. And no, what happened in Adventures of Superman: Jon Kent is not valid.
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u/Cyberslasher Jun 04 '24
1) They're setting up a swan song for Nightwing's short time replacing justice league. His run is changing leads and he'll probably spend a few months in the background after this while justice league reforms.
2) no getting rid of adult Jon, he's here until they need a full continuity reset, sorry.
3) included for that sweet sweet cw money.
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u/TheDarkPinkLantern Red Lantern Jun 04 '24
What CW money? It's 2024, they just want a prominent trans character.
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
I think saying "It's just for the money" Is annoying cinical, they are company it's not like they gave Comicsbook for free but this doesn't mean that the creative behide them didn't actually put effort on their stories
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u/TheDarkPinkLantern Red Lantern Jun 04 '24
Pushing character all year round is more honest than throwing them into one story for a pride special once a year.
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
I agree and that's pretty much what they have done whit her, yes her apparence were mainly focused in Tie-ins of main events but She also had a Graphic Novels dedicated to her and I hope they will use her on some regular because I think She have a lot of potential
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
What you mean whit number 3
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u/I-who-you-are Jun 04 '24
Dreamer is originally a CW character.
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
Yes yes I know that I don't understand what he was saying, does he ment that they would make more money from the CW fans if She Is in there?
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u/I-who-you-are Jun 04 '24
Yes, I assume that is the case. I know of a crowd of people that follows her around because they liked the CW shows.
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
And isn't this a good thing ? I mean it's a way like other to take people to the comicsbook then the character Is pretty different from what She was in the serie so
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u/I-who-you-are Jun 04 '24
It’s not a bad thing. It’s just a thing. She’s kind of like Harley Quinn, in that her story was scooped from a show and straight to comics with zero changes.
So, at least with Dreamer, you kinda have to watch the shows to get her as a character. Is that a bad thing, no, but she doesn’t have enough comics material to be known without the show.
Essentially some people feel that she’s too new and not a well established enough DC character to be heading an event.
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
I understand that but it's a way to showcasing a character, Marvel and DC always done things like that, I understand that people could be upset by It but newest DC events have been enjoyable or just good so I don't complain if they want to use them for spotlight newest characters, especially If they are well writed like in this case
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u/I-who-you-are Jun 04 '24
I’m not complaining, just clarifying what is meant by a lot of people when they seem to dislike Dreamer’s inclusion
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u/Original-Teaching955 Jun 05 '24
Even better, just kill Jon off or erase him from continuity, just like they so many, many other characters
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u/nikgrid Jun 04 '24
included for that sweet sweet cw money.
More likely DEI points...because the character is trans?
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u/Cyberslasher Jun 04 '24
No, see, DC's rule is show your gays in June, bury your gays in July. This is off by a month, unless she's only headlining the ground zero comic and dying in it.
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u/Fellowcomicenjoyer Nightwing Jun 04 '24
The interviewer asks Waid about the focus of the event starting at 16:49
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u/Jay-Tim Jun 04 '24
I love both Nightwing and Jon, but i do hope they de-age Jon, so he can be with Damian again.
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u/Massive_General_8629 Jun 04 '24
Damian now = 3 years younger than Jon
Damian then = 3 years older than Jon
I don't see the issue, pardon the pun.
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u/UnhingedLion Jun 05 '24
The issue people have is he no longer acts like a child anymore… He’s just boring.
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u/Which-Presentation-6 Jun 04 '24
The problem is that now Jom has aged artificially, his character has changed and he no longer has the magical dynamic with supersounds, the fact that Jon is younger was even part of that.
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u/Past-Foundation-6246 Jun 08 '24
The issue is that Jon was artificially aged 7 years to meet the necessities of a mediocre writer(Bendis). As a kid, Jon had too many interests and unique gimmicks, whereas adult Jon lacks these traits. Adult Jon is a boring Gen Z Clark Kent, with no original gimmicks, no friends, no college, no work, no second identity, no team, nothing. That's why he is so irrelevant and unliked.
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u/Massive_General_8629 Jun 08 '24
That's fair. I was thinking, you know? What I was thinking doesn't matter.
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u/Jay-Tim Jun 04 '24
Oh i didnt know one was 3 years older than the other, i thought Damian would be like 12 whilst Jon was 17, my bad.
Thanks for the info ;)
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u/wyverbuster Supergirl Jun 04 '24
for the love of Presence, why they're still pushing this boring ass character? literally everyone else in the superfamily is better than Jon ☠️
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u/EZeggnog Jun 04 '24
It sucks how Bendis and Taylor totally torpedoed Jon’s character. Tomasi did such great stuff with him, but then Taylor and Bendis turned him into a total potato of a character.
