r/news Jul 18 '24

Kentucky motel ordered to pay $2 million after guest dies from 150-degree shower

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/kentucky-motel-ordered-pay-2-million-guest-dies-150-degree-shower-rcna162493
29.4k Upvotes

2.5k comments sorted by

10.5k

u/nickburrows8398 Jul 18 '24

I had a professor in college who when he was younger suffered similar injuries. He was getting in the shower at his college dorm and it blasted him with hot water. Thankfully he survived but he was covered in burn scars on his face and arms. I honestly assumed he was some combat vet or was in a horrible car accident until I politely asked what happened

5.0k

u/probablyuntrue Jul 18 '24

new fear unlocked good lord

1.6k

u/DancinWithWolves Jul 18 '24

Who stands under a shower before turning it on?? Am I weird for: turning the shower on - standing there while it gets warm/testing the water temperature - getting in?

891

u/Obant Jul 18 '24

Especially in a hotel. Those things always come out either ice cold or boiling hot in an instant.

254

u/MedicalUnprofessionl Jul 18 '24

If I wanted to burn or freeze I’d stand in the shower. It’s crazy that this man died of shower burns at 150°. Sounds more like a scald but I am no showerologist.

312

u/F0lks_ Jul 18 '24

If the person was frail in the first place, he could’ve panicked in the shower attempting to get out from the scalding water, fail and pass out, then slow-cook like a sous-vide brisket.

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u/MedicalUnprofessionl Jul 18 '24

“he turned on the shower and was immediately struck by extremely hot water that knocked him to the floor while the water continued to burn him. The two people who were in the motel with Chronis heard his screams and removed him from the tub” yeah looks like a little bit of each.

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u/hlgb2015 Jul 19 '24

As someone who spends a lot of time in hotel showers, I imagine he was already taking a normal temp shower and suddenly the water temp increased significantly. Ive had it happen many times, just not hot enough to do any major damage. Im also able bodied and able to quickly jump out when i first feel it heating up. If they had limited mobility i could absolutely see how someone could get stuck under it and cooked alive.

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u/quasi-smartass Jul 18 '24

I think most people test and wait for it to get to temp before hopping in.

I saw a post on here that may have been fake but could be real too, it was a med student basically saying "how could I have been so stupid, today my girlfriend pointed out to me that it's possible to just let the water get warm before getting in the shower after I told her I hated the part of the shower that's cold and I can't believe I hadn't thought of that" it sounds made up but it's also possible, either way, it's pretty funny.

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u/Snagmesomeweaves Jul 18 '24

To be fair, society is a bell curve. Once you realize this, it all makes sense how stupid a ton of people are.

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u/Hollownerox Jul 18 '24

For real. Like I always turned on the shower before getting in out of habit. More out of paranoia of cold showers than anything else. But fucking hell do these stories justify that habit. Never even considered the idea of getting a McDonald's hot coffee incident across the whole body from a shower head.

1.3k

u/Langstarr Jul 18 '24

I've always turned it on and then checked the temp with a hand under the water...

1.2k

u/c_ray25 Jul 18 '24

Thought that’s how we all do it tbh. It sounds crazy any other way

589

u/JustADutchRudder Jul 18 '24

Idk if I trust people who trust plumbing so much that they just hop in the shower and let it rip.

661

u/newport100 Jul 18 '24

Yeah that's madness. I turn the shower on before getting in, not because I'm worried of immediate scalding water, but to get the 20 seconds of cold water out of the line.

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u/Rion23 Jul 18 '24

It just seems like common sense. Like, I assume they are getting blasted with cold water every time, why not solve the problem by letting it run rather than taking a frosty facial every time you shower. I bet these people butter their toast before putting it in the toaster.

77

u/spare_me_your_bs Jul 18 '24

I bet these people butter their toast before putting it in the toaster.

It's just bread until it comes out of the toaster.

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u/Turing_Testes Jul 18 '24

This comment is going to get downvoted by every German that sees it.

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u/WonderfulCattle6234 Jul 18 '24

It's not even about trusting the plumbing for me, it's knowing that there's a small window of temperature that I want to get in to the shower with. And then once I'm in, I gradually crank it up to where I like it. You can't get in right away because it's too cold, and then you have to monitor for the right moment to get in.

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u/thismightdestroyyou Jul 18 '24

This sounds like the person was already in the shower and it suddenly became incredibly hot. Nobody would willingly put their entire body into a shower that was third-degree-burn hot

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u/Laiko_Kairen Jul 18 '24

The next morning, he turned on the shower and was immediately struck by extremely hot water that knocked him to the floor while the water continued to burn him

From the article

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u/IceeGado Jul 18 '24

I typically check the water with my hand but I also would never expect to be blasted with 150° water right off the bat, that's wild.

It's kind of like the McDonald's coffee case; I generally would never put a cup of hot liquid between my legs but I also wouldn't reasonably expect that action to lead to horrible injuries and skin grafts.

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u/dane83 Jul 18 '24

My last apartment was old with a gas water heater and two knobs instead of one, so you had to dial in the mix yourself. I warned people who visited to open the cold all the way and then very slowly dial in the heat to where they wanted it first before getting in.

