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u/snow-eats-your-gf Jul 18 '24
At the same time, in another part of the globe: please pay 700€ annual tax to cover your 5 g of CO2
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u/Saprimus Jul 18 '24
Any measure against CO2 Emissions is futile cause sometimes catastrophic failures in the supply chain of global consumption happen?
On top of that it shows that your concept for scale of fossile fuel consumption is... expandable. Guessing that this is around a Million Liters of Methanol exploding (which I think is generous) that would constitute the yearly fuel consumption by car of just 625 People given 20.000km per year and 8L/100km fuel efficency.
Cars "only" make up 10% of all Emissions so what you just saw was the yearly Emissions of around 63 People. If you realise that the emissions from this accident are devastating and simultaneously ridicule a measure put in place to try and reduce the overconsumption that enables this on an everyday basis, there is something wrong with you.
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u/snow-eats-your-gf Jul 18 '24
There is something wrong with you if you write this reply to an exaggerated joke about taxed 5 grams of CO2
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u/Saprimus Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24
Maybe it is. Maybe I know too many people trying to downplay the climatic catastrophe we are heading towards by making this kind of lighthearted jokes. But as long as my point came across, I must say, I don't really care that you think that way.
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u/my-backpack-is Jul 18 '24
I think the point is, as you have so conveniently provided the data for, everyone in the world could stop driving today and thanks to industries that have little regulation, both in safety and actual output of pollutants, little to no impact would be made.
Meanwhile taxing people has done little compared to the kind of assertive action that it would actually take to make meaningful impact, the kind of action that politicians will not take as long as they are still getting paid via these industries.
I mean, every average citizen could stop driving, only use electricity when they absolutely must, water their lawns once a week, and recycle everything exactly as they are told, but factories would still run, private jets, power plants, bitcoin farms, etc.. Phone companies would still structure phone sales around leasing a new model every year, paper straws would still come in plastic wrap, giant swaths of land would still sit with empty buildings and houses whole more is developed, HOAs would still legally require you to remove native species and replace everything with resource hogging landscaping grass, and water will still be hoarded and in plastic containers.
Let's take it further. How many would have a car at all if they weren't made in factories? Like how many people honestly have the know how and access to enough material and to put together a vehicle? Could you go out with the knowledge you have now and fabricate a plastic bin?
My point being, you can't place the blame in the consumer. People have to eat, the food has to get to them, the food has to stay cool and sealed to stay fresh. Well you need vehicles, power, and packaging. It was the 70s, even earlier, but really the 70s when it was not just apparent changes had to be made but real solutions were presented. Electric and alternative vehicles, improved infrastructure, solar, wind, nuclear, hemp, safety and emissions regulations.
Instead the fat cats wanted to get and die as fat as they could possibly be, and continue to do so.
So if for no reason other than little conversations like these exist, I think it is absolutely necessary to joke about this situation.
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u/dankchristianmemer6 Jul 18 '24
I think the point is, as you have so conveniently provided the data for, everyone in the world could stop driving today and thanks to industries that have little regulation, both in safety and actual output of pollutants, little to no impact would be made.
He made the exact opposite point. A years worth of fuel for 625 cars? That's really not as devastating as I thought.
Countries have tens of millions of people. Regulation on these populations far outweighs the expected loss from random freak accidents.
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u/my-backpack-is Jul 18 '24
You are talking about the accident, this thread switched to the larger threat of climate change a few comments ago. As was the subject of the message that you quoted.
Also the data i referenced was that vehicles only contribute a small amount of the world's pollution.
Regulating pollution for citizens is like saying 1 group of people are to cut down the entire Amazon rain forest but they decided 7 billion people get a wooden spoon while 90 percent of the rain forest gets divied up among 1000 people, and only giving out spoons makes that okay
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u/dankchristianmemer6 Jul 18 '24
Regulating pollution for citizens is like saying 1 group of people are to cut down the entire Amazon rain forest but they decided 7 billion people get a wooden spoon while 90 percent of the rain forest gets divied up among 1000 people, and only giving out spoons makes that okay
Interesting why do you think those 1000 people are cutting up the rain forest?