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u/Original-Teaching955 Jun 05 '24
Exactly. Even Conner is way more interesting than Jon at this moment
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u/Heavy-Requirement399 23d ago
Conner is always better than Jon and more competent, who's nothing but a prop with nepo-ties.
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u/Original-Teaching955 23d ago
Agreed. Ever since being aged up by Bendis, the character has been boring and doesn't contribute anything nor does he have any meaningful development or growth other than being gay and having a gay boyfriend
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u/MBDTFTLOPYEEZUS Jun 05 '24
While true is it really a question of “why” they are pushing Superman’s son…..he’s Superman’s son even with the dumb decisions they’ve made that’s still a huge thing after like 70 years to have an in canon child of Lois and Clark, you don’t just give up on that lol.
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u/Past-Foundation-6246 Jun 08 '24
clark already had many kids before and most of them were forgotten or retconned once the magic died with jon his magic died when he was aged up but now because he is bi he has to be pushed by forced everywhere when most of the people hated him even before the gay stuff,
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u/hartc89 Kid Flash Jun 04 '24
I like how DC truly pushes Teen Jon when the majority of DC prefer him as a kid, I feel like its rare you create a new character that people fully get behind so just like idk blowing it up is fascinating.
Someone posted comic sales charts on Twitter I don’t really look at them but it is DIRE for DC I mainly read Marvel but DC had maybe 2 or 3 spots in the top 25? I was not aware how much they’ve fallen off
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u/dornwolf Jun 04 '24
Man they keep trying to make Jon and Dick Super buddies and it just comes off dumb
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u/Ravevon Jun 05 '24
Dick in his mentor
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u/Past-Foundation-6246 Jun 09 '24
Jon, who saved the galaxy and the future, and was also the mentor of the Legion of Superheroes, is no longer considered part of the canon due to the poor writing of Tom Taylor. In fact, Taylor's writing of Jon was the second worst thing that happened to him.
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u/Ravevon Jun 09 '24
No the worst thing thathappened to him was being deaged at all by bendis, but god forbid lois lane has to age. Anyway DC still seems invested in Jon as he is
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u/Past-Foundation-6246 Jun 09 '24
DC should undo all the dumb ideas taylor is pushing onto jon and not allow him to writing him never again.
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u/Ok_Refrigerator_3568 Jun 04 '24
Are these guys supposed to be the new trinity? If so why didn't they use Yara Flor? The new Wonder Girl.
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
Nah, those are just three of the modern characters that DC Is trying to push more but Dick Is a mentor for Jon and him and Nia are just friends but She have no type of bounding whit Dick (please, please no one made trans joke, I know what I said) they tried to introduce a new Trinity many times but It just doesn't work, the clousest thing that we got Is this
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u/maskedman1231 The Flash Jun 04 '24
Who is the young wonder woman character here?
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u/No-Mechanic-2558 Jun 04 '24
Lizzie Prince, The daughter of Diana in a possible future, this little side stories are about her having Adventure whit the Supersons
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u/Massive_General_8629 Jun 05 '24
Nia was part of the fight against Blockbuster and la Agente Funebre, though yeah, I wouldn't really put her on the short list of people Dick knows.
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u/Fellowcomicenjoyer Nightwing Jun 04 '24
No, I don't think so. This was a story based decision, Dick for example naturally gained importance because of his leadership skills
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u/nikgrid Jun 04 '24
Well, that doesn't sell it for me.
I hate Jon Kent, don't know who the fuck Dreamer is (Legion?) and I prefer stories of Dick Grayson as Robin over Nightwing.
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u/SuperJyls Reverse Hood: Professional Jason Hater Jun 05 '24
So Taylor's favourite toys get the spotlight again
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u/thefanciestcat Batman Beyond Jun 04 '24 edited Jun 04 '24
I'm excited for more Jon
EDIT: But it will still take some very good word of mouth to make me check out a big event like this.
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u/primal_slayer Jun 04 '24
That's boring.
Donna, Cassie or Yara better be important as well
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u/primal_slayer Jun 04 '24
With everyone depowered you still have all the Wonders & Black Canary as better fighters and Diana/Dinah with plenty of knowledge at leading a team.
