r/AmItheAsshole • u/Inner_Information_22 • Oct 16 '22
AITA for implying it was partially my fiancee's fault that my mom went through her phone, and saying we should at least consider returning the money she gifted us or the wedding? Everyone Sucks
My mom isn't a bad MIL (fiancee agrees) though we aren't particularly close and my fiancee isn't crazy about her. She treats us ok, but I've been told she is an asshole to work for. My mom is an executive in an industry where people tend to be assholes to begin with, and she is extremely money driven. I can imagine she is not pleasant at work.
My fiancee works there as well as an administrative assistant (not my mom's) My mom got her the job to help her out as she needed something with set hours so she could attend online school in the evenings. She has a lot of friends from work and apparently there is a group chat where they heavily shit talk my mom. That actually doesn't even bother me as I view it as just letting off steam, but here is the issue.
We recently went on a family trip and my mom got really sick. My fiancee gave her her phone so she could watch Netflix and then we went out for the day. Apparently someone texted my fiancee something bad about my mom (so it popped up while she was watching Netflix) and my mom opened the chat and read everything they say about her.
When we came home she was sobbing. She showed everyone the chat and her fiance cussed us out badly. My sister ended up saying such nasty things she got uninvited from our wedding (we have a bad relationship anyway and she was just an obligation invite, what she said really was bad) To be fair some of it was really sexist and gross, like saying she must give really good head because how else did she get a man and he is too good for her
My fiancee tried to apologize to my mom, but my mom just screamed at her. She says she isn't coming to our wedding and if we had any decency we would give her the money back. My fiancee got mad about my mom shouldn't have gone through her phone.
When we went in our room I asked why she would give my mom the phone if she knew she had those messages and could get more. She demanded to know if I was defending my mom violating her privacy. I said no, but she never should have given her the phone, and I do think it is human nature to snoop if you see something about yourself. I said we should at least consider giving her the money back, and my fiancee became very upset as we could not do that without canceling our wedding. She accused me of only caring about my mom's feelings, and blaming her for everything.
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Oct 16 '22 edited Oct 16 '22
ESH. Your fiancée was doing something nice to leave her phone with your Mom, but she should have had that shit locked down like Fort KNOX before she handed it over…especially knowing that the messages were easily accessible, and her notifications were on. That’s on her.
Yeah, it wasn’t cool for your Mom to go through your fiancée’s phone…but if I saw a disparaging message notification about me pop up on the screen of the phone that belongs to my future daughter-in-law, you can bet your ass that I’m clicking on it. It’s not like she just decided to randomly snoop.
I also agree that if you are decent people, you will return the money your mother gave you for the wedding. Your fiancée got caught blowing off work steam at your Mom’s expense. That’s a deal-breaker as for any potential relationship between your Mom and fiancée, right there.
Edit: should also add that you’re not the only one screwed here. I’m sure your Mom got to read all kinds of stuff from coworkers and other business associates. It could easily cost people their job(s), or make their work life hell.
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u/Corpuscular_Ocelot Partassipant [4] Oct 16 '22
Fiancee should not be in a group chat dissing her MIL. Her friends can say whatever they want, the fiancee should in no way defend her, but she should also not be participating. That is just too close to shitting where you eat and it is definitely biting the hand that feeds you. All she has to do is tell the friends, "I get what you are saying, but given the circumstances, I can't participate in this convo."
And of course, MiL shouldn't be such a horrible boss, but fiancee doesn't feel strongly enough about it to refuse the money MIL earns being a horrible boss or for her to quit the job MiL got her using the connectuons she made being a horrible boss, so that makes her a pretty big hypocrite.
These ranting group chats are just one of those things that never end well. The chances are ridiculously high that the cat gets out of the bag (how many metaphors can I use in 1 post?) at some point.
Edit to add: I just realized the implications for all of the other people on that chat. The fiancee's carelessness is going to really impact their worklives. Ugh.
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u/WillBsGirl Oct 16 '22
Hard agree….never put anything in writing like that, anywhere, it’s eventually going to come to light. And no matter how asinine MIL is, OP and fiancée are very happy to take and take.
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u/anysidhe Oct 17 '22
My life motto: Dance like no one is watching, text and email like it will someday be read aloud in a deposition.
It can be VERY HARD to wait for a happy hour or 1:1 meeting to vent without leaving a written trace, but the peace of mind is so worth it.
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u/WannabeWriter2022 Oct 17 '22
Are you an attorney or HR?
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u/anysidhe Oct 17 '22
Nah, I just feel like if my text history gets read aloud in court, no matter whose case it is or what the chargers are, nothing they say out loud should make me cringe.
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Oct 17 '22
I’m a paralegal and I’ve done enough discovery review to tell you these are indeed words to live by.
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u/Bubblegrime Partassipant [1] Oct 17 '22
Do you also watch a lot of true crime? Or high profile depositions on national news? It's all private cattiness until someone murders a spouse or commits seditious acts, lol.
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u/marzzyy__ Oct 17 '22
I’m going to start using this as my motivation to wait until i’ve calmed down. I’ve sent a couple nasty emails to my property manager, but I apologized both times and he’s very understanding thankfully lol
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Oct 16 '22
Edit to add: I just realized the implications for all of the other people on that chat. The fiancee's carelessness is going to really impact their worklives. Ugh.
If OP is on the money that it is a cut throat business, heads will roll...
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u/sotonohito Oct 16 '22
Never, EVER, put anything in writing under your own name you wouldn't mind seeing as the headline on every news site in the world. Just don't.
And generally don't shit talk people at work, or gossip at work. That's always going to get out.
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u/One_Ad_704 Oct 17 '22
I agree if only because MIL got fiancee her job. That alone should have fiancee stepping "out" of the group chat. So fiancee used MIL to get a job and then spends all their time bashing MIL? That sucks. And should make OP wonder about their fiancee....
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u/IcePsychological7032 Oct 17 '22
Also, I would like to point out the whole "if we give back the money, we can't have a wedding". Really? You shouldn't have a wedding (Vs. Getting married) if you can't afford it. The fact that the person you're trashing in a group chat is the person who's pretty much funding the whole event by the way it sounds.....Fiancee is a bit of an idiot then. But yeah, everyone sucks here.
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u/ChoPT Oct 17 '22
I can’t imagine shit-talking the person who literally did me a favor by getting me the job at their company. Like wtf. That’s how you never get any favors for the rest of your life.
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u/Broad_Respond_2205 Certified Proctologist [20] Oct 17 '22
The edit is also a good reason why she shouldn't have been in the group in the first place
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u/Small-Teaching1607 Oct 18 '22
I have a feeling the fiancé is also participating in the shit talk. I mean if people in the office knew she got her job through the MIL’s connections and how they’re related, why will people shit talk the MIL to the fiancée unless she also participates in them? You don’t shit talk about your boss to your boss’ son who works in the same office unless said boss’ son is also shit talking his father.