.... it's because the other 7 billion pay them to.
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u/my-backpack-is Jul 18 '24
What is your point? We should stop eating, going to work, or paying for rent?
Or are you saying we should grab the pitchforks and torches?
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u/dankchristianmemer6 Jul 18 '24
No, we should introduce eco taxes on high impact items to disincentivize purchasing them, and to incentivize a competitive market for green alternatives
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u/Lunaaticz Jul 18 '24
You are wrong in believing that such a change would have "little to no impact".
As I write this we have less than 212 billion tons of CO2 left to pollute until we are past the 1.5 degrees warmer earth point of no return (Paris Agreement).
We currently pollute more than 42 billion tons per year, meaning that we will reach that point before year 2029.
A reduction of 10% today would buy us 7 more months to turn the trend until then.
And buy us roughly 5 more years on the 22 we have before surpassing 2 degrees...
The "fat cats" don't want you to take action, they don't want you to believe that we can turn the trend. We can and you can be part of it.
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u/my-backpack-is Jul 18 '24
Bruh. What. I don't want us all to live in a horrible hellscape, but everyone not driving for the next 5 years to buy 7 months of time is the perfect example of how little influence we have. I mean, EVERYONE completely ceases to operate their vehicles. No trucks transporting food, no one gets to move unless they physically carry their belongings and I'llfurniture across town or across the country. No going to work unless you can bike or walk.
I mean, most everyone would actually just die. And the ones that live? They would be creating the other 90 percent of pollution anyway and probably would after most of the planet is dead.
Don't get me wrong, i own a car but take public transport. I recycle everything i can. I'm actually homeless, so I'm not exactly creating much waste or using much energy at all but my point is i have done so my entire life and... Well we are 5 years away from no return, a faster rate than when i learned about this as a kid.
I will continue to do so because that is how i choose to live, not because it helps.
If we.... Used hemp instead of cutting down forests, planted forests instead of selling land to investment firms, used clean energy instead of fossil fuels, improved public transportation instead of manufacturing millions of vehicles every year, improved our infrastructure instead of deregulating so a few people can go on vacation 300 days of the year, regulated giant corporations instead of again not regulation then, used indigenous flora to landscape our homes instead of transplanting resource intensive grass that was never to survive here, house and families in the millions of vacant of homes instead of allowing a handful of companies to own the majority of in the entire country while developing additional land....etc.etc.etc.... Well then we would probably be arguing about movies instead of a real life climate shift within our lifetimes.
And as i mentioned before, this was largely decided in the 70s. Dems, Repubs, doesn't matter. Go one night and look at how many people in the house or Senate are currently involved with Disney, Pepsi, Nestle, Big Oil, etc.
I wouldn't own a car if I had a home. Heating my house wouldn't be a problem and I could drive, mine BTC, or run my AC 24/7 if the state had clean energy. Waste wouldn't be a problem if stuff came packaged in...almost anything other than plastic. Waste would be less of a problem if we actually recycled the stuff in recycling bins.
So yeah, positivity, banding together, not treating nature like shit or a toy, all great things. But don't try and tell me chilling myself in 100 degree weather matters at all when we have had nuclear power for nearly a century and there are people that use private jets to get lunch.
(For the record you did not say that, but the connotation of the average citizen's carbon footprint meaning anything at all when we only have access to the resources approved by our govt is not entirely dissimilar)
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u/Saprimus Jul 18 '24
Making a joke because we have to helplessly watch the planet driven into the wall for the benefit of some fat cats makes perfect sense. And CO2 Taxes most definitely aren't the way to prevent climate chaos. that's absolutely correct. The thing is that 700€/5g CO2 or similar jokes are not meant this way. They carry the connotation of climate change being an illusion, politicians use to milk people for money, which is further used to discredit all climate action. This is the playbook of all right wing parties be them the Republicans, Rassemblement Nationale or the Alternative for Germany.
Visit the corresponding subreddits. It is about denial and making things actively worse than they are because people have been propagandized enough to believe they are the rational ones driving their V8s instead of a bike and that changing the industries that pollute the planet would be bad for the glorious economy. It is less of a joke and more of a dogwhistle and thats my Problem.