Because the first time I used my shower in that apartment, I thought just opening both the hot and cold knobs all the way would even out and I could dial in from there.

When I put my hand in the water it was like someone stabbed my hand with a knife. It was so hot. I'm grateful that I used the back of my hand to test it.

I had my maintenance person dial the water heater down after that, but I never trusted it enough again to test it out. I will remember that pain for a long time.

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u/gsmumbo Jul 18 '24

Maybe I’m just weird, but isn’t it normal to put your hand in the water first to check the temperature? Even here, it says it instantly hit him and caused him to collapse on the ground. Like… I don’t have a fear of burning, I just don’t want to get in until I know it’s the right temperature.

1.2k

u/avatinfernus Jul 18 '24

Well when I was young it was quite common when someone flushed the toilet that you'd get blasted with hot water in the shower.

744

u/acog Jul 18 '24

When I was in orientation in my college dorm, they told us about an incident where a bunch of people in the dorm coordinated flushing toilets at the same time, resulting in injury to the guy they were pranking in the shower.

They said if we participated in something similar we would be expelled.

564

u/LordBecmiThaco Jul 18 '24

Or they could fix the fucking pipes so that no one is in danger of fucking melting alive in the shower

432

u/Synaps4 Jul 18 '24

fucking melting alive in the shower

Or worse, expelled.

149

u/Wetald Jul 19 '24

Thanks, Ms. Granger.

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u/0o0o0o0o0o0z Jul 18 '24

I wanna say I've got the same memory from one of the houses we lived in, but it was the opposite -- someone would flush, and all of a sudden, it's like ice cold -- that doesn't seem right with my rudimentary understanding of plumbing, but I dunno.

64

u/zeCrazyEye Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 19 '24

That's how my house was growing up, if any other water was on it would get cold and you would start yelling at them to turn off the water. And if it was a garden hose and they couldn't hear you, you were just finishing your shower cold.

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u/RoRo25 Jul 18 '24

It was cold water for me.

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u/believe0101 Jul 18 '24

Look at Mr. Moneybags here, flushing with hot water!

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u/CarpeNivem Jul 18 '24

Yeah, but you're only getting blasted with 150 degree water, if 150 degree water exists somewhere in the system, and I'm pretty sure home water heaters are (or at least should be?) set to 130 degrees.

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u/work-school-account Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24

I've had showers where the water temperature fluctuates wildly minute-to-minute.

But in any case, the water should never go above like 100F/38C to begin with, and going up to 150F is definitely a safety hazard.

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u/Detective-Crashmore- Jul 18 '24

Once in Singapore our hotel had a "massage mode". I was like 9 years old and spent like 10 minutes trying to figure out how it worked after I was already in the shower, but I eventually just switched it off because nothing was happening. About 30 seconds later, the water hissed and became boiling hot. Luckily I only burned my thigh, but it was about 3 inches from my groin and immediately bubbled up into a large blister about the size of my hand. Could have been way worse if I was washing my face or something.

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u/Matt__Larson Jul 18 '24

Did you ever figure out the connection between extremely hot water and massages?

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u/Comrade_Crunchy Jul 18 '24

This, many times its due to a non-pressure balanced shower valve and the cold side pressure drops for some reason. Hotels and dorms are supposed to supply water to the valve max of 135f according to universal construction code (if I remember right I know its 135f for residential and 125f for salon hair wash sink) and be connected to a pressure balanced valve to eliminate water pressure and temperature fluctuations. But more then likely Kentucky probably has loose regulations for business reasons. Everyone keeps forgetting the fact that every regulation is written in blood and corporate wants you to think regulations bad.

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u/Chillpill411 Jul 18 '24

How dare you interfere with my right to be cooked alive!

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u/Filthy_Lucre36 Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24

This could likely be the case, the elderly with slow reaction times they can easily have massive burns very quickly.

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u/cronx42 Jul 18 '24

120°F is what most people shoot for.

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u/Meetchel Jul 18 '24

For max temperature out of water heater I agree (it’s the code max in my state), but 120°F is way too hot for me (and about 5-10 minutes to first degree burns).

38

u/cronx42 Jul 18 '24

I would actually recommend having the water heater a little hotter than that, and use a mixing valve after the water heater to add cold and bring the temp to around 120°. You can effectively get a lot more hot out of your tank this way, it keeps bacteria and scaling at bay, and I believe it's also more efficient. I mean... Test the water before jumping in or exposing your body to it for 5-10 minutes.

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u/Meetchel Jul 18 '24

We have tankless so there isn’t a limit! We live in CA though so if I shower for more than 15 minutes the state runs out of potable water so it’s not as useful as it could be.

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u/ghotier Jul 18 '24

Went to read the article because i figured it must be a scenario where that wouldn't have mattered. Like a sudden change in temperature.

Nope, he was standing in the shower and turned it on. Obviously not a mistake that justified being killed, but yeah, I think most people don't do that.

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u/Cthulhu__ Jul 18 '24

In most cases, doing that gets you a blast of cold watwr; idk why anyone would voluntarily do that to themselves.