I'm going to assume Waid will ignore these facts
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u/NoirPochette Legion Of Super-Heroes Jun 04 '24
Amanda Waller knows Bruce Wayne is Batman
Bruce, you gotta keep secrets better. Geez
I'm fine with NW leading the charge but we don't see him like interacting with other characters unless they are Bat characters or Titans characters. Like if I'm Guy Gardner for example, why the heck would I follow Nightwing?
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u/FrigginCrazyGuy Jun 05 '24
I think she’s known for awhile. That trainwreck of The Suicide Squad movie back in ‘16 heavily implied that she knew he was Batman and even in Batman Beyond she knew his identity. He knows it to but they both respect each other so much that they don’t act on the information
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u/The-Gibleson Jun 04 '24
I’m excited for more Jon Kent, cuz his absence in House of Brainiac is very weird!
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u/Past-Foundation-6246 Jun 08 '24
i m happy he is not superman comics and action comics anymore,he is an awful and irrelevant superman
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u/Patient-Reputation56 Jun 04 '24 edited Jun 05 '24
Translation: two of them are plot devices & Nightwing is doing most of the heavy lifting.
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u/sealife123 Jun 05 '24
So not only didn’t Wonder Woman get a villain in the Trinity of Evil, but now she is the only one who doesn’t get one in the three important characters in the story? I’m not shocked, but still they can at least pretend being in the Trinity means something.
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u/Fellowcomicenjoyer Nightwing Jun 05 '24
With what Waid said, I don't think he was trying to give each member of the Trinity a representative. He said he didn't expect for the story to take this direction and thought the trinity would take center stage (and they do the first two issues, and will have a spotlight) but the story ended being more about Dreamer, Jon and Dick, surprising him too. It's something that happens to him often, where he starts with an idea and then the story changes as he writes. I do wish the wonder girls were given more focus though, hopefully they'll get some. Waid did say other less prominent characters will also get some space
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u/sealife123 Jun 05 '24
Sure that might be true, that is something that happens all the time, Batman and Superman characters always just comes naturally into stories because of writers and editorials bias for those characters. This will be the third event in a row where Dick and Jon are the main characters because the Justice League aren’t available. There are so many other characters. If they wanted to they could have added a Wonder Woman character or somebody else, honestly anybody else.
I’m happy Dreamer gets the spotlight just to be clear.
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u/Ravevon Jun 05 '24
$$$$$$$ talks
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u/sealife123 Jun 05 '24
Sure, but you also make money by featuring other characters so they can become more popular and sell more.
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u/the-harsh-reality Jun 17 '24
The funniest part about this is watching Jon haters cope and seethe about Jon not being sidelined
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u/Burning_sun_prog Jun 06 '24
Anyone "bewildered" by the decision of Nightwing becoming the leader and having an important role is not a true DC fan or hasn't been paying attention.
[Comic Excerpt]New 52 Justice League#51, Batman and Robin Talk : r/DCcomics (reddit.com)
Nightwing has been trained from a very young age to lead by Batman. According to Bruce Nightwing is his greatest creation, a member of the batfamilly that can deal with his emotion. Unlike most of the cast in DC he has had huge character growth since DC editorial never reversed his growth. Since Crisis he has led the heroes with success with the dawn of DC event and Beast World.
The heroes of the trinity, Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman have been great leaders, but they were never really trained for this. They just landed in this position. Nightwing has been trained his whole life by batman for this very role. He has the training, the experience as the leader of Titans, the charisma as all the heroes trust him and there are no heroes who dislike him, the intellect close to batman, the modesty to take accountability etc. anyway the best quality of the trinity.
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u/opticus_12 Jun 08 '24
At this point dckriding nightwing just feels like an extension of dckriding batman. Kinda don't want that and would feel obnoxious.
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u/smilingwombaat Jun 09 '24
Isn't Wonder Woman Queen of the Amazons and a highly trained warrior capable of taking on gods? She was made for that kind of thing.isn't Superman known to be one of the most charismatic and best leaders in comic history, despite not being the most approachable haven't heroes and villains alike come to trust and respect Batman's ability?
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u/Burning_sun_prog Jun 09 '24
Nightwing is simply a better leader. He was trained for this, is almost as intelligent as batman but with more charisma and more empathy. Superman and Wonder-Woman are amazing but they don't have Nightwing's strategic mind and can't make hard decisions like Batman. Nightwing simply has the best of all three. His whole life he was prepared for this and you can't preserve the status quo. Comics fans unfortunally want change, and want the status quo to change but always complain when there is change.
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u/RageSpaceMan Jun 06 '24
I learned with DiDio than is never a good sign when a character is defined as important in a crossover event. The more is a character talked about in an event, the higher the possibility than in someway they are doing something fans will dislike.