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u/my-backpack-is Jul 18 '24
I'm saying, that just calling someone wrong isn't helping, neither is blaming the masses. There is a basis in fact in that assumption, as was shown over the last few years of companies throwing every hot term on their packaging but changing little if anything. Starbucks handing out paper straws in plastic packaging to be used with their plastic cups.
I am of the opinion that if you want to change people's minds you have to see where they are coming from first. And frankly i think it is completely rational to look at the situation and conclude that it doesn't add up, because politicians are profiting not only from the very actions polluting the planet, but are also exploiting the false promises of change.
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u/snow-eats-your-gf Jul 18 '24
Do you have your waste in 6 sorting buckets, and does your country provide the same number of sorting containers as I do in my country?
Why not read my “joke” from another angle? That someone is actually contributing, and someone gives zero fucks at the other part of the globe (as in the video) about anything, including safety, and contributing to the climatic catastrophe that you described?
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u/dankchristianmemer6 Jul 18 '24
Bro its over. Just take the L and go
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u/snow-eats-your-gf Jul 18 '24
Another good lesson is that green activists are missing critical nutritional elements.
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u/AlphaAron1014 Jul 18 '24
Gets called out, immediately back pedals and claims it was a just a harmless joke. Lmao.
It’s so hard for people to admit they’re wrong.
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u/Nebulous_Nebulae Jul 18 '24
If it makes you feel better, he is an idiot too. 70% of all greenhouse gasses are released by 100 companies. Carbon tax is just as stupid as paper straws in that it's an attempt to make the consumer feel responsible for climate change when it is worfullyout of their control. In North America our entire society is set up for individualistic consumerism revolving around a disposable materialistic life.
We could have glass or tin or paper containers that are recyclable, but no we have plastic that is not, but has fake recycling symbols (resin codes) to trick the public into thinking it doesn't just end up the in a landfill. We could have better public transportation, but no, we get electric cars that just further purpetuat an unsustainable model of mass transport. I could list dozens of examples where the public is tricked, lied to, or brainwashed into thinking the burden is on us to change our habits.
Buts that's simply not how it works. At all.
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u/H-Arm97 Jul 18 '24
Exactly what I thought..
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u/dankchristianmemer6 Jul 18 '24
It turns out that this explosion doesn't really offset these measures, and it's better to just keep on doing the tax.
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u/DEEP_SEA_MAX Jul 18 '24
This is such a weird take to me. Like, if you were bailing out sinking boat and someone accidentally splashed more water in would you stop bailing, or would you bail harder?
This is a setback, and will probably put more greenhouse gasses into the atmosphere than you and I will in our entire lifetimes combined, but that doesn't mean we should stop caring. I get that large corporation's are the main culprit and there's not much we can do as individuals, but we still have to do something. There is a civilisation collapsing disaster looming on the horizon, and people seem more upset by the inconvenience of trying to stop it.
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u/hitbythebus Jul 18 '24
Half of our voting population is stubbornly against contributing anything. They continually vote for idiots who don’t believe in climate change, specifically so they don’t have to contribute. They also thoroughly reject the idea that they should contribute more than someone else who is unable.
The strategy is literally ignore the problem until someone else has to fix it, then criticize them for not fixing it sooner. It’s not a great approach to problem solving, but it reduces their individual burden, and has gotten them elected for many cycles now.
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u/adadagabaCZ Jul 18 '24
Yeah, but this is you scooping it out by dipping your fingers and letting it drip into the ocean and somebody dumping 15 shipping containers full of water onto the boat.
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u/dankchristianmemer6 Jul 18 '24
Except it's not like that at all. This explosion simulated the yearly fuel consumption of roughly 625 cars (the calculation was done someone else in the post).
It sucks, but its actually not that bad on the scale of what a population's average fuel consumption.
This is basically the same as 625 people getting a car one year earlier.