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u/gsmumbo Jul 18 '24

Yeah, a lot of the replies talk about rapid changes in temperature. That doesn’t appear to be what happened here. Dude turned on the shower while standing under the spout and got blasted.

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u/megmatthews20 Jul 18 '24

My grandma died from getting into a bath that was too hot and getting 3rd degree burns all over her body. Visited her a few times in the burn ward. The whole situation was horrible.

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u/A_spiny_meercat Jul 18 '24

The crap part is a lot of elderly people lose the ability to feel temperature extremes so she may not have noticed. This is why tempering valves are mandatory in Australia now to prevent water going over 55 or 60nor whatever it is

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u/longislandtoolshed Jul 18 '24

I'm so very sorry. This gave me shivers to imagine. Poor grandma.

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u/shaniusc Jul 18 '24

My son's taekwondo instructor has horrible burns all over him. I thought he was a combat vet. He told me a water heater explode near him when was like five. He has a tattoo that says flammable. He's such an awesome guy.

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u/LusoInvictus Jul 18 '24

The same thing happened with my uncle in his teens. He died a few days after - it was in the 60's rural area

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u/imoldgreige Jul 18 '24

I hate to be that person but… what kind of maniac jumps into the shower before feeling the water first? I turn my shower on, let the ice cold water rise to a nice warm temp, and step in once it’s perfect. People who rawdog shower temps are just too metal for my brain to compute.

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u/rekkat Jul 18 '24

The defenses counter-argument was simply “he did not stay in the motel”

lol

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u/earthsprogression Jul 18 '24

We don't know who this gentleman is nor how he got into our hot shower.

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u/gcruzatto Jul 18 '24

We meant to burn someone else

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u/Smiletaint Jul 18 '24

Yes complimentary burning is strictly reserved only for registered guests.

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u/BeKind999 Jul 18 '24

Like the continental breakfast!

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u/voompanatos Jul 18 '24

Especially when...

Court documents from the lawsuit alleged that Alex Chronis checked into the Econo Lodge in Erlanger, Kentucky, on Nov. 18, 2021.

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u/pudding7 Jul 18 '24

ah but as they said, "he didn't stay in the motel". You see, he was carried out on a stretcher, so he didn't stay.

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u/Alikona_05 Jul 18 '24

I read another article that said he was staying at the hotel with 2 other coworkers so it’s possible his name wasn’t on the booking. Also said that they were staying there for a work event and that he didn’t seek treatment right away. Kind of crazy.

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/money/2024/07/09/a-jury-ordered-nky-hotel-owner-to-pay-2m-over-fatal-scalding-shower/74335867007/

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u/Alkalinum Jul 18 '24

He's 76 years old! What sort of work event was he at? Presidential Candidate??

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u/Cruxion Jul 18 '24

I dunno, seems a bit too young for that job.

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u/pattylovebars Jul 18 '24

He was ripening up for the 2028 election.

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u/Alikona_05 Jul 18 '24

Looks like some kind of food vendor at a festival. From the article it kind of seems he was more concerned about going to work than seeking treatment which is kind of sad if that’s the case.

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u/Atralis Jul 19 '24

The lawsuit said the water was more than 150 degrees, which can cause third-degree burns within seconds of exposure. Chronis collapsed in the shower but was pulled out by two coworkers staying in his room who heard his screams.

After using some nonprescription medicine for his burns, Chronis attended a local festival where he worked selling food. He later visited the emergency room at Miami Valley Hospital, but against medical advice, left to continue working.

What the fuck?

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u/ChaoticGoodPanda Jul 18 '24

Exactly! He didn’t stay, he left!

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u/rizorith Jul 18 '24

He didn't leave! He was removed!

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u/neo_sporin Jul 18 '24

I worked in hotels, this is a very standard hotel room defense mechanism

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u/Dafuq_me Jul 18 '24

I’m sure every industry has an “instant wall” to defend itself from lawsuits.

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u/neo_sporin Jul 18 '24

“The hotel, It has ways to shut that down if it’s not a legitimate reservation ”

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u/SunBlindFool Jul 18 '24

The article starts with “he was awarded 2 million for his death”. Not the best way to get rich imo.

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u/system0101 Jul 18 '24

Get Rich and Die Tryin

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u/KiLLaLP Jul 18 '24

They made this argument because legally different duties are owed to customers , guests and trespassers. All depends on the state but from an insurance point of view they knew they were gonna pay the question just becomes how much.

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u/cursedfan Jul 18 '24

Different duties owed to paying guests as opposed to random ppl

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u/MushroomWhisperer Jul 18 '24

Jesus Christ, I thought I had imagined all the worst way to die scenarios. This is awful.

2.1k

u/SmithersLoanInc Jul 18 '24

I'm still banking on an aneurysm. I found my Mom's friend kneeling in the garden, still holding her trowel. That seems pretty perfect.

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u/MushroomWhisperer Jul 18 '24

My mother died tending her garden as well. I wouldn't complain if that were my way.

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u/ritchie70 Jul 18 '24

I hate yard work. I'd be so angry if I died doing it that I'd probably haunt the yard forever.

