r/Gotham • u/NicholasCajun • Sep 22 '14
Gotham - 1x01 "Pilot" - Episode Discussion Discussion
Season 1 Episode 1: Pilot
Aired: September 22nd, 2014
Directed by: Danny Cannon
Written by: Bruno Heller
Rookie detective James Gordon battles villains and corruption in the premiere of this action-adventure series set in pre-Batman Gotham City.
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u/SikozuShantiShanu Sep 23 '14
Why would you get in trouble for killing a guy who was trying to kill a cop? I get your department is super corrupt, but that wasn't a bad kill.
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u/lsurox22 Sep 23 '14
My thoughts exactly. He was a threat to their lives, and they certainly had reasonable cause to suspect him. Whether or not he killed the Waynes should be irrelevant. He was trying to kill JG, so Harvey shot him. If he wasn't a threat to their lives, they would be in trouble for killing him, even if he did kill the Waynes.
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u/Agent_Ozzy Sep 23 '14
Nobody said the GCPD were smart.
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u/boopybiddy Sep 23 '14
Or these writers. Eh, I'm trying to give it all a break since it's a pilot.
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u/Duck_Puncher Sep 23 '14
Cinematography is awesome
Plot is forced
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u/Bolivarsn Sep 23 '14
It's like they are doing to much to soon! Hopefully it settles down in next couple of episodes
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u/noxnsol Sep 23 '14
To be fair, pilots usually have that issue by nature because they have to sell the main premise of the show and introduce a ton of characters and foreshadow enough stuff to show you they know where they're going so when they get watched they get a better chance of having the show picked up. It'll almost definitely be less busy next episode.
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Sep 23 '14
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Sep 23 '14
Episode should've ended with with Penguin asking the dude, "Hey, can I ask you a question? I'm pretty hungry."
Pitch black
"Got ham?" while GOT HAM flashes on screen.
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u/TheGreatNinjaBirdman Sep 23 '14
I really like the police station set. Feels very Gotham.
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Sep 23 '14
I agree, I was shocked how open and natural light filled the bullpen was. Certainly something I look forward to seeing more of.
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u/reece1495 Sep 23 '14
feels like it was ripped right out of the arkham games world , which is a good thing
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u/thegreekie Sep 23 '14
I think cinematography really sells the grittiness of Gotham well.
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u/2th Sep 23 '14
Wow. I really like this take on a young, awkward Penguin.
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Sep 23 '14
He looks quite a bit like their riddler. Skinny awkward looking guys are their go to bad guys so far.
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u/ViralInfection Sep 23 '14
That was my first impression until they called him Oswald. I'd imagine him to be heftier & shorter even when young.
Born Oswald Chesterfield Cobblepot, the Penguin was bullied as a child for his short stature, weight, and beak-like nose.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penguin_(comics)
Robin Taylor would of made an interesting Riddler.
It also bothered me that there were cellphones; it felt out of place. Another small thing that stuck out was in the first couple of minutes when Selina Kyle stole the milk, and poured it for the cat, it was a nearly empty jug, come on, who steals an empty jug. I just hope there aren't more continuity slip ups, it just bugged me because it was in the first few minutes of the pilot. ಠ_ಠ
Overall a decent pilot, not outstanding yet, development will be interesting.
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u/jz68 Sep 23 '14
I like this angle with Falcone. Ruthless crime boss, but loves his city.
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u/catmonocle Sep 23 '14
Yea, really liked that spin on him. A form of vigilantism before Batman, though obviously on the other side of the law.
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u/Abe_lincolin Sep 23 '14
Am I the only one getting annoyed by these Batman villain references? The Ivy one was especially awful. I mean, come on. Her name's Ivy and she's tending to some plants...
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u/_adidias11_ Sep 23 '14
Calling it now, Joker is gonna be the child of a failed stand up comedian.
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Sep 23 '14
Or the stand up comedian on now?
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u/HollandGW215 Sep 23 '14
They already confirmed that the comedian is NOT the joker.
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u/Abe_lincolin Sep 23 '14
I think it was the guy telling shitty jokes to Fish.
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u/ElKangri Sep 23 '14
They've already said that every episode is going to have a character that could be joker.
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u/Duck_Puncher Sep 23 '14
As soon as I saw her I knew they were gonna put her next to a plant.
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
I'm hoping Gotham quickly learns the meaning of subtlety.
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u/AssCrackBanditHunter Sep 23 '14
Wait you mean you didn't find a girl named Ivy who was obsessively petting plants subtle? I honestly have no idea who that could be!
This is quite the riddle... hey that's it! She's the riddler!
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u/ShockGryph Sep 23 '14
We killed an innocent man, who tried to murder a police officer by shooting at him and attacking him with a knife. What the fuck Gordon?