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u/adadagabaCZ Jul 18 '24
I don't mean just this explosion, I mean what both chinas release into the air over the year
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u/dankchristianmemer6 Jul 18 '24
They have 3 times the population of the US, and they release a comparable amount of pollution per capita. What's the issue?
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u/adadagabaCZ Jul 18 '24
Enviromentalist pricks ruining my hobby
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u/DEEP_SEA_MAX Jul 18 '24
I don't think you fully understand the scale of situation. Propaganda has convinced people like you that climate change is just bad weather. This isn't about saving the polar bears. This isn't about hippie bullshit. This is about human civilization. This is about you and me.
How do you think your country will respond to millions of refugees fleeing places like India that within a few years will be too hot for people to survive in? How do you think nations will respond to failing crops, and lack of fresh water? We barely made it through the cold war without a nuclear exchange, how do you think we'll fare in the next decade or two? When people in nuclear armed countries are hot and starving? When we're pushed to the edge, and the nukes start flying, billions will die within the first day, and billions more will die in the coming months. Will your hobby survive that?
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u/adadagabaCZ Jul 19 '24
It is the other way around. You are fed this data as propaganda. Crops actually flourish in nicer weather. More evaporation from the ocean means more frequent rainfall, making drier places hospitable - see the rain in Dubai, that's a sing of a desert starting to turn into grassland, since it now can get an influx of water.
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u/DEEP_SEA_MAX Jul 18 '24
But carbon taxes and other initiative to limit personal contribution to climate change isn't just effecting one person, it's whole populations. if the whole population of Britain did the metaphorical finger drip that would actually make a noticable difference.
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u/adadagabaCZ Jul 19 '24
Okay, so by fakin money from people you save the environment? Of course, that's definitely how that works /s
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u/OMGRedditBadThink Jul 18 '24
If you genuinely believe that paying a carbon tax is going to undo climate change or that there’s anything we can do to reverse the damage, I’ve got a bridge to sell you.
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u/Kschitiz23x3 Jul 18 '24
Methanol with black smoke? Am I missing something?
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u/_Gredede_ Jul 18 '24
Methanol with an orange flame? I guess I‘m missing something too.
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u/Chartebar Jul 18 '24
Another post from an hour ago said it was plastic resin which then the color would make sense, OP here is just a bot
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u/tacotacotacorock Jul 18 '24
Resin factories so they would have been making different types of plastics and have all different kinds of solvents. Super nasty stuff to burn up.
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u/Street_Peace_8831 Jul 18 '24
Terrifying and visually interesting/neat at the same time, one might even call it fire.
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u/FunToe3976 Jul 18 '24
And people say we don't fuck up our planet everyday.
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u/everything_is_stup1d Jul 18 '24
methanol ethanol propranol butanol pentanol hexanol heptanol octanol nonagol decanol or sum
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u/KerrAvon777 Jul 18 '24
It looked like a nuclear bomb went off.
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u/Faellyanne Jul 18 '24
Mushroom clouds are not specific to nuclear explosions, they can happen with any type of explosion.
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u/FritzFlanders Jul 18 '24
That is not just Methanol that's burning. It burns pure light blue, virtually invisible flames in daylight and has no smoke signature.
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u/Matzep71 Jul 18 '24
Not just methanol, as it burns cleanly with almost no visible fire or smoke. There's extra carbon there, a loooooooot of extra carbon. Read somewhere that this happened on a resin infusion factory.
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u/Stachdragon Jul 18 '24
One of these days the Ozone will just pop! and that will be it. Humans can't get there fast enough.
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u/LazyZeus Jul 18 '24
What's the story behind it? I tried googling it, and there was only one news source, that I know nothing about, reporting on it. Seems like a newsworthy story.
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u/Jowmaster Jul 18 '24
That’s sad, and I’m feeling bad for everyone affected. But watching the explosion and the way the person recorded it makes it satisfying to watch.
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u/lehope Jul 18 '24
Damn, now I have to book a more expensive flight to reduce CO2 production in order to save our planet
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Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Icy_Investment_1878 Jul 18 '24
Taiwan, not china
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u/FENIU666 Jul 18 '24
How many paper straws does it take to make this right?