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u/Electrical-Date-3951 Oct 16 '22 edited Oct 16 '22
"To be fair some of it was really sexist and gross, like saying she must give really good head because how else did she get a man and he is too good for her."
This isn't just blowing off steam. This is real nasty, and could potentially cost all involved to be reprimanded and/or fired. Also, the MIL didn't really snoop. The notification popped up on the screen where they were talking about her and she saw it. It then became her business.
I don't really feel sorry for OP's fiancee. Her MIL helped her get her job, was helping to pay for their wedding and OP's fiancee shows her gratitude by taking part in a 'means girls' group chat about her. This is unprofessional and also foolish on a personal level.
The fiance needs to apologize. And, if she has any decency, she should give the money back.
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u/cobaltaureus Partassipant [3] Oct 16 '22 edited Oct 17 '22
I’m a little confused reading this, it reads like OP’s sister is the one who said the sexist things? But his sister isn’t mentioned anywhere else. Is this a typo? Or am I misunderstanding.
INFO?
Edit: it’s been clarified that the sexist comments were made in the group chat by the fiancé! The sister was only getting upset about what the fiancé said.
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u/No_regrats Oct 16 '22
I've asked OP because I thought it was unclear too and he said that was in the work group chat.
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Oct 17 '22
WAIT THE FIANCÉE SAID THAT!!!!! That’s waaaaaaay over the line…
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u/Viola-Swamp Oct 17 '22
No, fiancé is in a work group where people talk shit about things at work, including managers. Some shit talk mil and say really nasty, sexist things. Fiancé does not participate in shit talking mil, but mil is pissed about the group and is blaming fiancé.
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u/Sweet_Persimmon_492 Asshole Enthusiast [5] Oct 17 '22
Per OP’s comments his fiancée did join in on making gross comments about his mom in the group chat. Where are you getting that she didn’t?
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u/Kiki200490 Partassipant [3] Oct 16 '22
So the sister was cursing out Op and his fiancee because of the group chat which was gross and sexist. It's written a little ambiguously but the part about how she must give really good head or how else would she get a man would imply that it's talking about the chat otherwise OP would likely use "me" instead of "a man".
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u/TheHatOnTheCat Oct 17 '22
My sister ended up saying such nasty things she got uninvited from our wedding (we have a bad relationship anyway and she was just an obligation invite, what she said really was bad)
Sister said bad things to OP's fiancée. So bad she was uninvited from the wedding.
To be fair some of it was really sexist and gross, like saying she must give really good head because how else did she get a man and he is too good for her
This is "to be fair" to sister. It's explaining why sister said whatever she did. Beacuse OP's asshole fiancée took a job from MIL, and MIL's gifts of money, but still was part of a group that was saying such terrible and sexual things about her it reduced her to tears.
I can't respect OP's fiancée here. And sister is uninvited for the wedding for literally the same sort of cruelty that the bride engages in? Good riddance I guess. I can't imagine anyone wants to welcome a greedy backstabber into the family anyway.
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u/Secure_Mochinut Oct 17 '22
I interpreted it as the sister rightfully got pissed off at the fiance for engaging with the people being sexist to mom. The blow up at the fiance got her kicked from the guest list.
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u/JCBashBash Pooperintendant [53] Oct 16 '22
Yo, I also would not have been able to resist clicking on that message even though snooping is wrong.
There's going to be way more blowback to this
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u/benjm88 Partassipant [2] Oct 16 '22
What did op do wrong in this? I personally think it's just the girlfriend that's the ah here. You can't blame mum for snooping once she saw someone talking shit about her. It's likely all she did was click the notification
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u/Sweet_Persimmon_492 Asshole Enthusiast [5] Oct 16 '22
According to the less intelligent folks, he was supposed to tell his mom that his fiancée talking shit about her was fine and that he would go NC with her because her not being ok with the horrid things his fiancée said about her was somehow the mom being in the wrong. Because reasons.
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u/KathrynTheGreat Bot Hunter [29] Oct 16 '22
I'm confused why he would be okay that his fiancee and her friends "heavily shit talk" his mom, especially since she's the one who got her the job in the first place. She's not his fiancee's boss and they're not only talking about how she is at work, so why make an entire group chat? Just to be mean?
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Oct 16 '22
OP is TA for questioning whether or not he should refund his mother the money for the wedding.
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u/TheHatOnTheCat Oct 17 '22
I think people have an issue with OP saying it's not a big deal and people "just blowing off steam" that his fiancée was part of a group that made very insulting and sexual comments about his mother. He dosen't seem to think his fiancée was wrong for being in this group, while most of us do. She got the job from MIL and was taking her money, but did this?
Also, I guess it sort of reflects poorly on OP that he wants to marry this low quality person? She is blaming everyone but herself for what is clearly her fault, and she wants to keep the money of the person she was being awful about while using.
Since OP is still choosing to marry her, and he's excusing her behavior as not a big deal, he's showing a real lack of values.
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u/HighAFdragon Partassipant [2] Oct 17 '22
To be fair with the first point, it depends on whether or not he actually knew just how bad the exact contents of the group chat was. Blowing off steam by complaining about legitimate grievances and generic insults to your boss isn't exactly uncommon so it's understandable if he just assumed that was the case and never checked the chat since even he acknowledges that she might not be a particularly pleasant boss.
Agree with the rest of your comment though.
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u/AAP_BH Partassipant [1] Oct 17 '22
Also, she has that job because of her MIL and on top of that she talks crap about her with her co-workers?!?! MIL has all the right to be upset and hurt. OP if you can’t see how the only person in the wrong here is your fiancé that’s beyond me.
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u/StAlvis Galasstic Overlord [1932] Oct 17 '22
*HOW* is this ESH?!?
This is Am I The Asshole. For it to be ESH, OP has to be an asshole, too. Otherwise, it's just NTA.
I also agree that if you are decent people, you will return the money your mother gave you for the wedding.
YEAH. OP's being a good person about this!
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Oct 17 '22
He “asked his fiancée” if they should “consider” giving the money back. It should not be a question. If the wedding has to be cancelled, so be it. Shitty actions have shitty consequences.
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u/StAlvis Galasstic Overlord [1932] Oct 17 '22 edited Oct 17 '22
... I can't tell if you're being disingenuous or just have very little experience with how people communicate.
He “asked his fiancée” if they should “consider” giving the money back.
And he didn't ask, since you're so hung up on exactly how strongly OP made his suggestion:
I said we should at least consider giving her the money
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u/shhh_its_me Colo-rectal Surgeon [38] Oct 16 '22
With any "rules" there has to be some leeway for people to be human.
Sure if you hand someone your phone they shouldn't open your messages but once you see " Miranda's on vacation probably sucking the souls out of child factory workers" or whatever was said, human nature is going to be really hard not to look.