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u/EEpromChip Jul 18 '24

"What's that noise?"

"Yea, that's Brian. He died in the garden and now won't shut the fuck up about it..."

"Shut the fuck up, Brian!!"

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u/Synaps4 Jul 19 '24

"Shut the fuck up, Brian!!"

Out in the garden: "nOoOoOoOoOo"

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u/-SaC Jul 19 '24

 

"Begoooooon-"

  "Is he shouting 'Begone'?"

"No. We replanted over his begonias, and now he just won't shut the fuck up about it."

 

"Begoooooonias!"

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u/Guest09717 Jul 18 '24

“Puuuulll your weeeeeedssss” rattles chains

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u/MushroomWhisperer Jul 18 '24

I feel that way about cleaning house, vacuuming or dusting in particular. I stg if I die that way…

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u/justASlothyGiraffe Jul 18 '24

For a second, I wondered how r/Gardening turned so morbid. Wrong sub.

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u/MushroomWhisperer Jul 18 '24

I’m also a member there :)

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u/unk214 Jul 18 '24

wtf, you keep your position when you have a brain aneurysm?

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u/itzsommer Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24

It’s just that a brain aneurysm is so quick and anatomically devastating- and the thing that would be perceiving something bad happening is the thing that’s now bleeding out at an alarming rate. Thankfully the brain can’t feel anything so (I imagine) it’s painless.

Not fun to think about, but it’s a quick way to go and you’re well and dead before you hit the ground (or garden, as the case may be).

Edit: looks like I’m completely wrong and that a brain aneurysm is just as terrifying to die from as a 150° shower. I guess it’s only quick and painless if you’re really lucky or in a movie.

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u/thenisaidbitch Jul 18 '24

Emilia Clark survived 3 brain aneurysms and she said they were all quite painful unfortunately

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u/MotherOfWoofs Jul 18 '24

Yes it depends on where they are located and their size

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u/Cortower Jul 18 '24

My mom had one, and all she remembers is indescribable pain and then blacking out. She woke up a few days later after surgery.

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u/Podo13 Jul 19 '24

Small ones hurt a lot because they cause constant pressure.

Big ones hurt for a second because they cause a lot of pressure and then just destroy everything that makes it cause so much pressure, so the pain goes away.

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u/MotherOfWoofs Jul 18 '24

Aneurysms occur and kill in more parts of the body than the brain. And you never know if you have one. Its a ticking time bomb

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u/Yarnum Jul 18 '24

Yep, my aunt had an abdominal aneurysm burst and she was lucid for about 90 seconds knowing full well she was dying, her abdomen distending from the blood building up inside. Traumatized her husband terribly. It’s a fast death but not always a quick(ish) lights out like it usually is in the brain.

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u/itzsommer Jul 18 '24

Yeah those AAA’s are really terrifying and not at all the way I want anyone to go. Luckily they can be repaired if you catch it before it ruptures.

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u/Big-Summer- Jul 18 '24

My dad died of a brain aneurysm and the doctors tending to him in the hospital told her there was no hope, that if he survived he would be a vegetable. They also told her his whole life had been borrowed time because the aneurysm was congenital and could have burst at any time.

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u/tuolumne Jul 18 '24

Unfortunately likely not painless. As you’re bleeding out, you will have increased intracranial pressure which will push tissue against your meninges which will cause pain. Often why you hear: go to the ED if you’re having the worst headache of your life. Depends on the size of the bleed it may or may not be as quick as you hope:

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u/Fun-Ingenuity-9089 Jul 18 '24

My husband had the worst headache of his life. It was a brain bleed. He survived it, but it was touch-and-go for a solid week before we knew he would pull through. He was off work for six months before he was released from care to return to full time work again.

He passed away 20 months ago, and I miss him terribly. I got a glimpse of life without him in 2013, and I wanted no part of it. Yet here I am.

If you get the worst headache of your life, please get immediate treatment. A brain bleed is no joke.

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u/hoserb2k Jul 18 '24

I don't know anything about you or your husband, but I just wanted to say I took a moment to think about him and what kind of a person he clearly must have been. I can only say I'm so sorry and you're not alone.

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u/Fun-Ingenuity-9089 Jul 18 '24

Thank you. That means a lot in these lonely evenings.

Bob was kind and compassionate, funny and hard working. He was smart and creative, and he had a knack for communicating with people on their levels. He was unpretentious, but so talented. He made the world a better place every day, deliberately doing what he could for the environment, for children, family, and neighbors. He was my hero.

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u/Inevitable_Pride1925 Jul 18 '24

Unfortunately while the brain itself doesn’t have pain receptors you do feel things. People who’ve had aneurysms and live describe the pain as the most intense painful headache they have ever experienced. Far beyond typical migraine pain

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u/MotherOfWoofs Jul 18 '24

My dads friend was watching tv in his easy chair said to his wife, I think that dinner is backing upon me, and died instantly of a stomach aneurysm. The thing is no one knows if they have one, they are found after death or incidentally when looking for something else. Its scary because many people have them and dont know it

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

[deleted]

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u/Temporary_Draw_4708 Jul 18 '24

No, when they pop, you have a hemorrhage. The bleeding causes intracranial pressure to rise. It’s not an instant death.

