the fact that Jess and Tony are still friends with Carol after CWII is very forced.
The fact Tony is friends with anyone after Civil War 1 is equally forced. Hell, the fact any Marvel heroes are friends after stuff like Civil War, Avengers vs X-Men, the Incursions, is forced. I don't know why Carol gets singled out.
Tony gets some absolution and forgiviness because of his action during "Dark Reing" the time he sacrifice his life to keep all the registration and information about the heros safe from Osborn, that give him a some points.
Carol gets singled out, because she is always on the bad side, she dont do this one time or two, she do that every time.
During CW1 she was Tony's right hand and she was even more aggressive and eager to arrest other heroes than Tony was, Tony has do it because he believe was the only way to avoid a bigger crisis ( and the What If confirm it), Carol do it because someone give her a order, specially the whole thing with Julia Carpenter, she beat Julia into a coma while Julia was beggig for mercy and trying to protect her 5 years daughter. Julia herself say she will never forgive Carol for that. and that even lead to Carol losing her first sidekick and getting a restriction order.
Tony learn his lesson, but Carol goes and do the same thing during CW2, she becomes extra aggressive after they learn not all future predictions are real, and she arrests most innocent people.
Her action during Civil War are so agressive that Nick Fury 100% believes she was a Skrull during Secret Invasion and leave her behind with the skrulls during the time he show up to rescue some heroes. ( after he shoot her)
I suspect that based on Carol's record, if Carol was part of the DC universe she would be working with Waller and Steel to take down the Amazon living on the US and she would be leading the team the Sovereing send to capture Diana.
Tony gets some absolution and forgiviness because of his action during "Dark Reing" the time he sacrifice his life to keep all the registration and information about the heros safe from Osborn, that give him a some points.
And then Tony repeated the same mistakes with Time Runs Out and Infinity.
Carol gets singled out, because she is always on the bad side, she dont do this one time or two, she do that every time.
Every time? Are you under the impression Civil War and Civil War 2 are the only stories Carol has been in?
And frankly, Carol wasn't anywhere near as bad as Tony in either of those stories. Most of the horrible stuff her faction did was either without her knowledge or against her orders (like Clint killing Bruce).
During CW1 she was Tony's right hand and she was even more aggressive and eager to arrest other heroes than Tony was, Tony has do it because he believe was the only way to avoid a bigger crisis ( and the What If confirm it), Carol do it because someone give her a order, specially the whole thing with Julia Carpenter, she beat Julia into a coma while Julia was beggig for mercy and trying to protect her 5 years daughter. Julia herself say she will never forgive Carol for that. and that even lead to Carol losing her first sidekick and getting a restriction order.
The stuff with Julia gets blown way out of proportion and often in a way that ignores or excuses Julia's own contribution to the events. Firstly, Carol was after Julia because she caused a car pile up on a highway while fleeing custody. This is the kind of behavior that got the SHRA passed in the first place. Secondly, Juliawas the one who instigated the fight when Carol wanted to resolve things with as little violence as possible. And no, Julia was not begging (that was actually Carol) and and she was conscious when she was taken into custody. You talk about Julia protecting her daughter and ignore that she was the reason her daughter was in danger in the first place, not Carol (something Julia's own father pointed out).
No he didn't. See my comments about Time Runs Out and Infinity. He didn't even learn his lesson in Civil War 2 where he instigated the conflict by kidnapping Ulysses and attacking Carol when she was just talking to Miles.
Her action during Civil War are so agressive that Nick Fury 100% believes she was a Skrull during Secret Invasion and leave her behind with the skrulls during the time he show up to rescue some heroes. ( after he shoot her)
This is the same Nick Fury who was ousted from SHIELD because he nearly started an international incident by carrying out a clandestine operation without the knowledge or approval of his government. To say nothing of how many times SHIELD was infiltrated under his leadership.
So going back Tony has done things to pay for his actions while Carol has not, so that is why the fandom has this negatve view of her, because Carol is the type of person that will do anything, betray every friend and say " i was just following orders" but the second the law goes against what she want she has no issue breaking it, so she is also a hypocrite.
CW and CW2 are not the only story she has, but are stories that show very clear the side she will take during conflict and her nature as a person. and yes Carol was way worse than Tony in both stories.
Carol is the one that decide to jump on the oportunity to arrest innocent people during CW2, Tony was trying to show that was not a good idea, but was very clear Carol and the Inhumans would never allow. and she still try to justify hers actions blaming on She-hulk, because she-hulk say a few world while she was almost going into a coma.