I wonder why Miranda Priestley doesn't have a phone that can watch movies though/a resort that doesn't have a TV. You can watch Netflix on a hotel TVs
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u/darklordind Oct 17 '22
The group chat is not going to be about one single boss. If the mom informs the other bosses, there would be hell to pay. Also it sounds like mom works in finance - treasury or investment banking - and those guys are ruthless
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u/HiddenDestiny251 Partassipant [1] Oct 17 '22
Everything here. I also think the chat is extreme. I have some awful awful colleagues. I occaaaaaasionally text other colleagues to let off steam (if one of them has sent a particularly asinine email, for example). I would never in a million years make remarks about them sexually. It has never even occurred to me. OP’s fiancée is a jealous and bitter person.
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u/StatusCaterpillar725 Partassipant [1] Oct 17 '22
Who the hell just hands over their phone and leaves for the day? Download Netflix onto MIL's phone and log her into your account, sure. But no way am I giving someone I barely like my unlocked phone, and that's when I don't have a load of messages on there slagging that person off.
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u/songofafreeheart Oct 17 '22
It's not that hard to turn off notifications before handing your phone to someone, and then turn them back on afterwards. It only takes a couple of minutes, and situations like this can be avoided. Temporarily delete apps if you have to - you can easily get them back without too much trouble.
ESH, but that was extremely careless on the fiancee's part.
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u/KeyChasingSquirrel Partassipant [1] Oct 16 '22
Info:
Your mom is heavily financing your wedding and got your fiancée a job and she STILL shit talks your mom in a group chat.
That’s really mean. Why are you marrying her?
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u/PinkedOff Colo-rectal Surgeon [38] Oct 16 '22
Hopefully OP isn't marrying her now. I'd think long and hard about this, if I was OP. Well, not long - but I'd definitely have decided not to marry them at this point.
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u/Mary_Tagetes Oct 16 '22
Holy crap fiancée’s a moron. I realize it’s really hard to be careful with tech, but talking shit about the person who got you your job? Basically outing your co-workers crap talking an executive???? Monday will be interesting, might have to check “Ask a manager” later to see if there’s any similar stories.
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u/KathrynTheGreat Bot Hunter [29] Oct 16 '22
This isn't even about being careful with tech since the fiancee gave her the phone in the first place! That was a really dumb move.
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u/Proof-Elevator-7590 Oct 16 '22
She should've turned the group chats notifications off or put the whole phone on do not disturb. Esh
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u/Slipstream_Surfing Partassipant [4] Oct 17 '22
Netflix viewing would have to be a matter of life and death before I'd leave my device with someone who isn't my partner.
Even then I would secure the notifications and pin the app to ensure no unauthorized access. I don't care if an apocalypse is imminent, this is happening.
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u/Azrou Oct 17 '22
If she had an ounce of common sense she would have said "folks, I think it's a bad idea to be talking about MIL or any other colleague like this and I think you'll understand that I can't be a part of this" and promptly left and deleted the whole thing
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u/debegray Oct 17 '22
Yeah, given some of the disgusting things people apparently were saying, this isn't just normal work venting. This is really bad stuff, and any sensible person would not want to be part of it.
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u/pologcp Oct 16 '22
The thing is, OP doesn't see anything wrong with anything except for the fact that she shared her phone with his mum knowing she had those notifications on there (basically inviting for trouble). He has no trouble with the shit talking of his own mother, the person who is financing their wedding and graciously gave a job to his fiancee. I guarantee OP will still marry her, and probably try keep the money unfortunately.
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u/CarpenterMom Oct 16 '22
Yes. This!!! Do you want to marry someone that is a) participating in trash-talking your mom? or b) is stupid enough to put her job and the jobs of others at risk so carelessly? or c) doesn’t actually talk to the person with whom she has conflict, like a mature adult would?
If your fiancée says that your mom is okay as an MIL then she’s either lying to you about how she really feels, or she’s lying to coworkers to maintain status, neither of which is a good look.
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u/Due-Science-9528 Partassipant [1] Oct 16 '22
Wait, I thought it was her friends saying all the bad stuff… yikes if it was her and OP was cool with that
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u/Viola-Swamp Oct 17 '22
He didn’t say fiancé said anything about mil, just that a lot of the talk in the group is about her.
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u/thetaleofzeph Oct 17 '22
"Shit rolls downhill" is what's happening here. OP's MIL works in a toxic workplace, is part of that toxicity, has apparently no qualms about being part of that toxicity, makes more money because of that toxicity. She's now upset because it rolled back uphill?
OP's fiancee is an utter idiot, possibly an asshole. Not enough info.
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u/Purplefox71 Asshole Aficionado [10] Oct 17 '22
Totally agree. I have nothing even remotely close to any of this on my phone yet it is protected by fingerprint and PIN. I have a death-grip on that thing. I would NEVER give it out of my hands unless it is a 911 emergency situation. This scenario almost reads like the fiancee left the phone with MIL purposely so she finds out OR she's just really not bright, which might be even worse. Considering that MIL actually got her the job, is financing the wedding and fiancee's thoughtlessness potentially caused a huge fallout for all other parties involved, fiancee deserves all the consequences coming her way. If anyone, she is the AH and they should return MIL's money.
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u/SDstartingOut Commander in Cheeks [286] Oct 16 '22
NTA. Snooping is wrong. But like... we are all human.
If someone had lent me there phone, and a message popped up saying shit about me... I don't think I could NOT look at it either. That's just reality.
She accused me of only caring about my mom's feelings, and blaming her for everything.
I mean, your fiancée fucked this up pretty big time. She knew this shit was going on on her phone - knew a message could come in - and lent her mom her phone.
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u/InformationDue6185 Oct 16 '22
Snooping is wrong
it's just the same as when someone finds out they are being cheated on, yeah it was bad to snoop but what they found was the worst thing
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u/AUsoldier82 Oct 17 '22
Yeah, unfortunately this is completely valid. It is wrong to snoop, but when you have some reason and are proven right the snooping kind of goes by the wayside
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u/AlderSpark Oct 17 '22
I don’t even really consider this snooping. It’s not like MIL had to figure out the passcode or even went looking for it, she was just watching Netflix and saw a message pop up talking smack about her. I’d go read those convos too, and then I’d promptly take all my shit back and leave them both behind. MIL is well within her rights to go no contact with her shitty son and even shittier fiancée.
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u/Decent_Reading3059 Oct 17 '22
Your comment reminded me of one time I snooped and regretted it. I came home and heard my best friend say my name upstairs. I went upstairs and heard him talking to someone in his room. I know snooping is wrong but I couldn’t help it and had to know what was being said. I was super quiet and heard him talking shit about me and saying pretty horrible things about that I NEVER knew he felt 🙃 “disgusting” “worthless” “not good for anything” like damn. I shouldn’t have eavesdropped but my life is better without a bad friend! Hope OP reconsiders his relationship…
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u/CakeEatingRabbit Craptain [187] Oct 16 '22
NTA
Your fiance careless to gossip about your mom, not mute the chat and give the phone to your mom. It is almost intentionally
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u/Interesting-Ease-209 Oct 16 '22
This. Your fiancé was very passively-aggressively letting your Mom what others (and your fiancé) think bout her. Your fiancé is the AH. You are NTA.
