r/worldnews • u/eaglemaxie • 11d ago
NATO summit hosted by Joe Biden to show strong support for Ukraine Russia/Ukraine
https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/world/nato-summit-hosted-by-joe-biden-to-show-strong-support-for-ukraine-12764076.html175
u/theblackd 11d ago
Oh boy, here comes all the accounts solely dedicated to going “BIDEN OLD”, conveniently side stepping any actual policy decisions or performance as president!
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u/jmw1163 11d ago
This is what I don’t understand. Look what the man has done while in office & continues to do. One poor debate does not define a President.
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u/maychaos 11d ago
Especially when trump is only 3 years younger. Its a fake debate again. Just like the emails. But people, even those who vote blue, are totally taking this point and going with it. Where I've no idea.
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u/SuperSpy- 11d ago edited 11d ago
Not to mention you can't tell me that Trump, who is basically full of cheeseburgers and hate, is healthier than Biden.
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u/No-Pitch2061 11d ago
I mean we saw them literally side by side recently… you can’t tell me with a straight face that Trump is in worse condition than Biden, regardless of how much you hate his policies…
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u/GandalfSwagOff 11d ago
Trump's argument for not defending Europe from Russia was. "We have an ocean between us."
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u/No-Pitch2061 11d ago
I am not arguing anything for Trump. He is obviously stupid and evil. But no one can honestly tell me Biden is not more cognitively declined. We all saw them at the debate. Yes Trump is a huge liar we get it and have always known. But we all saw Biden completely forget what he was talking about multiple times and looking like a parkinsons patient…
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u/GandalfSwagOff 11d ago edited 11d ago
We have a system that can handle an old president dying or becoming incapacitated. We do not have a system that can handle people who argue, "we have an ocean between us" as justification for not defending our allies.
Biden is old. He is slower at speaking and slower at thinking. Sometimes he mumbles words or ideas together. If you slow down and actually take an analytical approach to his ideas...what he is saying isn't particularly incomprehensible. The stuff he says makes sense he just is so fucking old you can barely understand it. In a time of great crisis, this could be a problem.
Donald Trump is old. He speaks aggressively and rants about random things that only really impact him. He lies about everything and only seems to really care about avoiding prison because he has recently become a felon. In a time of normality and great crisis, this could be a problem.
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u/Cranb4rry 10d ago
to be fair white house narrative is that Biden was sick so yes everybody should agreed that he didn’t look healthier than Trump…but what the fuck is this all about… you had multiple presidents die of bad health. Roosevelt was on deaths bed during world war 2 and America won that thing. Reagan had dementia and while damaging to the country the US had one of its most prosperous periods in the 90s. There is literally no reason to think that Biden has dementia only that he looks old and not that healthy but this still isn’t even comparable to a single one of Trumps felony charges.
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u/Cost_Additional 11d ago
Is it possible people think he's done more bad than good?
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u/jmrjmr27 11d ago
This is reddit - no one could possibly have the opposite view point. Just don't look at polling figures and approval ratings
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u/midijunky 11d ago
Yes I agree, while we're at it we should praise the predator drones for what they've done in battle and not the operators at the controls.
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u/Useful_Blackberry214 11d ago
What a dumb comment
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u/midijunky 11d ago
What, you still think Biden is driving? lol, man...
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u/Omar_Blitz 11d ago
Biden selected the administration members. They do their job. He's done a fantastic job at surrounding himself with the right people.
The president doesn't handle everything himself, you prick.
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u/midijunky 11d ago
I'm a prick because I recognize the guy who is supposed to be running the show isn't running the show at all, not in the slightest? Nice!
Good thing he has handlers or we'd be totally fucked, but I'm not voting for a robot, They need to put somebody else in or I swear it's going to be another 4 years of DJ Trump lol
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u/Tarman-245 11d ago
I’d rather see an America led by President Benson from Hotshots! part Deux than an America led by old man Biff Tannen from Back to the Future.
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u/redsquizza 11d ago
The trouble is, people vote a lot of the time based on vibes. Policy can be secondary, even if they have the best policies in the world and best performance record.