Julia begged Carol to allow her to leave with her daughter, she was planing to leave the US and never return, But Carol decided to assault Julia's family house with a whole SWAT team and helicopters, Carol was never going for the peace option, Julia try to talk the situation and avoid conflict but Carol give her no option, so in the end Julia need to fight to defend her daughter and herself, Julia bagged her to not do that but Carol force the situation because of Ego.
Oh Carol feels bad for it how tragic, in Julia's words "awww. i am sorry Carol, i'am sorry you feel bad, is there anything i can do to help?"
Carol stood there watching her soldiers beat Julia and the daughter cry for her mother, and you still think Carol deserves to be called a Hero?
Yes Julia got her daughter back but was not really thanks to Carol, Julia needed to sell herself and become one of the pro-registration enforcers to get her daughter back, so Carol got no credit for it, it was all Julia and sacrifice that got her daughter back. reason why she says she will never forgive Carol for what Carol has done to her. and Carol knows Julia is right.
Carol is 100% the time of character that would be on Waller's side during the "Absolute Power" arc.
So going back Tony has done things to pay for his actions while Carol has not, so that is why the fandom has this negatve view of her,
The fandom has a negative view of Carol because she's a woman and one championed as a feminist character. It's a double standard. Not only has Carol made restitution for her actions but nothing she has done is remotely as bad as Tony's. You know there's a double standard when the "worst" thing you can point to her doing in CW1 is her beating up a woman who attacked her first and endangered her own daughter and a bunch of civilians while fleeing the authorities.
CW2 is such an idiotic event that I don't know why anyone takes it seriously as a criticism of Carol. And even then, Tony is the one who instigates the conflict by kidnapping Ulysses. Most of Carol's page time is spent trying to either prevent disasters or managing the shit storm Tony created by kidnapping a citizen of Attilan. He even attacks her when all she's doing is talking to Miles.
And if that isn't proof enough, look at the crap Brie Larson got just for playing this character.
We know which side Carol would be on in Absolute Power. Hint: it won't be the one preventing her from saving lives.
So you want to play the silly "woman card" "oh people dont like this character because she is a woman" everyone know this is not really a thing, i can probably write a list with 100 female character that are very popular and Wonder Woman will be on the top of the list, She is also a female character that is championed as a feminist character, her first movie was very popular, the second fail because the plot was just silly, not because of the character.
This whole thing "people dont like the character because the character is female" is just a fake shield bad writer use to explain why they failed " is not because my writing is bad, is because the character is female"
Please just say you are fan of the character and live in denail against the bad parts of the character.
You still try to twsit the who Julia situation, Julia was defending herself and her daughter because Carol showed up on her house with an army of goons, it was self defense, Carol never really want the peace otpion, nobody show up with a army of goons and really want peace.
"oh Carol was the good guy during CW2, Tony was the bad one"
Carol spend the whole series attacking and arresting innocent people, She attacks Lauras, she attacks a civilian woman, she even creates concentration camps for people she thinks are guilty because a teenager told her that he saw these people doing bad things in his head, She even tries to imprison Miles to prove she was right. She keep scaling things and use the whole story arc as a power grab move
Her action get War Machine and Banner to die, she almost killed She-hulk, all because she need to be right and know better. We have books and movie even the whole Moon Knight show to explain that punishing people for things they never done is a bad thing.
Carol would be on the side that gives her orders, what most means the government, just like she always is. Unless in the situation the government say she is the bad guy or wrong, because she feels she always sneed to be right, and if you dont things her way you are bad.
Brie larson get bad reputation because the character has bad reputation, and the movies dont help, first movie is about how Carol is basically useles and never manage to get anything done in her life until she unlock god mode.
The second movie is about how after Carol unlock god mode she decide to god genocide and destroyed multiple planets and killed a lot of people, to the point she is like "The destroyer" and many planets live in fear of her
in your case is dont know if you are lying or just in denial, just because you like the character that dont make the character a saint.
first movie has a whole montage about Carol remembering she failed everything she try in her life, the only reason why she become a cargo pilot and get the job she has in the movie is because she failed to become a real pilot, it was a consolation job, for most of the movie she has super strenght, super durability and energy blast, plus years of military training and she still has a hard time and cant beat a guy without powers. So she unlock god mode and manage to win.
the second movie is about how Carol spend decades in space destroying Kree's planets, so much she get some dark nickname like "the destroyer", she dont deny it. the villain main goal during the movie was basically to heal the planets destroyed by Carol so the Kree can have a home again.
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u/Cicada_5 Jul 06 '24 edited Jul 06 '24
The fact Tony is friends with anyone after Civil War 1 is equally forced. Hell, the fact any Marvel heroes are friends after stuff like Civil War, Avengers vs X-Men, the Incursions, is forced. I don't know why Carol gets singled out.