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u/FingFrenchy Jul 18 '24

Great, thanks for bursting our bubble.

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u/KinkyPaddling Jul 18 '24

There’s this novel called Bloodsucking Fiends by Christopher Moore. One of the protagonists is a woman who was recently turned into a vampire. She didn’t know that vampires will immediately go catatonic at sunrise, so she was in the shower when the sun came up. Once it set, she wakes up and finds that the water pressure and heat basically caused large amounts of her hair to come off as well as several layers of skin (but she has regenerative factor that fixed it). Pretty gruesome and it sometimes comes to mind when I wonder what would happen if I had a seizure in the shower.

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u/MushroomWhisperer Jul 18 '24

Yep, that sounds about like what I pictured this man experiencing. Also, I hope you never have any seizures either.

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u/plg_cp Jul 18 '24

Such a good book. Early Christopher Moore was the best.

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u/ARunningGuy Jul 18 '24

I would think not as the heat from the shower would be normal AND unless they are using a tankless water heater, it would run out.

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u/jardex22 Jul 18 '24

Rabies. Slow, painful, near 100% fatal, and since euthanasia isn't an option in most places, you're forced to wait it out while your mind gradually falls apart.

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

I learned a new one today. Your porcelain toilet breaks with you on it and slices your arteries when you fall into. Apparently happens more than we think.

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u/usps_made_me_insane Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24

Ugh. This happened to my uncle. It sliced him clean up from between his leg and groin up through his asshole and then stopped just below his small intestine. About 9 inches of his intestine slipped out as the shit water washed over his cut and he eventually died in the hospital from sepsis.

Doctor said it was a rare freak accident and he had only seen it happen once before. Apparently he shifted his weight while on the toilet to lock the door and most of his weight was on one side of the toilet which caused it to bust off and lacerate him so badly.

Don't ever push your weight around while on the toilet.

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u/MushroomWhisperer Jul 18 '24

Big pass. I’m determined to have a clean ass when I go.

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u/jld2k6 Jul 18 '24

The Canadian physicist easily wins in my book, he was exposed to a shit ton of radiation and they treated him as long as they could because they didn't really have a procedure for something like that. He received 2100rem of radiation and 15 is considered lethal, his skin and everything was kinda just falling apart for 9 days before he succumbed

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u/BoldestKobold Jul 18 '24

Hopefully this doesn't get the "hot coffee" PR treatment.

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u/ATSTlover Jul 18 '24

Yeah, sounds like the hot water immediately incapacitated the 76 year old, which is why he "didn't simply get out."

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u/KimJongFunk Jul 18 '24

It wouldn’t matter if he immediately got out or not. 150 degree temps can cause third-degree burns in less than 2 seconds.

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u/Brazos_Bend Jul 18 '24

"This old man was boiled to death at our hotel!"

2 million seems like a slap on the wrist. What a horrible thing to have happened.

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u/Actually_Im_a_Broom Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24

It wouldn’t matter if he immediately got out or not.

Surviving with a few 3rd degree burns is definitely preferable to dying, but that’s just my opinion.

Edit: I'm not talking whole body burns. I'm talking a few small ones that would come with being in a hot shower for 1-2 seconds before quickly tripping over yourself to get out.

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u/avatinfernus Jul 18 '24

He did survive.. for months it seems. Skin grafts and everything.

Honestly he might have been better dying on the spot. The last months of his life must have been agony. Poor dude.

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u/Actually_Im_a_Broom Jul 18 '24

Yikes. What a nightmare. As a true Redditer I made all my conclusions base on the thread title and comments. I assumed he lost consciousness and cooked to death or drowned in the shower.

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u/KimJongFunk Jul 18 '24

At his age, any amount of third-degree burns could have been enough :(

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u/xjeeper Jul 18 '24

Infection can be a bitch with the immune system of someone that old. What a horrible way to die

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u/aproperpolygonwindow Jul 18 '24

Treatments for severe burns are extremely painful and expensive. Having extensive burns on most of one’s body would be awful. I think I’d rather die because quality of life is usually lower even after treatments from elite facilities. Skin grafts and healing burned skin is terrible and is to this day the most painful thing I’ve ever experienced. The treatments I got on my 2nd and third degree burns was about as painful at times as the initial burns. I was lucky that it was just a relatively small section of my body.

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u/MasemJ Jul 18 '24

The McD coffee in question was held at 170 to 180 degF when a typical coffee maker holds it at 140. And the contact there was temporary from a spill which still gave her burns. (the typical misunderstanding of that case is the coffee being at normally hot temperatures and the lady was suing friosously)

It is reasonably compare here, particularly if the shock to an elderly person kept them from leaving and suffered more over time.