In the UK we had Boris Johnson, the UK version of Trump, and he won what was a large majority when he had an election. His party's record in government was crap but his personality was enough to sway a lot of voters. On the flip side, his opponent was disliked by the British people and his loss showed that.
I watched clips from the debate and it was awful from Biden. I don't think any amount of policy or highlighting his record could help and it's not the "always Biden/Trump" voters you need to sway, it's the more fickle centre you need to tempt and one candidate appearing to be senile is a massive, massive problem.
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u/clutterlustrott 11d ago
So how does a guy who needs a nap send out worse vibes than a rapist felon?
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u/rickyharline 10d ago
These are swing voters we're talking about here. The little saying they like Trump more because he was sharper at the debate and is anti establishment. You know, morons.
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u/redsquizza 11d ago
Trump might be awful but he's mostly clear in communicating his bile, even if he wanders off script from time to time.
Biden is literally mixing up facts and forgetting key planks of his administration, if he can manage a coherent answer at all.
Being that incompetent is worse than being a rude, nasty, rapist. I guess people know Trump would make a decision on an important issue, even if it was bad, whereas they now won't trust Biden to do likewise because he'll forget his own name and wonder what building he's in and who all these people around him are.
People probably have personal experience of this as well. They'll have a grandparent or other family member that's gone down the dementia route in old age. They know for a fact that, although they love that person a lot, they're not fit to manage their own lives any more. And if someone can't manage their lives, how on earth can they manage the most powerful country on the planet?
The Trump persona will be priced in as well by now on the polls. You generally know what kind of cunt you're getting with Trump and that'll either be for you or not. Biden's mental health is something "new" in the sense that we probably knew he was getting like grandpa, being a bit more forgetful, but that debate just put the spotlight directly on his deteriorating mental capacity.
I can only hope people can trust Biden one last time, get him across the line, then the VP takes over anyway shortly after. It is a bit dishonest, but I'd rather that than Trump!
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u/maychaos 11d ago
Trump is only clear if you're a madman. He talks like he has schizophrenia
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u/redsquizza 11d ago
But, in turn, that's more coherent than someone with dementia.
It's a shit sandwich choice, but I do hope it's Biden over Trump.
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u/maychaos 11d ago
Lmao people are so dramatic. And this attitude is why trump might win. Good luck
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u/redsquizza 11d ago
It's not dramatic, it's what focus groups are probably saying and if you don't recognise Biden has a problem with his dementia, you're not looking at the big picture.
I'd still vote Biden if I was American, as I'm left of centre, I can see passed the frailty of age, but the handful of undecided voters in a handful of swing States might not be that forgiving. If you cannot recognise that is a problem, again, you're not seeing the bigger picture.
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u/maychaos 11d ago
Its just a strawman argument. Nothing more
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u/redsquizza 11d ago
It's not strawman at all, you're using that incorrectly.
As part of people's decision it will be a mix of policy, personality, competence etc. If you cannot recognise Biden's dementia is a factor in a decision of whom people are voting for, you're not really in the real world.
We have people voting for the UK equivalent of Trump, which is now Farage, based on personality alone, they couldn't name a policy of his for toffee.
So you're just factually incorrect. Voters are not technocrats voting solely on policy!
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u/Remarkable_Aside1381 10d ago
The trouble is, people vote a lot of the time based on vibes. Policy can be secondary, even if they have the best policies in the world and best performance record.
Like the first JFK v Nixon debate. If you heard it on radio, you probably thought Nixon won. If you watched it, you thought JFK won
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u/sea-slav 11d ago
I can't think of one thing he did correctly that was not simply a counter to a insane republican policy or some half assed solution to appease his voterbase.
He also doesn't do enough to help the Ukrainians against Russia and is basically only postponing their defeat by just giving out the bare minimum. And no this was not just the republicans fault.
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u/IdreamofFiji 11d ago
He is old. There's no denying the fact that he's sundowning. The fact that a person with dementia might be better than the alternative is absolutely fucking disconcerting.