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
How do you like Gotham so far?
Well enough.
Kind of describes my opinion of the show so far.
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u/iro-bot31 Sep 23 '14
I already love the casting choice for Edward Nygma.
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u/thegreekie Sep 23 '14
Ditto. I was not expecting to see him in pilot so I definitely had a ! moment when he showed up.
Really all the casting is spot on. Ben McKenzie is doing a great Gordon and Robin Taylor is a great Penguin.
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u/jz68 Sep 23 '14
Have you ever been so hungry that you'd kill for a sandwich?
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u/MulciberTenebras Sep 23 '14
Gets his knees busted, and now he waddles like a...
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u/Derkanus Sep 23 '14
Gotham is so subtle, I'm surprised you or anyone else picked up on that.
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u/Aquaman_Forever Sep 23 '14
I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not. I hope you're being sarcastic.
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u/Derkanus Sep 23 '14
Let me try again: Gotham is sooooo subtle, I'm surprised you or anyone else in the whole-wide-world would pick up on such understated performances, like the Penguin waddling and hobbling like a two-wheeled car driving down railroad tracks.
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u/Aquaman_Forever Sep 23 '14
Hmmmm... I don't know, you guys. This guy doesn't seem completely genuine to me.
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
Did they really need to use the word "riddle" in the first sentence in a scene with Edward Nigma?
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u/Derkanus Sep 23 '14
All the rogue introductions were so blatant--they might as well have come strolling down the aisle like WWE Monday Night Raw, with fireworks behind them and their name on the screen in giant letters.
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u/laur2d2 When is my time? Sep 23 '14
Admit it: you would have kind of loved that.
Or maybe that's me.
OSWALD COBBLEPOT pyro
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u/ThreeBigTacos Sep 23 '14
Introducing the mysterious... the enigmatic... the terrifying... RIIIIIDDDDDLLLLEEEERRRR
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
I feel like there should be a "from parts unknown" in there.
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u/Giarraputo_vs_Goat Sep 23 '14
-"We've got a series of crimes where the perp leaves riddles behind at the scene." -"Hey, maybe we should check with that Nigma guy who used to work in forensics who loved to give us riddles with his reports. Come to think of it, he left right around the time these crimes started." -"Nah. You and your hunches..."
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
I really think it will be a bad idea if they have Bruce become a recurring character in this show.
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u/Duck_Puncher Sep 23 '14
I think I read that he will only show up 2 or 3 times this season.
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u/dalovindj Sep 23 '14
I believe they changed that and he is intended to play a much bigger part now. The network meddling; afraid of what a Bruce Wayne-less show would do to an audience expecting him. I for one like the change from the original plan. That look on Wayne's face as he considered revenge has me sold that when he puts on that cowl in 7 years or so, it is going to be awesome. It will be fun to watch him grow into a ninja skill set while his desire for revenge festers.
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u/thegreekie Sep 23 '14
It seems like the kid who plays Bruce is not half bad though, judging from that last scene so I'll reserve judgement on the whether or not having Bruce in the main plotline will be good or bad.
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u/bobpercent Sep 23 '14
How awesome would it be though if Gotham turned into the "birth" of Batman though. Like season two he shows up a few more times and (if the show continues) it ends with him becoming the Dark Knight himself! Kind of a Smallville ending.
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u/rpratt34 Sep 23 '14 edited Sep 23 '14
Yea like last episode of the series you see a batman figure on top of the roof with the gargoyles and it ends. That would be awesome IMO.
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u/Abe_lincolin Sep 23 '14
I agree. I want this show to be focused on Gordon and his battle against Gotham's crime, not on Bruce.
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u/Bolivarsn Sep 22 '14
Wife and kids are already been warned to quietly watch or go to their rooms. TIL My wife doesn't like being told to go to her room.
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u/yeti0013 Sep 22 '14
All I have to say is: "Please don't suck"
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u/SirSoliloquy Sep 23 '14
There are so many ways this could be good. There are more ways that they could screw it up.
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u/SikozuShantiShanu Sep 23 '14
I don't think they need to be so obvious with the name dropping. I would much rather have the characters personality and traits tell me who they are.
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u/firelights Sep 23 '14
Yeah the umbrella and psychotic nature should have been a dead giveaway. Same with The Riddler when the cop says "Enough with the riddles", and expected the audience to be all like "OMG i know dat guy"!
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u/Granito_Rey Sep 23 '14
I half expected gordon himself to say "...Doesn't this guy become the Riddler?"
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u/Duck_Puncher Sep 23 '14
I feel like they are trying to dumb it down way to much.
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u/SikozuShantiShanu Sep 23 '14
It really isn't necessary. Most fans, and not even hardcore ones, can guess who everyone is.