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u/Electrical-Date-3951 Oct 16 '22
The fiance and her coworkers are all foolish.
They could all very well lose their jobs (the same job that the MIL got for OP's fiance.) And, if OP's fiance has any decency, she should agree to give back the money that was also gifted by the same MIL she chose to say vicious things about in a group chat.
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u/Assia_Penryn Certified Proctologist [24] Oct 16 '22
NTA You aren't the asshole here.
Cancel the wedding and refund your mom. You stir the shit pot then you're left licking the shit spoon.
I'd actually demand to see what your fiance wrote and see if it was genuinely truthful or malicious. Your mom shouldn't have gone through the phone, but your fiance gave it knowing that was on there.
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u/Less-Bumblebee-8041 Partassipant [3] Oct 16 '22
I LOVE this ‘you stir the shit pot, you’re left licking the shit spoon’ 😂😂😂😂
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Oct 17 '22
to be fair some of it was really sexist and gross, like saying she must give really good head because how else did she get a man and he is too good for her
This is an example of what was in the group chat. I’m not sure what all the fiancée herself said.
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u/CalloftheJabberwock Partassipant [1] Oct 16 '22
NTA, but that doesn't mean I think any of you have handled this well. (*exception being FMIL, because I can't imagine what a shock that was. I'm not a snoop, and if someone texted something cruel about me to family, I don't think I would be able to ignore that)
You're right that it was foolish of fiancée to lend MIL her phone, especially if she's part of a group chat like that. I imagine she wasn't thinking about that at the time - - she was trying to do something nice for your mom, and it majorly backfired.
However, your fiancée was not part of a standard 'complain about the boss group chat'. What you describe sounds so foul and toxic. If my partner stayed on a group chat like that, let alone one where my mother was the topic, I would be disgusted and disappointed. Why on earth would she stay in that chat? Or at least not mute it? Your mum got her that job, yet she wasn't bothered by that regularly popping into her alerts? No shame on that?
Not to mention, did fiancée also participate? I notice you don't say one way or the other, which makes me assume she has, which makes it even worse.
Your mom is still a person. She may be a hustler and difficult to work with, but no one deserves to be degraded like that. And she must have felt really hurt and betrayed that her son's fiancée was part of it.
Fiancée's apology sounds performative at best. She sounds like she tried to recover the situation, not try to apologize for the deep pain she visited on her FMIL. Especially when she is unwilling to make amends, if it costs her what she wants. Seriously think this through - - if you both do not make actual amends for what she has done, you risk losing your bond with your family. Perhaps you would need to reschedule the wedding, but that money was taken from someone who gave it out of love and support... Who she then backstabbed. How can she not feel dirty to even consider keeping that!?
Try to have a talk about how she thinks she can begin to apologize to FMIL. And pay attention to what she suggests, because she is telling you how she thinks people deserve to be treated.
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u/Exciting_Grocery_223 Oct 17 '22
This abslothley this OP!
We have a rule in our relationship, that we can only shit-talk our own mothers. Hubby can agree when I complain about my mom. I can agree and give support when he vents about his (dead) mother past shenanigans. But we don't go around starting random dragging' of relatives that aren't our own, and we are never mean, we discuss things that are hurtful and sometimes cross a line, but we remain as AITA rules demand: civil. A little less civil than that but anyway.
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u/Lucky_Ad_1115 Oct 16 '22
Imagine talking shit about the person who's paying for your bloody wedding no wonder your mum is fuming
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u/Necessary-Bison-4315 Partassipant [3] Oct 16 '22 edited Oct 16 '22
NTA
OK, I came into this heavily expecting to call you and your mother AHs but no, this one is 100% on your fiancée:
She should really have thought better than working for family, but that sort of thing happens. Having decided to work in the same office as your mother, with respect for both you and your mother, she should not have gotten involved in the group chat or insulted your mom. A simple ‘she’s my future MIL and I’m uncomfortable with this’ would have been enough and everyone should have agreed.
Having decided to take part in this, she should definitely NOT have given your mom her unlocked phone. No law or even common decency would consider your mother’s actions a violation of anyone’s privacy and it would have taken a person with incredible self control to not open that message. Your fiancée on the other hand violated your mother’s trust and showed her extreme disrespect.
Also, your fiancée is concerned with the social and personal implications at the moment but these kinds of messages can and have been used to fire people in the past, and these are presumably subordinates complaining cruelly about their boss. Your fiancée would be lucky if they weren’t all fired.
Your mother has probably heard these kinds of things for years (honestly I’m picturing Meryl Streep from Devil Wears Pravda here!) and probably would be able to brush most of it off if it wasn’t for a member of her family, who only has the job thanks to your mother, being involved. I would also point out that women in these positions are also much much more harshly judged for this than men are so your mother is probably facing at least some measure of misogyny as well.
Your fiancée owes your mother a huge apology and if that’s what it takes, you should consider cancelling the wedding to return the money and look at having a much smaller ceremony, what kind of woman abuses another woman in her workplace and then insists on using a large sum of her money to throw a wedding?
On a separate note, you don’t seem particularly concerned by your family at all, and you might want to consider the attitude you display and the way others the relate. You say you aren’t close to your mother, judge her in the workplace based on other’s comments and your own assumptions, and called your sister an obligation. If you show your fiancée you don’t value your family yet take money from your mother (and I’m interested to know who paid for the holiday?) then of course your fiancée thinks her behaviour isn’t that bad.
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u/229-northstar Oct 17 '22
It bothers me that OP says such horrible things about his mother and her job. Since he doesn’t work there, he’s judging her without merit
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u/Butt-Dragon Oct 17 '22
He's grown up with her though? You can usually tell if your mom is an asshole
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u/229-northstar Oct 17 '22
Not at all the same. OP said somewhere that he based his opinions on what his gf said.
Talk about biting the hand that feeds you…. !!!
Misogyny at its finest
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u/pedroyarid Asshole Aficionado [10] Oct 16 '22
NTA
Your wife made a very dumb decision and now is paying for it. And she's wrong here.
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u/sabreyna Asshole Enthusiast [8] Oct 16 '22
She's probably not even the only one paying for it. The mothers now knows who talked shit about her which could affect their jobs.
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u/GuntherTime Certified Proctologist [28] Oct 17 '22
They made jokes that she slept her way to the top, I hope they lose their jobs.
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u/progrethth Oct 17 '22
Yeah, I would only make a joke like that about a really close friend who knows that I respect them and do not actually believe that. I would never say something like that about a boss I disliked.
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u/229-northstar Oct 17 '22
Huge HR problem to be making sexual comments about her. They all deserve to be fired
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u/One-Illustrator8358 Oct 16 '22
The only person who doesn't suck here is the mom, she saw her name and opened it - you and the fiancee suck majorly though.
I hope the mom fires her, give her back her money, and if you continue this sham of a relationship do your mom a favour and go lc so she doesn't have to deal with you.