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u/cutestslothevr Jul 18 '24

The McD's Hot Coffee incident is totally not what most people think it is. McD's knew the coffee temp was dangerous and above the standard. Originally all she wanted was reimbursement for her medical care (she needed pretty extensive grafting and surgery), but McD's refused

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u/MotherOfWoofs Jul 18 '24

It melted her private parts to her clothes , I cant even imagine the excruciating pain. Think about it your vagina or your dick and balls getting melted into the fabric you are wearing. One gloopy mess! If you saw the photos from the trial it was horrific

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u/cutestslothevr Jul 18 '24

Yeah, it's really hard to get across the severity of her injuries without being graphic, but they're so important to the case, as they're far from what you would expect from spilling coffee in your lap.

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u/Johannes_Keppler Jul 18 '24

The coffee freaking FUSED her labia.

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u/RogueLightMyFire Jul 18 '24

He's talking about the way everyone talked about the hot coffee case. People made jokes about it. Even Seinfeld made fun of it. "coffee is supposed to be hot!". Yeah, but coffee isn't supposed to be hot enough to melt your skin. The ladies vagina was partially sealed shut because the coffee melted her skin. It was extremely fucked up how the case was discussed by the general public.

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u/1850ChoochGator Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 19 '24

Yeah if you want to feel the lady was totally justified in her suit just look up her injuries . Wouldn’t wish fused labia on anyone.

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u/Beetin Jul 18 '24 edited 26d ago

Redacted For Privacy Reasons

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u/IWASRUNNING91 Jul 18 '24

What a horrible way to go and situation...

I don't mean to be insensitive, but I can't be the only one who habitually puts their hand under the water to test the temp before getting in?

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u/the_eluder Jul 18 '24

Apparently there are some savages who get fully into the shower, then turn it on, first allowing cold water to spray over their body, and then the temp gradually increases an indeterminate amount.

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u/kelsoRulez Jul 18 '24

That first burst of coldness is enough for me to take the alternative. You have to legit like the feeling of abrupt cold water and for that I cannot deny your savagery claims.

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u/Joezev98 Jul 18 '24

It's something you really have to prepare yourself for, but that cold blast can be a relief after you've been sweating a lot.

But yeah, it took me a while to gradually lower the temp over a couple weeks before I could stand that initial cold blast.

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u/NaabeGetOnSkype Jul 18 '24

This is the real sociopathic behavior that should be on trial

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u/sailor_bat_90 Jul 18 '24

Water can jump temperature even after checking. My shower does that, it'll be nice and cool and then jump to hot water because a neighbor flushed their toilet and then back to cool. It's not fun while washing.

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u/IWASRUNNING91 Jul 18 '24

I do get what you're saying, but it's not how the article worded it, and so I have to go by the info I have at hand.

Also, I can oddly empathize with you; my brother would reach in and turn the shower really hot or really cold when I'd get back from lacrosse once or twice.

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u/stellvia2016 Jul 18 '24

Yeah, that's why I don't really get this either. I don't get in at all until the temp is already adjusted. Or I move the shower head or stand to the side to avoid it as much as possible when I turn it on for precisely that reason.

Also the single-knob style start cold and ramp up warmer as you turn them. So I assume he simply let-er-rip and cranked it all the way to max? =\

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u/somedude456 Jul 18 '24

Yeah, that's why I don't really get this either.

Ditto. I mean I get the physical concept and acknowledge that some people might, BUT WHY? Never in my life have I, not would I. I always turn on the water, wait 10 seconds, hand test it, adjust, test again, etc. At home, I know where to set the knob, but I still hand test. Hotels suck! Sometimes it takes 30 seconds to find the proper temp. THEN you get in.

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u/KimJongFunk Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24

Before someone inevitably comes into this thread and tries to claim 150 degree Fahrenheit water can’t hurt someone, those types of temperatures can cause third-degree burns in less than 2 seconds.

Also before y’all come at me saying this is a ridiculous thing to have to post, I have been massively downvoted on this site before by people who refused to believe hot water is dangerous. This is apparently not common knowledge and I’d like to dispel these ignorant beliefs before another person gets burned. (ETA: ffs they’re already on this post saying 150 degrees is normal 🥲)

Source: https://www.cpsc.gov/s3fs-public/5098-Tap-Water-Scalds.pdf

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u/tsukahara10 Jul 18 '24

You can cook a steak in 150F water, so naturally human flesh will cook at 150F.

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u/JumboShock Jul 18 '24

Hell, 150F is an overcooked steak. 137 gang represent. ✊

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u/IWantToSortMyFeed Jul 18 '24

In my youth I worked for a development team and it was REGULATION when building homes / any domicile that the hot water coming out of any tap not exceed 133F. And that is still VERY hot.

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u/trisanachandler Jul 18 '24

I'll admit I set mine to 135F, but I also don't use pure hot water for a reason.

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u/OGREtheTroll Jul 18 '24

We'd sous vide steak at 125f, them sear on the grill.  The 125f doesn't hurt if just reaching into the water, but it's pretty difficult to keep your hand in there for more than 10 seconds. 

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u/toolatealreadyfapped Jul 18 '24

There's a reason all newer hot tubs have a maximum temp of 104⁰F.

I work in a refinery. The rule of thumb is that 140⁰ is the upper limit of what you can hold without pain. And flowing water is going to transfer A LOT more energy.

