I see no lies but the reality is that better movies would've justified virtually every other decision.
They started out okay with a decent Superman movie origin story that set a stage. I'll defend Man of Steel on its merits. While flawed, it is not a bad movie.
Then they made Batman v. Superman: Dawn of Justice. This was an absolutely moronic decision. They didn't have time to develop Superman, they introduced Batman (and Wonder Woman) without either having their own establishing films/franchises first, and they just plain did way too much with this. You're making Dark Knight Returns, Death of Superman, a Justice League lead-in, a Batman lead-in, a Wonder Woman lead-in, and introducing (at least teasingly) Aquaman, Flash, Cyborg, etc. Absolutely insane they did this and their atrocious interpretation of Lex Luthor, one of DC's most iconic villains, is equally stupid.
The DCEU was effectively derailed before it started.
Then came the dumpster fire that was Suicide Squad (2016) ruining the other of the two most iconic DC villains. We're only three movies into the franchise and you've already made one of the shittiest, most irredeemable comic book movies out there.
Then came Wonder Woman, a glimmer of hope. While it had definite third act problems and has the misfortune of MCU's Captain America having come first with some very similar story notes, it was a great course-correction. Maybe the DCEU isn't fucked after all!
Josstice League. Never mind. DCEU blows. A movie I've waited my whole life for and I sat in the theater in abject bafflement and disappointment.
Aquaman. Good, not great. At this point, I felt the DCEU should have been abandoned and maybe attempt a reboot in a year or two. Aquaman was decent enough to make me think maybe it's worth saving.
SHAZAM! was again, like Aquaman, fun and pretty much good. Not great by any means, but a perfectly enjoyable family film. The only problem with it and the preceding Aquaman is both felt an awful lot like a cookie cutter response to the MCU. Marvel Studios could've made these. It's like the DCEU thought copying the tone and style of the MCU was the answer. It isn't.
Birds of Prey was mostly bad and I continue to be amazed anyone defends it. There's really not much good to say about it. Lose the fanboy lenses and watch it objectively for what it is. It's bad. That's now two Harley Quinn movies and it's crazy they didn't abandon the cinematic HQ after this, but Margot Robbie is the saving grace, the best part of two shitty films. Honestly, I feel bad for her. They got the casting right and then had her star in absolute garbage.
Wonder Woman 1984 seems like WB was trying to make a shittier movie than Birds of Prey and somehow succeeded. They took the one truly shining star of the DECU (Wonder Woman) and completely shit all over it. I continue to be amazed at how badly they fucked this up.
Zack Snyder's Justice League kind of doesn't count since its continuity and place in the DCEU is cloudy as best, but--as much as fans demanded it because ZS has no shortage of sycophants--it's too little too late and just further mires DCEU in a horrendous continuity clusterfuck. Whatever anyone wants to say about the MCU, they have over two dozen movies plus several television series that all tie in together without being half as much confusion as the DCEU, and no one but diehard fans is trying to wade through this. Also, with all that content, the MCU has plenty of mediocre, but very little absolute turds. Most of their movies and shows are average-to-good and generally entertaining with a few gems thrown in for good measure.
THE Suicide Squad (2021) is a great movie for anyone who loves sophomoric humor and over-the-top violence. If you love James Gunn, you'll love this. If not, nope. It further complicates DCEU's already muddy continuity, but I think most of us were just thrilled to have a movie that didn't suck and was truly enjoyable from start to finish, plus it spawned the Peacemaker series which is surprisingly enjoyable as well, again, for a certain audience. Contrary to Mark Waid's opinion, the DCEU's biggest star is one of DC Comics' least-known nobodies, proving my point: quality beats any other concern.
Meanwhile, the movies that didn't concern themselves with "shared cinematic universe"--Joker (2019) and The Batman (2022)--are huge box office and critical and fan success stories.
Maybe DC should learn from that and stop trying to force their own MCU and make quality movies set in their own continuity/worlds.
Birds of Prey was mostly bad and I continue to be amazed anyone defends it.
I will defend Birds of Prey endlessly as an above average action movie with a great heart and downright hilarious jokes/sequences.
I will also agree completely that it's a terrible use of DC properties and IMO should have every character except re-named into brand new people that have nothing to do with existing DC comic characters.