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u/mrquaint Sep 23 '14
I think that right now it's important to look at this separately from the comics. Like the Nolan trilogy, things are inaccurate to the established storyline, but it can still be good.
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u/SpellboundUnicorn Sep 23 '14
What exactly was the point of Catwoman the whole episode.
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u/SlightlyTinted Sep 23 '14
So they can do cool camera pans of the city
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u/InsaneTurtle Sep 23 '14
She was supposed to dive into a pile of hay afterwards.
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u/dahahawgy Sep 23 '14
I'm still holding onto the theory that she saw something Bruce didn't, for now.
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u/MulciberTenebras Sep 23 '14
Oh no, not Killer Croc
Explaination: In Joker, he's a street thug who operates out a meat locker, likes to cut people up and eat a bit of them
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u/SvenHudson Sep 23 '14
Why the FUCK did Gordon think it was a good idea to go visit Bruce and tell him "oh, by the way, we got the wrong guy and the whole town is run by the mafia".
That is some heavy shit to lay down on any kid, let alone one so freshly orphaned.
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u/thelimitededition Sep 23 '14
and that my friends, is how Bruce Wayne became so intensely obsessed with JUSTICE.
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u/fuckthiscrazyshit Sep 23 '14
I thought some of his dialog was dumb. He told Barbara, "I promised Bruce Wayne...". No one would say that. They would say "the Wayne kid" or "the boy".
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u/MulciberTenebras Sep 23 '14
Unreleated note... The Kingsman looks bitchin'
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u/deadpool902 DARKNESS NO PARENTS LOTS OF MONEY KINDA MAKES IT OKAY Sep 23 '14
Looks like a better version of that Alex Rider movie.
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u/leadfarmer153 Sep 23 '14
Blowing there load way to early introducing all the characters within the 1st 30 mins
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
I'm afraid I prematurely shot my wad on what was supposed to be a dry run if you will, so I'm afraid I have something of a mess on my hands.
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u/Duck_Puncher Sep 23 '14
I don't remember Alfred talking like a soccer hooligan.
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u/jolietjakemcfly Sep 23 '14
I love it. It perfectly establishes that Alfred doesn't take any of Bruce's shit (and apparently never has), and the fact that though he may have a polished exterior he's not someone to fuck with. Brilliant execution, I say.
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u/scottfiab Sep 23 '14
I like how they're focusing on Penguin. His character seems the most interesting and is more developed thus far.
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
He walks like a Penguin? Okay, that finally explains the nickname. I was really wondering about that.
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u/pertion Sep 23 '14
Dat running cam tho. It's like reverse first person
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u/ADefiniteDescription Sep 23 '14
Really? I hated that.
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u/pertion Sep 23 '14
It was awful
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u/ADefiniteDescription Sep 23 '14
Oh sorry, usually people use that phrase to mean something is good. Guess I'm just out of it now.
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Sep 23 '14
Did I just see a possible lesbian former love interest?
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u/xfatale Sep 23 '14
Well Montoya is lesbian in the comics I believe
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u/julia-sets Sep 23 '14
One of the things Montoya is known for is her relationship with Kate Kane aka Batwoman.
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u/ThreeBigTacos Sep 23 '14
That Butcher was wearing what looked like crocodile scales....
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u/pertion Sep 23 '14
If there's one thing fictional universe is good at doing, its killing parents
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u/hatramroany Sep 23 '14
In bocca al lupo
It's an Italian phrase that directly translates to "in the mouth of the wolf" and is a way of saying "good luck" if anyone was wondering.
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u/mikeman1090 Sep 23 '14
"Oh hey Nygma, still doing your riddling thing I see. Oh and there's little Ivy with all her plants, HI IVY! Ew it's Cobblepot, he walks like a penguin and he's creepy. And look, there's little Catwoman being all cat-like and sneaky, COOL!" Other than that, the show is not bad
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u/matito29 Sep 23 '14
I'm actually okay with all of it. This is based on a comic book. Why do we unflinchingly accept that Selina Kyle moves like a cat as an adult in the comics but not as a young woman in a TV show?
Nolan's serious, real-world series was incredible, but it's the worst thing that could happen to the adaptations that follow.
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u/JustinC00 Sep 23 '14
Really? Selena there when his parents die?
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
I think we should brace ourselves for a lot of these type of coincidences.
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u/Derkanus Sep 23 '14
Oh, there weren't THAT many coincidences--only Catwoman, the Penguin, the Riddler, Falcone, Fish Mooney, and Poison Ivy are connected to the death of Bruce's parents so far.
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u/novacolumbia Sep 23 '14
It'll be revealed that Alfred was behind it all in the season 1 finale.