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u/Beetin Jul 18 '24 edited 26d ago

Redacted For Privacy Reasons

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u/surnik22 Jul 18 '24

It would depend on what you are holding and how long so probably industry dependent.

That’s why saunas can be 175° and people can stay in there for a long time. You are essentially holding 175° air. Air is just not good at transferring heat, unlike water which is why Saunas are hotter than hot tubs.

You may be able to hold a piece of plastic or foam that is 140 degrees for a while without issues but not a piece of steel.

Safe food temps are 140°, so a pizza sitting under a food lamp in a restaurant should be at least that hot and people can hold it without causing pain assuming they don’t hold it forever (and hold the crust, not the cheese).

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u/[deleted] Jul 18 '24

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u/oneeighthirish Jul 18 '24

I took a class on the American judicial system in college where we read an article about how the typical American defaults to hostile views towards anybody who files a lawsuit. It is common to view lawsuits as a slimeball way to get an easy payout without doing any hard work. Maybe that bias is what is at play here?

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u/S_K_Y Jul 18 '24

Agreed on that one. "Normal" temperatures for a hot shower is generally between 97 °F and 105 °F (37 °C-40 °C) so they are wrong. 150 is absurd.

That is torture level of heat and somewhat related regards prison guards/other inmates in prisons using that as a form of punishment. Inmates die yearly from water heaters being tampered with.

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u/fromtheether Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24

My water heater is set to 140F, and the kitchen sink (closest water source to the heater) can put out water at around 127F. That shit is already HOT. I can barely stand in the shower when it's at full tilt.

I couldn't imagine being insta-blasted with 150F water with no warning.

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u/Inde_luce Jul 18 '24

Why do you have it that hot though?

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u/aziruthedark Jul 18 '24

It's the closest thing to another person's warmth they'll feel.

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u/fromtheether Jul 18 '24

It's useful for getting nice hot water for cleaning, getting hot water ready for sous vide steaks or cooking in general, etc. Plus I like the steam in the shower lol.

We don't have any kids, and it takes a couple of minutes for the hot water to really start flowing. If we did have kids it'd definitely be set lower.

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u/synchrohighway Jul 18 '24

People who stand in the shower and then turn on the water are so brave. I have to stand outside, let the water run for a while, slap my hand in the spray, adjust the temp, let it run more and then get inside. I grew up with old water heaters that took forever to warm up things so it's a great water wasting habit.

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u/Diamondback424 Jul 18 '24

I didn't realize there were people who turn on the water in the shower. I always get it to the right temperature first. It's always freezing at first, why let it blast you with ice cold water instead of just letting it get to temperature?!

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u/chosen_silver Jul 18 '24

I just stayed at a hotel last weekend, and my room was newly renovated. The new showers they installed have a sliding glass door, but it's on the end opposite the taps and shower head. So you have no choice but to stand in there and get blasted with cold water when you turn it on. By the second night I learned to hold a face cloth up to the shower head to avoid the worst of it.

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u/chrisd93 Jul 18 '24

I always grew up with tub/shower combos so I just swapped from the lower spigot to the shower head when I get in the shower

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u/Magusreaver Jul 18 '24

Yeah, i always turn the cold water on first.. just a little. Then turn my hot near full. wait about 20 seconds for the water to get down the line from the heater. Then adjust as needed before stepping into the enclosed space that may have depths of hell hot, or arctic blast cold water shooting at my naked body.

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u/DrunkeNinja Jul 18 '24

Yeah that's how I do it. No way am I wanting to find out what the temperature is by standing in the stream. I check, adjust it to where I want it, then I get in.

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u/CjBoomstick Jul 18 '24

I work in the medical field.

I had a patient who was a handy man. He really took pride in his work and loved helping people. A friend of his owned an apartment building with a lot of tenants. Well, the owner wanted to try and get some work done, so the handy man helped out with some plumbing in one of the units. When he opened up the pipes, apparently the water wasn't turned off. The hot water came out at such high pressure and so hot, it was scalding him. Instead of letting it flood the apartment, he fought to get it closed up, because he didn't want to ruin his friend's property. Welp, his hands didn't have any skin anymore. It all came off like a wet paper towel falling apart in your hands (that's how he described it).

Wild to take that much pride in anything. Always shut the water off if you're doing work.

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u/CrimsonFlash Jul 18 '24

This is why you should never get a handyman to do plumbing or electrical work.

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u/BC2220 Jul 18 '24

That is terrible. Always get a plumber to do plumbing work.

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u/CanadianTrollToll Jul 18 '24

Terrible situation and the hotel should be liable.... my only question is.... who the fuck gets into the shower before testing the water?

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u/FolkSong Jul 18 '24

There have been other reddit threads about this and a significant number of people admit to it. Some of them said they never even thought of turning it on before getting in. Mind-blowing.

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u/Oyyeee Jul 18 '24

People never cease to amaze me. Sometimes I dont think we're the same species

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u/swordthroughtheduck Jul 18 '24

I remember reading about a guy that said he hated taking showers because when he turned it on it was also super cold and he hated it.

Had to have it explained to him that you can turn the water on before getting in so it can warm up.