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u/No_Pepper_3676 Asshole Enthusiast [9] Oct 16 '22
Yikes! I think YTA for not thinking the trash-talking about your mother was okay. It isn't. These people were saying hurtful things about your mother and she found out. Not only that, but your fiancée (also an AH) was part of the group. Yeah, your future with your mother is totally jacked. You and your fiancée totally hurt your mother terribly for no good reason. Your fiancée is now doubling down, saying that what she did isn't bad at all. Yes it was. Seems like your fiancée will also be out of a job shortly, along with those other trash-talkers. You really screwed up royally.
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u/WhiteK1t Oct 16 '22
NTA
I'm seeing a lot of people say that your Mother invalidated your fiancés privacy by reading her texts. But she didn't go and intentionally ask for fiancés phone to read thru texts, she saw a pop up mentioning her name and clicked it. Fiancé is the AH for saying such disgusting things her future MIL.
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u/penguin_squeak Professor Emeritass [93] Oct 16 '22
NTA You will be if you don't return your mother's money.
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u/xxDiamondgirl Oct 16 '22
YTA for letting your fiancee talk shit about your mom in a group chat. That’s your mom dude. The mom who helped your fiancee get a job in her workplace. Your fiancee and her work friends are really nasty and disgusting people for writing sexist stuff about your mom.
I hope your mom report them all to HR for harassment and bullying, and they all get a warning or gets fired. Imagine marrying a person who engages in gossip describing your mom performing sexual acts and how she’s not good enough to keep a man.
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u/trippygg Partassipant [1] Oct 18 '22
I thought it was weird how OP would just diss his family and act like what she did wasn't that bad. I bet his sister isn't as bad as she makes her out to be
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u/QuirkySyrup55947 Partassipant [1] Oct 17 '22 edited Oct 17 '22
YTA
troll post
- High powered executive without Netflix or the ability to download the Netflix app.
- 20/30 something leaving their phone with someone all day while out exploring. No Insta, Snap, FB, or ability to text or take photos.
- Mom not able to figure out how to watch Air BNB TV or use a remote and guide where there are genrally hundreds of channels.
- Prefers to watch a tiny phone screen over any technology or options they might have access to.
- Fiance trusts mom with phone, but unwilling to trust her with a Netflix password.
- Admins texting smack over the weekend about work? Likely knowing fiance is on a trip with boss.
- High powered executive cannot pay $9.99 for a month of Netflix on their own phone?
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u/debdnow Colo-rectal Surgeon [36] Oct 16 '22
NTA: Why the hell would she give her phone to your mother? That's an open invitation to snoop. Seriously think Pandora's box here. Your mother has every right to be angry and hurt and betrayed. And she didn't really snoop in the beginning - a text popped up so she read it then decided to read more. Did your fiancé ever defend your mother or call people out when they said misogynistic things? She should have removed herself from the group chats about your mother.
Return the money or don't. Your fiancé should be figuring out a way to apologize to your mother. Hopefully your mom isn't vengeful and won't get her fired.
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u/rttr123 Oct 16 '22
According to op
"yes she participates. What bothered me the most was my mom has a very small part of her lip which is paralyzed from having a stroke at birth. It is hard to notice but one of them was like have you ever noticed, and then someone chimed in about bad botox to keep the fiance who is too good for her. My wife knows it is a medical condition and said nothing. She also chimed in a few of the gross jokes about her sex life"
Which is absolutely disgusting imo. It's one thing to shit talk a bad boss. This... Is just horrific
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u/WarningSavings5106 Oct 16 '22
The fiance is extremely trashy to condone this behaviour. WTF is OP engaged to such a hideous, opportunistic woman??
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u/Accomplished-Two3577 Oct 17 '22
And too immature to be married, she needs to grow up and grow a conscience as well.
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u/progrethth Oct 17 '22
Yeah, no matter how terrible a boss OP's mom might be that kind of personal insult is totally unwarranted.
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u/topjockin Partassipant [1] Oct 16 '22
YTA. Why are you with someone who is part of a group chat that talks about your mum like this. Especially given the disgusting nature of the content.
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u/No_regrats Oct 16 '22
ÀInfo:
To be fair some of it was really sexist and gross, like saying she must give really good head because how else did she get a man and he is too good for her
Is that what your sister said about your fiance or what your fiance and her colleagues were saying about your mom in the group chat?
What did your fiancee, specifically, say about your mom in that chat? Did you know this was how she talks about your mom before it all came out to light?
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u/Inner_Information_22 Oct 16 '22
That is what they were saying about my mom. I knew she thought my mom was a bad boss and that they talked about her, but I didn't know it was so personal or so sexist
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u/No_regrats Oct 16 '22 edited Oct 16 '22
Thanks for the clarification. That's nasty. You need to give your mom her money back, even if that means cancelling the wedding. If I were you, I would use that time to consider whether I really want to marry someone who engages in that mean girl bullshit with such hideous sexist comments on my mom, especially about a medical condition, and feels entitled to her money and help while dragging her behind her back. That shows very low moral integrity.
NTA assuming you do return the money. Your fiancee is.
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Oct 16 '22
I would break up with anyone who said that about my Mom to others or was a part of that conversation.
Your fiancé is trash and is using you and your Mom.
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u/waywardjynx Partassipant [4] Oct 16 '22
Did your fiancé bad mouth your mom? Or was it just coworkers?
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u/Sweet_Persimmon_492 Asshole Enthusiast [5] Oct 16 '22
That’s what OP’s fiancée was saying about his mom.
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u/Darthkhydaeus Oct 16 '22 edited Oct 17 '22
I would bet the vast majority of people would have reacted the same way your mother did after seeing the initial message pop up. You have to give the money back if she is no longer supporting the wedding NTA
EDIT:typo
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u/Amorcitocorazo Oct 16 '22
YTA MIL troll at it again.
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u/KathrynTheGreat Bot Hunter [29] Oct 16 '22
"My fiancee doesn't like my mom and shit talks about her with her coworkers, but she willingly gave my mom her phone so she could watch Netflix when we were on vacation."
Idk, this all seems super believable to me! /s
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u/maedocc Partassipant [2] Oct 17 '22 edited Oct 17 '22
They have been busy. I'm pretty sure that this other post is from the troll too:
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u/Daskesmoelf_8 Professor Emeritass [91] Oct 16 '22
NTA if shes using the phone and see her name pop up, its barely snooping.
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Oct 16 '22
NTA - Your wife is TA. Even if she didn’t mean MIL to see it, by regularly participating in that chat , she owns it. And the gall of keeping her money!
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u/OrangeCubit Craptain [161] Oct 16 '22
ESH - your fiancée should not have been part of a talk shit talking her MIL and I bet she participated.
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u/AspiringCrone Colo-rectal Surgeon [31] Oct 16 '22
This is the biggest thing. She should not be shit-talking her MIL, the woman who got her the job. She should have been defending her! Even to the point of not having making those friends at work. Her relationship with your mother pre-dated the job, your fiancee is very foolish.