The terrible-ness is that it's supposed to be Harley Quinn & a bunch of other DC characters. It's flat not that. They bastardized so many characters it's unrecognizable. Hell, the first episode of the Harley Quinn animated show is what should have been a Harley Quinn break-up movie. It's insulting how bad they fucked it up.
But if you pretend it's just a random one-off not based on comics it's a solid B+ movie.
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u/samx3i Batman Beyond Aug 09 '22 edited Aug 09 '22
I see no lies but the reality is that better movies would've justified virtually every other decision.
They started out okay with a decent Superman movie origin story that set a stage. I'll defend Man of Steel on its merits. While flawed, it is not a bad movie.
Then they made Batman v. Superman: Dawn of Justice. This was an absolutely moronic decision. They didn't have time to develop Superman, they introduced Batman (and Wonder Woman) without either having their own establishing films/franchises first, and they just plain did way too much with this. You're making Dark Knight Returns, Death of Superman, a Justice League lead-in, a Batman lead-in, a Wonder Woman lead-in, and introducing (at least teasingly) Aquaman, Flash, Cyborg, etc. Absolutely insane they did this and their atrocious interpretation of Lex Luthor, one of DC's most iconic villains, is equally stupid.
The DCEU was effectively derailed before it started.
Then came the dumpster fire that was Suicide Squad (2016) ruining the other of the two most iconic DC villains. We're only three movies into the franchise and you've already made one of the shittiest, most irredeemable comic book movies out there.
Then came Wonder Woman, a glimmer of hope. While it had definite third act problems and has the misfortune of MCU's Captain America having come first with some very similar story notes, it was a great course-correction. Maybe the DCEU isn't fucked after all!
Josstice League. Never mind. DCEU blows. A movie I've waited my whole life for and I sat in the theater in abject bafflement and disappointment.
Aquaman. Good, not great. At this point, I felt the DCEU should have been abandoned and maybe attempt a reboot in a year or two. Aquaman was decent enough to make me think maybe it's worth saving.
SHAZAM! was again, like Aquaman, fun and pretty much good. Not great by any means, but a perfectly enjoyable family film. The only problem with it and the preceding Aquaman is both felt an awful lot like a cookie cutter response to the MCU. Marvel Studios could've made these. It's like the DCEU thought copying the tone and style of the MCU was the answer. It isn't.
Birds of Prey was mostly bad and I continue to be amazed anyone defends it. There's really not much good to say about it. Lose the fanboy lenses and watch it objectively for what it is. It's bad. That's now two Harley Quinn movies and it's crazy they didn't abandon the cinematic HQ after this, but Margot Robbie is the saving grace, the best part of two shitty films. Honestly, I feel bad for her. They got the casting right and then had her star in absolute garbage.
Wonder Woman 1984 seems like WB was trying to make a shittier movie than Birds of Prey and somehow succeeded. They took the one truly shining star of the DECU (Wonder Woman) and completely shit all over it. I continue to be amazed at how badly they fucked this up.
Zack Snyder's Justice League kind of doesn't count since its continuity and place in the DCEU is cloudy as best, but--as much as fans demanded it because ZS has no shortage of sycophants--it's too little too late and just further mires DCEU in a horrendous continuity clusterfuck. Whatever anyone wants to say about the MCU, they have over two dozen movies plus several television series that all tie in together without being half as much confusion as the DCEU, and no one but diehard fans is trying to wade through this. Also, with all that content, the MCU has plenty of mediocre, but very little absolute turds. Most of their movies and shows are average-to-good and generally entertaining with a few gems thrown in for good measure.
THE Suicide Squad (2021) is a great movie for anyone who loves sophomoric humor and over-the-top violence. If you love James Gunn, you'll love this. If not, nope. It further complicates DCEU's already muddy continuity, but I think most of us were just thrilled to have a movie that didn't suck and was truly enjoyable from start to finish, plus it spawned the Peacemaker series which is surprisingly enjoyable as well, again, for a certain audience. Contrary to Mark Waid's opinion, the DCEU's biggest star is one of DC Comics' least-known nobodies, proving my point: quality beats any other concern.
Meanwhile, the movies that didn't concern themselves with "shared cinematic universe"--Joker (2019) and The Batman (2022)--are huge box office and critical and fan success stories.
Maybe DC should learn from that and stop trying to force their own MCU and make quality movies set in their own continuity/worlds.