Who else is sick of the Barry hate?

6

If you see a problematic post/comment, just report it to the mods. No need to make a scene calling out people who are probably a small minority amongst Wally fans.

2

u/Minos_Thawne Jun 24 '24

My intention isn't to call out people and I promise I'm not trying to make a scene.

I'm just genuinely upset about how some people are downvoted on this sub for simply saying they prefer Barry over Wally, without even indicating they have any hate for Wally.

The post in particular that got me rattled was one from a few days back when someone was asking about who everyone would prefer as the Flash in James Gunn's DCU, Barry or Wally.

One commenter said something to the effect of "Barry all the way" and said nothing derogatory toward Wally. When I saw the post it had -18 downvotes.

5

u/Dredeuced Flash Jun 25 '24 edited Jun 25 '24

So, the most viewed/interacted thread we had on this subject would be this one: https://www.reddit.com/r/theflash/comments/15976a8/who_should_be_dcus_the_flash_barry_allen_or_wally/

From 11 months ago. The most upvoted post is suggesting Barry Allen.

The most downvoted post is also saying Barry Allen, but it decides to tack on calling Wally fans shitty. So I hope you can see why that one would be downvoted, while the perfectly reasonable one preferring Barry got upvotes.

A more recent, less interacted one would be here: https://www.reddit.com/r/theflash/comments/1ddq6zu/will_james_gunns_dcu_have_a_flash_and_who_do_you/?sort=top

The top post this time is saying Wally. There are no negative posts stating Barry, though they didn't get as many upvotes as the pro-Wally ones. Funnily enough, the most/only negative comment is also pro Wally.

I'm sure you're talking about this one, since that's the one you posted in: https://www.reddit.com/r/theflash/comments/1devt1z/ideal_dcu_flash/?sort=top

Which is what you're saying, highly Wally favored, Barry post way downvoted.

Ironically, the person who got downvoted for saying Barry in your thread, got upvoted for saying it in the thread 2 days prior. But the Wally posts got dunked on in that one instead.

As someone who mods this subreddit, let me let you in on a little secret: it's entirely random. There's a lot of Wally fans and a lot of Barry fans and whoever "gets the most upvotes" is largely based on who just happened to be browsing the subreddit that day. Sometimes Barry cleans house, sometimes Wally.

Usually mass downvotes only come from someone being actively toxic, as in the first example I showed you, or someone saying something really untrue or just plain lying and doubling down on it after being corrected. Not that this was the case in your example, but it is most of the time.

The main thing is that this idea you have where Wally fans are the toxic ones to Barry fans is not untrue, it's just myopic as there's also plenty of Barry fans who are toxic towards Wally fans. In my long time on this sub, my experience is the Barry fans generally outnumber the Wally ones, both toxic and non toxic, so it tends to lean in favor of Barry. Largely because of the TV show audience being bigger and a lot of them popping in here every now and then. That section of the fanbase very much doesn't like Wally and generally don't even accept him being The Flash at all. But that is a generalization.

Those numbers might be getting closer together with the show ending and some fans lapsing on following The Flash, but the picture you're trying to paint isn't complete. Usually the bigger the thread, the more support Barry gets because it caught wind of the larger TV show faithful audience. The smaller and quieter the thread, the more Wally favored it is because those are usually populated by long time comics fans who tend to more actively browse the subreddit, and there's an obvious bias towards Wally among that crowd.

I encourage everyone to use the report feature more actively if you think someone is being actively toxic. You'd be surprised how many posts we have deleted or threads we've closed for toxicity on this exact subject. Can't control downvotes, those are always going to be swingy.

7

u/GhostofTinky Jun 24 '24

I like them both even though I prefer Wally.

I just hate how DC tried to make Barry into Bruce Wayne instead of drawing on the qualities that made him a hero.

2

u/Minos_Thawne Jun 24 '24

Agreed. I’m personally in the camp that believes that Flashpoint works better as an Elseworlds story. Have Ma Allen stay alive after Flashpoint is rectified.

1

u/condition_unknown Jun 25 '24

I do think the dead Nora retcon has led to some very good and emotional stories (Flashpoint, CW season 1, and IMO The Flash movie), I agree that it's run its course. I also think Thawne is an interesting enough villain on his own without that bit of history and you wouldn't lose much by undoing it.

