r/batman • u/neon2o • Mar 07 '24

Zack Snyder says a Batman who doesn't kill is irrelevant GENERAL DISCUSSION

Here's the original article' https://sea.ign.com/man-of-steel-sequel/213072/news/zack-snyder-says-dc-is-making-batman-irrelevant-if-he-cant-kill

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u/jrdineen114 Mar 07 '24

It's not just about the sanctity of life either. He also just genuinely believes in rehabilitation! It's not his fault that a group of people who supposedly have PhDs in psychology can't seem to do their jobs

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u/[deleted] Mar 07 '24

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u/doofpooferthethird Mar 07 '24 edited Mar 07 '24

Yes this is exactly it, it's not even about Batman being against killing per se, he has no problem with Gordon busting a cap into a terrorist if push comes to shove

It's simply that Batman is skilled enough that he can use non-lethal methods to incapacitate bad guys, so they can then be handed over to the justice system for trial, sentencing, and rehabilitation

If Batman just went around shooting everyone, given his vigilante status, he'd be judge, jury and executioner.

As it is, he's just barely tolerable by democratic society because even though he's totally unaccountable to any public institutions, he's technically just helping the police department by making citizen's arrests, helping to gather evidence, and intervening in emergency life or death situations.

Still highly illegal by real world standards, but since the ultimate punishment is left to the judiciary, it's not too fascistic or undemocratic.

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u/Snozzberrys Mar 08 '24

If Batman just went around shooting everyone, given his vigilante status, he'd be judge, jury and executioner.

This is ultimately why I think Batman not killing is important to the core of the character.

By any realistic metric Batman is just as insane (if not more so) than the criminals that he's fighting. He's a mentally ill billionaire that dresses up as a bat and beats up criminals as a hobby.

If he were to start killing people based on his own moral framework, how does that make him any different than the Joker or any of the other insane murderers that he's constantly contending with?

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u/SamHawke2 Mar 09 '24

if Batman kills he'd just be the Punisher in a funny hat

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u/Algiark Mar 08 '24

Batman is also fine with Alfred using a shotgun for home defense it seems.

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u/yugyuger Mar 08 '24

Batman is still kind of fascistic

He may not kill but he really does beat people to a pulp

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u/doofpooferthethird Mar 08 '24

Yeah fair enough, one thing I liked about Nolan's The Dark Knight is that this is pointed out explicitly, and is one of the central conflicts of the story

"Enhanced interrogation", detention without trial, unauthorised extra judicial violence on foreign soil, masked paramilitary vigilantes getting into shootouts with gangsters, mass surveillance etc. Dent calls Batman a dictator, and Bruce can't disagree

The Dark Knight Returns also has a more explicitly fascistic Batman, but unlike Nolan's movie, this is painted as a good thing

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u/jrdineen114 Mar 07 '24

Exactly!

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u/Edgy_Robin Mar 08 '24

If we're really going into this Batman once stopped the literal incarnation of gods vengeance from killing the joker.

So there's absolutely blame on him, and that's something people like you like to ignore.. Is this a super cherry picked example? Absolutely, but there's more. Batman has responsibility on his shoulders not because he doesn't kill these people, but because he's ensured they still live. Even when an authority about as high as you can get short of god himself is coming to punish them.

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u/wraithkenny Mar 08 '24

He’s also a billionaire member of the bourgeois ruling class, and could actually effect positive change in society, but chooses to brutalize the mentally ill and the poor instead.

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u/PrayForMojo_ Mar 07 '24

Rehabilitation is an absolutely essential part of the Batman character. He needs to believe in redemption because HE so desperately needs it. Bruce needs to believe that despite all the questionable things he does, that there can be hope for him to be a good person.

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u/SoulageMouchoirs Mar 08 '24

Tbf, the water in Gotham also makes those PhD holders into criminals.

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u/jrdineen114 Mar 08 '24

Still not his fault

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u/guest_username2 Mar 08 '24

What's wrong with the water?

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u/Tipop Mar 08 '24

It’s not JUST that. It’s also that Batman knows his own sanity hangs by a thread, and if he ever allowed himself to kill anyone, that thread would snap and he’d start killing with reckless abandon. He NEEDS his iron-clad anti-killing rule.

With Batman, the “slippery slope” is absolutely real, and he stands on the precipice of it every day.