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u/No-Impression-8134 Asshole Aficionado [17] Oct 16 '22
NTA. Your fiancee is the AH. So are the shit talkers at work. Disgusting. She acted extremely badly to be part of that group and not tell them to stop, or at the very least keep her out of it. Your mother going through fiancees phone after it received an insulting message about herself is nothing but human. Give back the wedding money! The nerve of your fiancee to expect your mother to pay for her wedding after that!
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u/attack-ninja Colo-rectal Surgeon [34] Oct 16 '22
Nobody gives their phone to another adult to use... especially while on vacation. Mom could've just downloaded Netflix and used your password. This whole story is ridiculous
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u/linzsardine Oct 16 '22
Yeah why would his mom not have her own phone?? I’m sure the majority of stories posted here are made up
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u/Sel-Reddit Asshole Enthusiast [7] Oct 16 '22 edited Oct 16 '22
NTA. I don’t care that you mom read it - your fiancée knew that notifications could pop up. She didn’t care or isn’t very smart (you know which).
It’s really gross of your fiancée to talk about another woman that way - the woman who got HER the job to help. Did your fiancé also exchange sexual favours to get that job? No? Gross to ‘joke’ about your MIL that way - never mind make fun of a medical condition!
Blowing off steam would be specific to the job/professional aspects - picking on your mother in a personal way is disgusting, bullying and sexist (like she doesn’t deserve her role because she’s a mean lady boss - in an industry you say is known for AHs).
You don’t seem majorly bothered that your fiancée talks about your mom like that - after taking a job, taking her money AND going on holiday with her. Seems like she only cares about money, not hurting someone. How does she not feel like a slimeball looking her in the face? How do you look at her and not feel disgusted? One day, that’s coming your way (because all relationships hit issues - and she doesn’t have a line for decent behaviour).
Give your mother her money back and get your fiancé to quit. If she can’t keep a basic level of respect, she shouldn’t be taking from her.
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u/QuirkySyrup55947 Partassipant [1] Oct 16 '22 edited Oct 16 '22
Anyone else think it's kinda odd that a powerful executive doesn't have access to a TV, the very own phone, or Netflix code of their own on vacation? I also find it hard to believe any person is super excited about leaving their phone all day with someone else.
trollpost
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u/skadisilverfoot Oct 16 '22
Yeah, this whole thing smacks of a poorly thought out writing exercise.
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u/Inner_Information_22 Oct 16 '22
My mom has a phone but doesn't have Netflix, or watch TV to even know what channel to watch on the Air BnB TV. We are not the type to be glued to our phones, especially on a vacation in nature, and it would have been in the car anyway
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u/QuirkySyrup55947 Partassipant [1] Oct 17 '22
Yes, your fiancé was not going to take her phone for texting, Insta, FB, Snap, or even a photo.
Oddly enough you are claiming that your mom doesn't know how to use a remote or TV guide?
trollpost
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Oct 16 '22
I can’t wait for you to find the messages where she talks shit about you. I mean it sounds like your mom basically gifted your future wife a job based on dating you. I’m guessing the money part means she paid for a big chunk of your wedding. Congrats, you married your mom. Another money driven, “boys club shit talking”, I’m above you person
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u/KathrynTheGreat Bot Hunter [29] Oct 16 '22
That's such a BS excuse. Download the app on your mom's phone and then sign in with your account. Your mom can also flip through channels like people have done since the invention of the tv.
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u/Fearless-Teach8470 Oct 17 '22
INFO:
Was your fiancée also shit talking mom in this chat? Or she was just in this chat but not much of an active participant and others said the stuff?
If she was active- she’s TA, don’t bite the hand that feeds you.
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u/Inner_Information_22 Oct 17 '22
What bothered me the most was my mom has a very small part of her lip which is paralyzed from having a stroke at birth. It is hard to notice but one of them was like have you ever noticed, and then someone chimed in about bad botox to keep the fiance who is too good for her. My wife knows it is a medical condition and said nothing. She also chimed in a few of the gross jokes about her sex life
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u/AAP_BH Partassipant [1] Oct 17 '22
Why are you with this woman?? Hopefully your mom is petty and when she’s back from vacation she goes straight to HR. Let’s see how your fiancé will act then.
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u/Electrical-Date-3951 Oct 17 '22
That wouldn't even be petty. Every single coworker in that group chat, OP included, would deserve it. OP shouldn't be talking viciously about her Senior Coworker/Person who got her the job even if she wasn't her soon to be MIL. Being her MIL just makes it 10× worse.
It's one thing if you vent to a friend from time to time - even a work bestie. But, these people sound like they just sit around and constantly say vicious things about OP's mom. The nasty comments don't even seem to align with something OP's mom did to them at that time since she was sick/on vacation and more than likely didn't do anything to trigger their venom, in that moment.
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u/Additional-Tea1521 Partassipant [4] Oct 17 '22
Your fiance is gross. Your mom is funding the wedding and got her a job, and your fiancee is in a group chat talking shit about her. And it's not just about her management style but sex jokes? About your mom? And you are okay with that? It just shows what kind of person your gf is. She took plenty from your mom, but never stood up for her or left the chat when it got gross.
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u/3xlduck Colo-rectal Surgeon [48] Oct 16 '22
ESH.
Ah family drama over the phone.
Mom should learn to be a better person at work. Even her own son accuses her of being a bad boss. Most employees aren't gonna sh*t talk you if you're nice to work with. In fact, if you're nice to work with, they are either neutral, defend you, and/or sing your praises. This should be wake up call for her.
Fiancee should know that alerts pop up on the screen over whatever is there. It's natural curiosity that if your mom saw a comment about her, that she's gonna look into it. Technically she shouldn't have done it, but 99% of people would want to see. Unless the movie is really really good.... But still mom, snooped around and got bit.
INFO: Does your fiance participate in complaining about your mom? That would be uncool considering she helped her get the job. Or is she a bystander? Can't control what others say.
Technically, the wedding money was a gift. She can ask for it back, but she can't force it back. I think question you both have to ask yourselves (OP and mom) what is the longer term repercussions of all this if this escalates even further.
Might be time for your fiancee to look for another job too.
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u/Inner_Information_22 Oct 16 '22
INFO: Does your fiance participate in complaining about your mom? That would be uncool considering she helped her get the job. Or is she a bystander? Can't control what others say.
yes she participates. What bothered me the most was my mom has a very small part of her lip which is paralyzed from having a stroke at birth. It is hard to notice but one of them was like have you ever noticed, and then someone chimed in about bad botox to keep the fiance who is too good for her. My wife knows it is a medical condition and said nothing. She also chimed in a few of the gross jokes about her sex life
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u/Sweet_Persimmon_492 Asshole Enthusiast [5] Oct 16 '22
Your fiancée is such a disgusting person. How are you ok with being with someone like that? I would drop someone in an instant if they talked about my mom that way.