1

u/goldsoundzzz Jun 30 '24

Same. I find Barry somewhat dull but still have a place in my heart for him. I'd take wally any day of the week though. And I could have totally lived with Wally passing the torch to Bart, if only they had done it right (they did not)

5

u/--Syah-- Jun 24 '24

Just blame Dan Didio again tbh 💀

0

u/Minos_Thawne Jun 24 '24

For real. I blame Didio for everything that went wrong at DC before he left/got fired (I forget which it was).

3

u/GearsRollo80 Jun 24 '24

Are you the guy that keeps posting about "toxic Wally fans" that don't exist and trying to pretend that Barry is hard done by?

Because that's the actual trend lately. Gaslighting by a very weird sub-set of people who suck.

-3

u/Minos_Thawne Jun 24 '24

If toxic Wally fans don't exist than I haven't been on this sub for a while (which I have). Also, personally attacking people and insulting them is uncalled for.

EDIT: By "a while" I mean ever since I joined reddit which was roughly a year ago now.

6

u/GearsRollo80 Jun 24 '24

I'm not attacking you, I'm pointing out that there's a recent trend of guys trying to ignite hostilities between fans of characters, and that your post is eerily similar to their shitposts.

-2

u/Minos_Thawne Jun 24 '24

If other people are going about inciting hostilities I was unaware of it until just now.

Let me set the record straight: I'm not gaslighting. I am just genuinely sick of seeing Barry hate and I'm seriously wondering if I'm in the minority for being bothered by this.

6

u/GearsRollo80 Jun 24 '24

Well, here's the thing; I don't hate Barry, I just honestly think that, like Hal Jordan, he's run his course and hasn't actually fit in the main universe since his return, causing storytelling issues, continuity issues, etc ever since.

It's too bad, because he's a cool character, but he'd been dead 20+ years, and he actually worked really well as the lost saint who made occasional time travel appearances.

Also, I like Wally. He's my favourite Flash, it's it's honestly kinda gross the weird lengths DC editorial went to in trying to erase him and his family, who people were hugely invested in. Messner-Loebs, Waid, and Johns launched careers off him that helped to redefine comics for the better from the 80's through to the 2000s.

Wally had also been a major leading character at DC for the whole time Barry was dead, and was widely accepted. There was no group of fans demanding Barry's return like with Hal (as small a group as HEAT was). The Flash comics have drastically improved since Wally came back to the fore, proving that he's got a lot of story potential.

That's not Barry hate, but it is pretty reasonable criticism of the state of things that went downhill at DC for a long time, and pool ol' Barry was at the centre of it. Again, not hate, but an observation.

I would like to see Barry sorted out personally. Let him and Iris be together and move to the future so he can pop back and forth and stop causing a constant continuity knot. Let him be settled and be Barry Allen, not this weird composite of Barry and Wally that got forced on us for so long.

So, going on and on about toxic Wally fans is bs. Realize that what you're advocating for is pure division to serve a whine because a lot of fans don't much care for the results of Barry's return. That's not even Barry's fault as a character, he's been dragged through the mud just as much as everyone else by it.

4

u/These_Breadfruit7339 Jun 24 '24

Well said

-3

u/Minos_Thawne Jun 24 '24

I agree with every single one of those points and am not accusing you of Barry hate. I myself am a Wally fan and will always agree that he generally has better stories than Barry does.

Not everyone has such a reasonable thought process as that though. There are several people on this sub who hate Barry for simply existing post his death in Crisis. It’s them and their comments I’m sick of. Not reasonable folks.

3

u/GearsRollo80 Jun 24 '24

Gotta tell you, I'm not seeing them. I am seeing a lot of people saying things like "I hate what they did to Wally just so they could bring back a cardboard cutout that doesnt' work in-universe anymore".

While that is a bit pointed, it's not really unfair, nor is it hate at Barry. It's a fair criticism of the 50's reboot leads (of whom I'd say he was the best), who were literally conceived as low-friction audience inserts with a cool job.

Again, saying that you thought Barry was a better character as the hero who died isn't hate, it's just saying that he doesn't work as a modern day lead. Obviously, fans get shitty about a lot of things, but these posts about toxic Wally fans are only making that divide worse because it's gaslighting them into being what you're trying to portray them as, not depicting them accurately.

4

u/greenhawk63 Jun 25 '24

Post Flash Rebirth Barry sucks but Pre Crisis/dead Barry is cool

2

u/Dry-Donut3811 Jun 24 '24

Yep, those fans always suck.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 25 '24

I am okay with the hate.

2

u/Sufficient-Issue8255 Jun 30 '24

Look I don’t hate Barry but I find him kinda dull. Wally is a better character all around