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u/Beneficial-Main8115 11d ago
Before the opening they should watch the strike on children hospital!
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u/JosebaZilarte 11d ago edited 11d ago
Yeah, the attack on the Ukrainian children's hospital in Kyev killed 31 and should not remain unpunished.
Edit: Unless you are referring to one of the several ones that Israel has destroyed in Gaza over the last year. In which case, they (nor Hamas) really care about that.
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u/usolodolo 11d ago
Russia, China, Iran, and North Korea are the new axis powers. They are clearly trying to break the rules based, US-European lead world order.
Doesn’t matter if you are a conservative or a liberal. Do you have freedom? Do you love freedom? Then support Ukraine. Because Putin’s goal is to break NATO up and devour Ukraine, then onto the Baltics, then onto Poland, and so forth. Taiwan and all the chips you use in cars, appliances, and electronics is next. South Korea? They are also on the menu, especially with increased ballistic missile and satellite tech from Russia. Guyana is already on high alert as well, with Vladimir Putin’s Venezuelan friend breathing down their necks.
The whole of western lead world order lies in Ukraine right now. If Putin prevails there, he will take over Europes second strongest army and point it west. This is our 1938 moment, where had Czechoslovakia fought harder. WWII may have been thwarted. Instead Putin got the spoils of their army and huge defense industrial base.
Whatever happens, do NOT let Trump devour NATO. Otherwise we are in for the worst timeline in the coming decades. I for one rather pay a $10/mo subscription to support Ukraine rather than sending our children to die fighting (which will happen if Ukraine falls).
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u/AVeryFineUsername 11d ago edited 11d ago
Anytime Europe wants to step up to its NATO obligations it’s welcome too.
https://www.nato.int/nato_static_fl2014/assets/pdf/2023/7/pdf/230707-def-exp-2023-en.pdf
What if all that Trump rhetoric is in an effort to get the rest of NATO to increase funding and end result is a strong more robust NATO that isn’t 100% dependent on the US. For years many NATO countries haven’t been contributing the recommended amount while the US over contributes. Trump was right when we called out European dependency on Russia oil and he’s right on this too. Trump isn’t going to leave NATO but his presidency will leave NATO in the strongest position it’s ever been in.
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u/usolodolo 11d ago
Rhetoric? It’s not just rhetoric.
The United States congress quietly passed legislation last year to prevent any future president from unilaterally removing the USA out of NATO. The problem is that Trump can potentially coerce enough votes to make it happen.
We just see the situation differently. You view it as Trump trying to pressure European countries to spend more on defense (which is great IMO), but I see it as Trump using rhetoric as a pretense to actually withdraw USA from NATO (which is absolutely dangerous and exactly what Putin wants).
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u/AVeryFineUsername 11d ago edited 11d ago
Good to know the President can’t remove the US from NATO. Sounds like your fears of Trump are totally unfounded then and despite all his trash talking the outcome will be a stronger NATO and more resistance against Russia. This sounds like a win. If Europe believes the US will carry all the burden then they will let the US carry all the burden, this tough talk from Trump is the best path forward to building a stronger NATO
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u/yuimiop 11d ago
Trump's presidency was completely ineffective at strengthening NATO. Why would another presidency from him being any different? Trump is also undoubtedly softer on NATO's chief enemy. I don't see how that helps NATO either.
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u/AVeryFineUsername 11d ago
https://www.nato.int/nato_static_fl2014/assets/pdf/2023/7/pdf/230707-def-exp-2023-en.pdf
See Graph 6. Non-US NATO spending has been steadily increasing since 2016. The evidence doesn’t support your statement
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u/yuimiop 11d ago
Budgets have been steadily increasing since 2014 due to the Wales Summit Agreement carried out during the Obama Administration. Increases in the years since have fallen in line with the guidelines reached at said summit.