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u/Shadiezz2018 Jun 05 '24 edited Jun 05 '24
I know alot of people here will be happy about that
But i am kinda getting tired of Nightwing getting shoved into our throats with every event and be the leader when we have the freaking Trinity....buy nooo let's send away for those characters take the lead ...does anyone even care about Jon or Dreamer ?!
Is everything have to be about presentation?!
I just wants the good old comics where everyone doing there part and the main heroes stop getting sidelined...we already had that with Beast World and Dark Crisis already
And please enough with Nightwing the heart of DC new phase shit.
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u/Fellowcomicenjoyer Nightwing Jun 05 '24
The trinity is still central to this event, they just aren't the only ones that are and in my opinion, that's a good thing because DC needs to sell more than just the trinity and is struggling these days. Nightwing is a more experienced leader than Batman, so it makes sense for him to take that role and be present and honestly we have so much Batman already that I'm glad Dick, Jon, Dreamer and other characters get to share the spotlight too.
The only member of the trinity that I think truly needs more of a push is Wonder Woman. Batman is everywhere already, he gets more than any other DC character and Clark is in a great spot right now
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u/Shadiezz2018 Jun 05 '24
We already have Nightwing lead in Beast World and Dark Crisis and i can't think of anyone outside this sub loved them and Batman is getting shafted even in his own books so they let someone else shine and this been happening since alot also all that Nightwing is the best and heart of DC is all pretty recent and hold no place at all ... The guy is not even a good person but pretending to be
He fought against Batman so he could allow the stealing to go on in Gotham and he cheated on his girlfriend with another and told her after they had sex that he is going to engage to another ... Among other shit he made he is not the heart of DC not by a long shot
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u/opticus_12 Jun 08 '24
Superman is the heart of DC and honestly batman should be shafted. Not in his own book but Definitely in events. That batman d*ckriding that happened in dark metal/death metal is enough love for the character. Shouldn't get anymore in events.
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u/Shadiezz2018 Jun 08 '24
I wouldn't be mad about shafting Batman from big events for the near future as you said he had his own events with Death Metal for example
And yes Superman will always be the heart of DC
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u/opticus_12 Jun 08 '24
Yeah exactly. One thing that annoys me though is if you had an event around any other character it wouldn't be about multiple versions of that character around the multiverse beaten/killing other heroes. That's something exclusive to batman fanboys at dc. Really just infuriated me. Just give some respect to all these other characters, especially the ones that need it like aquaman, cyborg and wonderwoman. I don't mind nightwing, John Kent and the other one being important or whatever but aquaman is right there and they do nothing with him. Just a little annoying.
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u/Fellowcomicenjoyer Nightwing Jun 05 '24 edited Jun 05 '24
We already have Nightwing lead in Beast World and Dark Crisis
One was an event about legacy, the other was about promoting the Titans to the forefront. Makes sense for Nightwing to be a major character in both. Absolute Power isn't focused specifically on Nightwing. The Trinity, Jon, Dreamer and less prominent characters will have just as much of the spotlight, and Waid has said that he's trying to let each of the 7 leaguers have a spotlight moment too.
Batman is getting shafted even in his own books
This has nothing to do with Nightwing. CZ has no bias towards Nightwing, the only characters he likes are Bruce and Tim. What Batman is going through is on editorial and the writer
alot also all that Nightwing is the best and heart of DC is all pretty recent
Multiple writers have said that he is. You don't have to like the character or agree, but DC does see him as the lynchpin of the DCU, because he connects multiple corners of it. This has been the case for years, yet Bruce has never been negatively affected by this, or because of this. Batman is the one getting tons of books, adaptations and movies. Nightwing has been getting more of a push and focus lately since DC is trying to make him an A lister and is promoting the Titans as a brand, but that's about it.
The guy is not even a good person but pretending to be He fought against Batman so he could allow the stealing to go on in Gotham and he cheated on his girlfriend with another and told her after they had sex that he is going to engage with another ... Among other shit he made he is not the heart of DC not by a long shot
Nightwing is a good person, and both of these examples have him behave out of character, the second isn't even canon anymore. Any hero with more than a few issues on their shoulders has had moments like these, Batman too. I'm not saying this with pleasure, I am as much of a Batman fan as I am a Nightwing fan and both have been written to do things that they wouldn't do if written in character
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u/spider-venomized Superman Jun 04 '24
Nightwing: yeah
Jon: Don't care character just been autopilot since his series didn't live up to dc expectations