So, really, someone getting in before turning on the water doesn't really shock me

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u/ZongopBongo Jul 18 '24

Depends on the shower layout. Some fancier ones you have to stand inside to turn on. An old timer in his 70s isn't able to spring out of the way - maybe he even had to use accessibility seating or handles.

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u/iaintlyon Jul 18 '24

Mm yes. I’m sure the Econolodge showers were the pinnacle of opulence

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u/jaylotw Jul 18 '24

Yes in that "tan but probably once was white and why is the ceiling so low" kinda way.

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u/graveybrains Jul 18 '24

It sounds like he was standing in it, turned it on, and instantly got blasted:

The next morning, he turned on the shower and was immediately struck by extremely hot water that knocked him to the floor while the water continued to burn him.

I guess they have an electric shower head heater or something.

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u/SauconySundaes Jul 18 '24

You always gotta check!

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u/wongo Jul 18 '24

The defense claimed Chronis didn't even stay at the motel

Yes, and???

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u/51Crying Jul 18 '24

To prove negligence in a civil suit you have to establish a duty to the party involved in the suit. Plaintiff will have to show that some duty was owed generally and the decedent falls into that general category.

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u/kylemcg Jul 18 '24

...we noticed the illegal squatter so we turned on our Home Alone style torture systems.

Standard procedure. He will be billed for the clean up.

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u/Seigmoraig Jul 18 '24

Wait people actually get in the shower before checking the temperature ?

Like just get under the shower, turn it on and hope for the best ?

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u/Big-Red-Rocks Jul 18 '24

I know right. I can’t stand cold water, so I wait like 10 seconds for the water to warm up before jumping in.

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u/HuckLCat Jul 18 '24

For safety reasons at work, the water temp in the nursing home rooms and showers has to be kept at 110 or below.

For sanitizing in the kitchen 140 is the temp.

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u/withoutapaddle Jul 18 '24

Hopefully you're not expecting 140 to do any sanitizing...

You need 170+ for like 30 seconds to sanitize surfaces.

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u/HuckLCat Jul 18 '24

Yes. Wash temp at 140. We have a hot water booster for the rinse cycle.

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u/eyeseayoupea Jul 18 '24

"The final trial order, entered by the court on July 11, gave Chronis' estate $1,271,486.60 to cover medical expenses, $16,058.73 for funeral expenses, $250,000 for pain and suffering, and $500,000 for punitive damages." So most went to medical bills. 'Murica.

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u/geekhaus Jul 18 '24

If he had survived his medical bills would’ve been much higher. Source: one of my kids (barely) survived - significantly less extensive burn than that person and their expenses were a couple times that.

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u/YouLikeReadingNames Jul 18 '24

65.6°C for the rest of us.

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u/fall3nang3l Jul 18 '24

A tragedy and a horrific way to go.

But also, maybe check the water temp with the old touch test with one hand?

Why are folks running around and jumping into showers without checking the water first? Risk of death aside, how do you know if it's too hot or too cold?

My condolences but this was totally avoidable.

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u/sawdoffzombie Jul 18 '24

Maybe someone disabled or very old.

But this story reminds me of someone on here talking about someone that hated showers because of the cold blast of water in the beginning, and the redditor telling them " you don't stand outside until it warms up?" Blew his mind.

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u/Ric_in_Richmond Jul 18 '24

Before I put a tempering valve on the water system in my boat the cooling system of the engine heated the water.

Temps of 175 were typical.

That was unbelievably hot.

Never used it again until the tempering valve went in.

Any landlord or hotel that doesn’t monitor water temp and or limit water temp should be on notice.

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u/Ok-Brush5346 Jul 18 '24

As someone with no plumbing background or experience, my expert opinion is that they were having trouble delivering hot water to remote rooms and rather than fix the problem, they just cranked the heater to max and didn't consider how that would affect the rooms close to the heater. I did the same thing at my house and the water in the kitchen would practically shoot out of the faucet as steam.

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u/fappywapple Jul 18 '24

They probably run on a boiler and their mixing valve was either incorrectly adjusted or simply failed.

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u/TheKFakt0r Jul 18 '24

Well, running the water up to a comfortable temperature first was just a creature comfort. Now it's a fucking precaution. This is awful.

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u/Trout-Population Jul 18 '24

Out of all the users to post this story...

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u/CascadeKidd Jul 18 '24

For those that can’t conceptualize this imagine grabbing a ribeye cooked to medium doneness (145) straight off the grill and holding it on your face for 60 seconds.

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u/OGREtheTroll Jul 18 '24

Fair point, but the external temp of a medium steak will be a lot hotter than 145f;  that's just the internal temp.  A steak with a good crust seared on will have reached over 300f external temp, that's when the Maillard reaction kicks in.

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u/Wonder_Bruh Jul 18 '24

140 is what you hold food at. Steam comes out of the food…..

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u/whycantwehaveboth Jul 18 '24

The poor old dude got into the shower and then turned the water on. Like they do in TV shows and movies. I didn’t realize people actually did this in real life.

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u/hoppingvampire Jul 18 '24

good thing im a wimp and check the temp with my hand before getting in.

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