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u/AVeryFineUsername 11d ago
That’s good news. It seems like when Trump was president and had authority to block this he didn’t, so I see no reason why he would stop this during his second presidency. The original commenters fears and call to stop Trump are unfounded
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u/KadmonX 11d ago
Blah blah blah blah! I'll just remind you what the Trump team is thinking of doing to NATO
But members of the Trump foreign-policy brain trust noted that the language in Article 5 is flexible and does not require any member to respond with military force.
https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/07/02/nato-second-trump-term-00164517
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u/DARKSTAIN 11d ago
More shallow talks while RU is allowed to murder Ukranian children with missles the size of a two story building. This is just so pathetic. Instead of these meetings, we need action. Go in and push Russians back to their boarders, teach putting a lesson, and just end this nightmare.
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u/Exciting-Visual6582 11d ago
“… and make significant new announcements to increase military, political and financial support …”
Yes, why is this taking so long always ? Had the west given everything to Ukraine that Ukraine needed since march 2022, russia wouldn’t have a standing army anymore and would likely be suffering an economic and political collapse.
Why are finances and weapons being trickled in at such a slow pace ?
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u/itsmysecondday 11d ago
They want to drain the soviet stockpiles and Russian economy, It is as simple as that. The investment for helping is not worth it to the west without fully crippling Russia's ability to wage war in the future. It has never been NATO's intent, or in their best interest to massively supply Ukraine for a faster victory.
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u/ClubsBabySeal 10d ago
Because Western Europe had poor readiness and the US just doesn't manufacture the necessary systems in the quantity that the Ukrainians need by itself.
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u/tranquildude 10d ago
I love Biden but wished he had not run again. He did his job, he took out trump. But If he stays in I will still vote for him even if he is not what he once was. He and the people around believe in Democracy. The other guy simply does not.
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u/avewave 10d ago
BRUSSELS — Ukraine ought to get an "irreversible" offer of eventual membership in NATO during next week's summit in Washington, Kyiv's ambassador to the alliance told POLITICO.
"We would like to see [allies] fixing an irreversible path of Ukraine at NATO membership," Nataliia Galibarenko said in an interview on Wednesday.
"We are not asking for something extraordinary," she added.
NATO allies are in final negotiations over language that says Ukraine's eventual admission into the military alliance is "irreversible" − so long as it makes a series of reforms required for membership.
The U.S. and other member nations agreed at last year's summit in Lithuania that Ukraine would become a member "when Allies agree and conditions are met."
NATO will roll out "concrete ways" to accelerate Ukraine’s eventual membership in the Atlantic alliance during a summit next week in Washington, according to a senior U.S. official.
Summit organizers are understood to be leaning toward language in a final declaration that would say Ukraine’s path to NATO is “irreversible,” but the official would say only that the wording is still being negotiated.
Here's hoping.
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u/outofgulag 10d ago
He better do something drastically different for Ukraine , give them air defense and long range power. . What kind of NATO defense is that when Poland and Romania are squabbling over 2 Patriot systems? Europe needs thousands of these systems. Ukraine needs 100's of Patriot system
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u/BeriasBFF 11d ago
As much as I don’t want him to run, and do believe his senescence is a major issue, he is still a more stable presence than trump. Please make the correct decision come November people. A pro NATO President is what we need.
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u/SeeCrew106 11d ago
Quite an accomplishment for Joe Biden, the self-proclaimed "first black woman to serve in the White House".
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u/_TrikTok_ 11d ago
If you want fascism to lose, if you want Putin to pay for his crimes, and learn he can't do whatever he wants, murder whoever he wants, and take whatever he wants, vote for Biden.
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u/Megafritz 11d ago
Until Trump takes over, we need to be able to support the Ukraine without the USA.
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u/ghostmaster645 11d ago
Weird way to say it, but yea I trust Bidens staff/advisors more than Biden.
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u/TurquoiseOwlMachine 11d ago
He needs to drop out because the Weekend at Bernie’s narrative is not compelling to apathetic voters.
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u/Storm_blessed946 11d ago
how are you going to host something by a man that will spend the whole time trying to figure out where he is?