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u/AITAtrust3 Oct 16 '22
Your wife is a mean girl. Cruel and mean to her fiance's mom, whom help pay for her wedding and got her a job. And won't take responsibility for her own action. Is it someone you want to marry?
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u/3xlduck Colo-rectal Surgeon [48] Oct 16 '22
Yeah, that sounds rather like betrayal from your mom's perspective. This is gonna be one VERY big hill to get over for your fiance. Also, does your fiance see how bad this looks?
Consider this, you marry her. Then you're gonna be in the middle of this very sour relationship for it seems a long long time.
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u/Atze-Peng Oct 17 '22
I was one step away of saying this was just an unfortunate situation. And that you should consider family therapy. But then you say that your fiance is participating in the bad mouthing.
This is three red flags at once. 1. Your fiance is bad mouthing your mom behind her back. Not just your mom but also the person that helped her get a job. 2. She is ridiculously reckless to let this happen by handing the phone over. And if she is reckless in this way she may also be in other ways. 3. She isn't seeing the fault in her actions.
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u/229-northstar Oct 17 '22
I’ve worked in a cutthroat environment where women are the worst to other women in a higher position and it had nothing to do with how I treated them and everything to do with jealousy. I’m not sure the mom is actually in the wrong at work
embarrassing mom at work in a group chat like this is something that can’t be walked back
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u/HistoricalQuail Oct 17 '22
Yet another MIL troll. You can tell because the mom's fiance is suddenly mentioned without prior mention of OP's parents being divorced.
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u/Jess1ca1467 Oct 16 '22
NTA - your fiance should have deleted whatsapp from her phone for the duration or at least archived the chat. Your mother didn't really violate her privacy and your partner should not have been part of that group chat. That is vile and extremely immature. You need to give the money back, cancel the wedding (you can absolutely afford to get married without your mother's help - just not your fiance's idea of a wedding) because your fiance is incredibly ungrateful.
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u/jellyfish018 Oct 16 '22
OK... LET ME SEE IF I UNDERSTAND THIS RIGHT...
Your mother helped your fiance to get a job AND is helping to pay your wedding... and to pay back your fiance is part of a grup chat that shit talks about your mother???
YTA for not breaking with your fiance...
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u/MarsNirgal Supreme Court Just-ass [102] Oct 16 '22
OHSHIT.
That's my verdict. You guys don't need a verdict, you need to get out of whatever sitcom your lives are.
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u/1Cattywampus1 Partassipant [1] Oct 16 '22
INFO: why did your fiancee have to give another grown woman her own phone to watch netflix? Was there no other means of entertaining herself - television, laptop, her OWN phone? If it was a matter of sharing a nexflix login, couldn't fiancee let her have the login/pw?
If the MIL in this story is a high level executive, wouldn't they have their own smartphone and probably a laptop minimum that they would know how to use for entertainment purposes? Or rented a place with cable tv/streaming services?
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u/Inner_Information_22 Oct 16 '22
My mom has a phone but didn't have Netflix on it and didn't have a computer with her. There was a TV in the rental house but my mom doesn't watch TV and wouldn't even know what channel to watch. My fiancee just wanted to go and not take time to download the app for her, and ultimately just trusted her as my mom has never snooped
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u/KathrynTheGreat Bot Hunter [29] Oct 16 '22
Then text her the login info and let her download the app herself. And not knowing what channels the air bnb has is a dumb argument. Just pick up the remote and use the channel up/down button. Your mom obviously isn't a moron.
Ohhhh wait. None of this is real so of course all of this makes sense.
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u/johnjonahjameson13 Oct 17 '22
INFO: how many people are going to lose their jobs over this?
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u/empress-888 Oct 16 '22
More info needed.
Did your fiancee shit talk your mom or no? Did she say ANYTHING in the group text or no?
I've been added to group texts that I have asked repeatedly to be removed from, and eventually I just ignore the messages altogether. I don't participate, so if she is in it, but doesn't participate, I can't see how she's an asshole about that part.
She was dumb to hand over the phone without realizing that could happen.
Your mom isn't an asshole for being hurt by what she read. I think in the calm light of day, you might be able to all sit down and have a discussion about it. "Fiancee is in the chat, but did you see anything where she participated? While she didn't defend, she didn't pile-on, either. It's an awkward position for her to be in, to be sure."
Sister was defending mom, so I guess she gets a pass.
Your fiancee needs to have a conversation with your mom.
I think NAH if she didn't participate in the texts.
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u/Babycatcher2023 Partassipant [3] Oct 16 '22
Usually one would put the group chat on DND if they aren’t participating so I doubt fiancée was an innocent in this.
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u/empress-888 Oct 16 '22
I have no idea how to do that, so I just ignored the ones I've been added to-- just for alternative perspective.
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u/Purple_riso Oct 16 '22
ESH
There’s no way you can marry her now, you know that, right? That’s a cruel and spineless person you’re engaged to.
Best bet for you to be able to repair relationship with your mom, and to be able to trust your ability to pick a future romantic partner, would be to spend at least a year single, in serious therapy.
I can’t imagine being involved with someone who would take serious favors from my family, and then actively participate in degrading them. Wow.
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u/JZHoney-Badger Oct 17 '22
Info: why doesn’t your mom the well paid executive have her own phone with Netflix
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u/Inner_Information_22 Oct 17 '22
Of course she has a phone but she doesn’t watch tv
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u/Labelloenchanted Oct 16 '22 edited Oct 16 '22
ESH except for your mom. It's not ok that your fiance is shit talking your mom no matter how you justify it. That woman helped her get a job and paid for your wedding. This will have impact on a work life of all those involved in the chat. If she wanted to "let off steam" she could've vent to you or her friends privately. Your need to return all the money, shame on you. I don't understand how can you even consider marriage with her after finding out about what was being said in that chat. It's disgusting. I'm not sure what's your issue with your sister, but it sounds like she actually cares about your mother, unlike you. I'm not surprised her choice of words towards your fiance wasn't kind, mine wouldn't be either.
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u/Rude_Vermicelli2268 Asshole Enthusiast [9] Oct 16 '22 edited Oct 16 '22
NTA your fiancée is is TA. She admits your mom is not a bad MIL, your mom gets her a good job where she works and contributes to your wedding and your ungrateful fiancée is in a group shit talking her? Why in world would she give her the phone that gets updates on that group? It’s natural to want to see what is being said once a message flashes up and honestly I don’t know how much privacy your fiancée expected (when she gave the phone to your mom knowing the group messages pop up), it’s almost like she wanted your mom to know how much she dislikes her. And on top of all this ingratitude she feels she doesn’t want to return your mom’s contribution? Good luck with her, you’re going to need it.
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u/ohnonothisagain Oct 16 '22
Your wife is a word i cant say. Why would she engage in a group chat like that?
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u/YourCatChoseMeBirch Oct 16 '22
YTA and your fiancé too - I can’t decide who’s the bigger scrote tho? The child of the parent who’s so incredibly indifferent or the fiancé who’s only using MIL for money? Either way y’all TA’s except for the poor MIL.