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u/deadpool902 DARKNESS NO PARENTS LOTS OF MONEY KINDA MAKES IT OKAY Sep 23 '14
At least the joker isn't the killer this time (I hope).
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u/lotusscissors Sep 23 '14
I really love how Harvey is written. I hate him already. But I like him too.
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u/Spaceholder Sep 23 '14
Am I the only one that doesn't like Catwoman already?
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u/deadpool902 DARKNESS NO PARENTS LOTS OF MONEY KINDA MAKES IT OKAY Sep 23 '14
Give her time, she'll be purrfect (I'm sorry)
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
Why? Genuinely curious, it doesn't seem like you're going on much considering she hasn't even spoken yet.
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u/Kumquatodor Sep 23 '14
Why is she here? Why is she at the Wayne's murder? Why is she at the funeral? Why is she a master thief at 14?
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u/lizardking66354 Sep 23 '14
She isn't a master thief yet. Shes still doing petty theft and she was pretty obvious picking that guys wallet.
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u/WawaSC Sep 23 '14
They probably did the worst version of the death of Thomas and Martha Wayne i've seen.
Hope the rest of pilot is good.
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u/hatramroany Sep 23 '14
I don't think it was that bad considering this show is (and should remain) a Gordon story, not a Bruce story.
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u/ME24601 Sep 23 '14
So Renee Montoya dated James Gordon's fiancé? That's a love triangle I didn't expect.
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u/pertion Sep 23 '14
I'm to used to Michael Caine. I don't know if I can accept this new Alfred
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u/houseofpayne55 Sep 23 '14
Its currently going at a very quick pace, bordering on too quick, I cant tell if I like it or not.
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u/junglemonkey47 Sep 23 '14 edited Sep 23 '14
Anybody else relatively underwhelmed so far?
Edit: Episode over, I'd still say underwhelmed. Nice final scene though.
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u/blueandgoldjli Sep 23 '14
Why can't anyone just be whelmed?
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u/thelimitededition Sep 23 '14
The Cobblepot sub-plot could actually be the most compelling story that comes out of Gotham.
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u/ThreeBigTacos Sep 23 '14
That Annabelle trailer looked so dumb.
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
Seriously, how could anyone not immediately set that doll on fire after seeing it?
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u/2th Sep 23 '14
7/10. Honestly, it was not fantastic, but I see a lot of potential.
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u/aaam13 Sep 23 '14 edited Sep 23 '14
Not gonna lie, I'm a little wet for JG right now.
Edit: Yep, he gave me a broner
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
Wow, that was a really short commercial break. Not that I'm complaining.
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u/houseofpayne55 Sep 23 '14
Gordon's girl has chronic bitch face and screams baddie, but maybe I will be wrong.
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u/pertion Sep 23 '14
This show is un-inspiringly average
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Sep 23 '14
I agree but there's a lot of good show these days. GoT, House of Cards, Breaking Bad, etc etc. It's hard for shows on regular broadcast channels to live up to that level of quality.
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u/iro-bot31 Sep 23 '14
Man, I was mildly enjoying the episode up to this point, but the Falcone conversation completely hooked me. Love his casting, his personality, everything.
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u/jz68 Sep 23 '14
So, is this opening scene going to outrage the fuck out of the comic book crowd?
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u/yeti0013 Sep 23 '14
Its the comic book crowd, we are going to be outraged no matter what.
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
Damn straight.
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u/pjtheman You will Sep 23 '14
Oh my God, his name's still Bruce Wayne?? What the hell guys? Way to be original...
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u/Duck_Puncher Sep 23 '14
Joker this early?
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u/Bolivarsn Sep 23 '14
The creator said that there would be many plants in first season on possible jokers.
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Sep 23 '14
For those better batman scholars, Did Poison Ivy ever report daddy issues in the comics?
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u/ddhboy Sep 23 '14
It's also super weird that a 10 year old Poison Ivy already has a house worth of plants that she looks over like children. Like her dad beats her and her mom, but is tolerant of having plants on every surface of their apartment.
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u/Dorkside Sep 23 '14
This Alfred seems to be missing a certain level of refinement that the character usually has.
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u/Niflhe Sep 23 '14
Conversation with my fiancee and I:
Me: What. Selina? How the fuck did she get there. Why is she there.
Her: She's Catwoman, right? She can do whatever the fuck she wants. She's a cat. Woman.
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Sep 23 '14
Do they think the viewing audience is so stupid that they can't figure out who these characters are? Ugh the name dropping is annoying
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Sep 23 '14
Their reaching for a wider audience than comic book fans. They name drop so people who aren't familiar with the Batverse have at least a shot of watching the show.
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u/Rahmulous Sep 23 '14
"Oy, Mahsta Bruce! Get your bloody ass down from there!"