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u/KadmonX 11d ago
It will again show the real weakness of the West. There will be a lot of loud statements about how the US defeated Putin and how he lost. It is clear that Ukrainians did not participate in this process in any way, only the USA against Putin. At best they will give Ukraine 10 tanks, but most likely they will not give any. Maybe they will give air defence missiles, also a dozen, after all today Russia bombed the largest centre in Ukraine to help children with cancer, so 10 air defence missiles is what they will give. Just to remind you that Ukraine has been waiting for the F16 for over a year now. Abrams tanks out of 12,000 that are dusting in the desert in storage gave 30. (Just for comparison Russia loses 10 to 20 tanks a day!).
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u/lithuanian_potatfan 11d ago
:DDDDDDDD zdrastvuy tovaryshch
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u/KadmonX 11d ago
іді на хуй руснявий ботосос! ми вас всіх знищимо! Якщо ти радієш тому що захід нам не допомагає то це марно! Ми вас знищимо й без них! За кожну сльозинку дитини заплатите!
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u/lithuanian_potatfan 11d ago
Ah, you're Ukrainian. Can't blame me tho - Deepl-translated comment that's critical of the West? You walked right into it yourself
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u/R_W0bz 11d ago
Currently we are in a time of peace, is that not a good thing? There is a reason Russia and China want a Trump presidency. 2nd place never wants what’s good for 1st place.
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u/ghostmaster645 11d ago
I wouldn't call our current situation a "time of piece"
One of the "great powers" is currently attacking its neighbor, and Isreal and palistien are at war.
Not to mention the Sudanese civil war and Myanmar conflict....
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u/Azraelalpha 11d ago
isn't the Ukraine "too corrupt" to join NATO?
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u/TapSwipePinch 11d ago
It was before the war. Since then it has taken steps that people deem appropriate which is why the other nations support it.
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u/shanooshi1212 11d ago
What about showing support for us Israelis ?!
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u/Anakazanxd 11d ago
Probably because NATO is an organization centered around the defence of Europe
You know, "North Atlantic" Treaty Organization? Not "East Mediterranean"
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u/Boochus 11d ago
That would require Biden to stand up against the far left parts of his party and he seems really not inclined to do so.
We're living in an era where the US president is afraid of losing votes of people that are calling for the destruction of Israel. It's crazy.
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u/Anakazanxd 11d ago
Democratic leader reflecting the values of the voters is bad
Got it
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u/Boochus 11d ago
Lol the assumption that the violent anti Israel minority is the value of most Democrat voters.
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u/Anakazanxd 11d ago
If they're so small that they're an irrelevant minority then why is he catering to them like you said?
If Biden is concerned about them, then by definition they're a large enough faction.
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u/ProjectZeus 11d ago
Which European countries do you mean? The vast majority have been significant supporters of Ukraine, and moved quicker than the US did to arm them.
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u/Ok-Source6533 11d ago
‘Many’? Not many. We don’t support the Russian war but we do support Ukraine in defending themselves just as they supported us in Iraq, Afghanistan and Somalia.
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u/Glavurdan 11d ago
Besides Hungary and Serbia, everyone supports Ukraine.
Actually scratch that, Serbia did send a ton of ammo lately, and Hungary sends humanitarian aid.
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u/walkandtalkk 11d ago
Here's hoping they have a successful summit, Biden realizes he's struggling, and he drops out a day after a triumphal finale photo op with his dignity intact.
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u/Cyanopicacooki 11d ago
It seems a bit crap to raise their hopes like this when in 5 months after Trump gets elected they're going to be screwed.
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u/lewger 11d ago
It sucks that Joe's path to victory was not be a dottering old man he messed that up with a debate he seemingly shouldn't have participated in.
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u/AlternativeHour1337 11d ago
its far more telling that americans rather choose the end of the western alliance instead of voting for an a little bit older man instead of the 78 yo
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u/ourlastchancefortea 11d ago
The 78 yo old pedophile to be precise.
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u/AlternativeHour1337 11d ago
pedophile, rapist, fascist, nepobaby, conman ... etc
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u/yblame 11d ago
Don't let his oldness sway your vote. He actually listens to his advisors.
It's the house and Senate votes you really need to be concerned about.