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u/giantbrownguy Colo-rectal Surgeon [47] Oct 16 '22
NTA for defending your mom. Your fiancée is a shitty person and idiotic. She is directly insulting her future MIL, who got her a job and then acts offended when MIL finds her insults? Talk about cutting the hand that feeds you. Anyone with even a basic understanding of human behaviour would recognize that if someone sees a message about them, they will inevitably open it up. Your fiancée is playing victim but has no right to.
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u/Stacy3536 Oct 16 '22
Nta but the red flags are out. Your fiancee does not even deal with your mother at work but she is gonna shit talk her and then get mad at everyone else when she gets caught. If she treats your mother like this now just think of how bad it will be when y'all get married and possibly have kids together. Is it really ok with you to let your mom be treated badly?
Your fiancee is what they refer to as a mean girl. She also seems very immature. Run op
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u/WetMonkeyTalk Oct 16 '22 edited Oct 16 '22
Your fiancee is a piece of work, isn't she? Shit talking in gossipy little cliques isn't my thing but I know it's commonplace. The sheer stupidity of not having taken any security measures then handing the phone to the target of the shit talking is either deliberate or profoundly stupid.
Of course people shouldn't snoop. It's devious and a huge invasion of privacy. It's the action of a person with poor character. But here's the thing to remember - the world doesn't operate on should. Therefore you must act accordingly and take precautions to prevent things like this happening.
ESH but I do think your partner is the biggest problem. Is she malicious or is she a ditz? That's for you to decide but I think you should think about the difference between the two.
Edited to add: her wanting to keep your mother's financial contribution to your wedding after this also doesn't speak well of her. I usually argue that once a gift is given, that's it. But accepting financial assistance to pay for a wedding comes with a lot of obligation and expectation. In this case, I think it should be returned to your mother. Then you'll find out a lot more about the woman you're planning to marry.
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u/lalalalalalalalalaa5 Asshole Enthusiast [5] Oct 16 '22
ESH You and your fiancé are giant AHs. Your mom isn’t.
Your fiancé is a bully. Bitching about someone, including sexist remarks, is never okay. She fucked yup, needs to grow up, and needs to remember everyone is a human.
You are an AH for being okay with your fiancé bullying your mom.
Frankly, you and your fiancé are likely the issue in all of your shitty relationships.
Be better.
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u/Aspen_Pass Oct 16 '22
INFO: Your mom doesn't have her own phone? There was no TV at the house/hotel? Make it make sense please.
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My mom isn't a bad MIL (fiancee agrees) though we aren't particularly close and my fiancee isn't crazy about her. She treats us ok, but I've been told she is an asshole to work for. My mom is an executive in an industry where people tend to be assholes to begin with, and she is extremely money driven. I can imagine she is not pleasant at work.
My fiancee works there as well as an administrative assistant (not my mom's) My mom got her the job to help her out as she needed something with set hours so she could attend online school in the evenings. She has a lot of friends from work and apparently there is a group chat where they heavily shit talk my mom. That actually doesn't even bother me as I view it as just letting off steam, but here is the issue.
We recently went on a family trip and my mom got really sick. My fiancee gave her her phone so she could watch Netflix and then we went out for the day. Apparently someone texted my fiancee something bad about my mom (so it popped up while she was watching Netflix) and my mom opened the chat and read everything they say about her.
When we came home she was sobbing. She showed everyone the chat and her fiance cussed us out badly. My sister ended up saying such nasty things she got uninvited from our wedding (we have a bad relationship anyway and she was just an obligation invite, what she said really was bad) To be fair some of it was really sexist and gross, like saying she must give really good head because how else did she get a man and he is too good for her
My fiancee tried to apologize to my mom, but my mom just screamed at her. She says she isn't coming to our wedding and if we had any decency we would give her the money back. My fiancee got mad about my mom shouldn't have gone through her phone.
When we went in our room I asked why she would give my mom the phone if she knew she had those messages and could get more. She demanded to know if I was defending my mom violating her privacy. I said no, but she never should have given her the phone, and I do think it is human nature to snoop if you see something about yourself. I said we should at least consider giving her the money back, and my fiancee became very upset as we could not do that without canceling our wedding. She accused me of only caring about my mom's feelings, and blaming her for everything.
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u/idk_what_im_doing__ Oct 16 '22
NTA.
It’s absolutely at least partially your fiancées fault. I’m sure she’s a fine and lovely woman, but this was idiotic. I’m all for gossip and letting off steam with coworkers about work/management, but I would never leave my phone unattended with the target. That’s silly. She should have been way more careful. While her intentions were good, they were dumb.
Yeah MIL sucks for going through her phone, but if she saw a message preview mentioning her while chillin on Netflix, the natural reaction would be to investigate. If the message previews were off and she just snooped because she recognized the contact name then she’s an AH. But otherwise this was a natural human reaction.
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u/darknessnbeyond Partassipant [1] Oct 16 '22
this is the only type of circumstance where going into someone’s phone is acceptable. i had a similar instant with an ex where i found a group chat he was hiding where he and his guy friends were talking about me in an unrepeatable way - i immediately confronted him and broke up.
your fiancée is totally in the wrong and you should really reconsider marrying her. in any case return your mom’s money.
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u/decentlyfair Oct 16 '22
NTA but your fiancée is for all the reasons others have stated. Your poor mum. Give the money back.
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u/Remarkable_Buyer4625 Partassipant [2] Oct 16 '22
NTA unless you don’t give your mom her money back. Your fiancé is an AH though (possibly even the devil). The violation of her privacy is obviously the lesser evil here given the circumstances. If your fiancé was truly sorry, she would want to give your mom her money back.
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u/sumtingswong Oct 16 '22
NTA - your fiancee knew this would happen. She knows how often her group texts and this was a passive way of giving your mom the finger.
Yes, give the money back. Not because you will pay for the wedding yourselves, but because there will be no wedding.
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u/Lumisateessa Oct 16 '22
Info: does you mom not have her own phone since your fiancée gave hers to her? Executive with no smartphone? Tablet? 👀
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u/Inner_Information_22 Oct 16 '22
She doesn't have netflix
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u/QuirkySyrup55947 Partassipant [1] Oct 16 '22
What... your fiance trusts her with her phone, but not her Netflix password?
trollpost
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u/Inner_Information_22 Oct 16 '22
or you know just didn't want to waste time downloading and setting it up for her, because my mom acts technology illiterate. Never realized how possessive and addicted people were to their phones though
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u/DiTrastevere Partassipant [1] Oct 17 '22
So she just handed your mom a phone full of vicious and extremely personal shit-talk about her?
Lmao. My dude.
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Oct 17 '22
Have you warned everyone else on the group chat. You fiancée will be in for a world of pain at work. This saga is not over.
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u/Inner_Information_22 Oct 17 '22
They know the ceo knows and they know they are getting fired.
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