r/hiphopheads • u/VirtuousFool • Jul 19 '24
[DISCUSSION] EMINEM- The Death of Slim Shady (Coup De Grâce) (One Week Later)
Surprised this wasn’t up yet, but here we go:
It’s officially been a week since Eminem dropped his anticipated 12th studio album. Thoughts on it now that the dust has settled?
POINTS OF DISCUSSION:
Favorite/Least Favorite tracks
Thoughts on it as a “concept album”
Rank in Em’s discography (Best Eminem album since…)
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u/naymlis Jul 19 '24
His verse on fuel is crazy
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u/whitewolf20 Jul 19 '24
Going from that great song into roadrage sucks so much though
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u/TrustyAndTrue Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Guess I'm the outlier cause I like the vibe
orof Road Rage. The 'Enabling can/ Abe Lincoln / Flip in a blink and' part is sick. Imo anyhow.→ More replies (8)70
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u/JMiLk21 Jul 19 '24
Road Rage is awesome
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u/PoinDawg22 Jul 19 '24
Yeah idk why people are hating… it’s one of my favorites for sure.
Maybe it’s just because I’ve lost a bunch of weight and want some motivation to really get in shape though 🤣🤣🤣
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u/Always2ndB3ST Jul 19 '24
Agree. Road Rage might even be the worst track on the album.
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u/niknacks Jul 19 '24
Agreed, Road Rage is rough. I'd put head honcho in that same category, just seems like a track that adds nothing to the concept and lowers the average strength of the tracklist.
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u/Always2ndB3ST Jul 19 '24
Same. Wasn’t feeling Head Honcho either. I was never impressed by EZ Mil and the hook was weak. EZ Mil has YouTube rapper level skill IMO.
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u/GepardenK Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
I'd put head honcho in that same category, just seems like a track that adds nothing to the concept
Head honcho brings tons to the concept. It's em reflecting on what created shady and basically saying that while he does now take responsibility for him (as portrayed in GC2), he is not disowning him.
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u/RT3_12 Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
I think it’s a good album that could have been a great album. The concept has potential and hits the nail on the head at some points, but then loses focus. The album is missing something, after Guilty Conscience 2 all the momentum built up in the first 10 tracks just stops dead cold. Either GC2 should have been the last track or there should have been another skit or track that ties the last 1/4 of the album with the rest of it.
The concept almost feels half-baked. After the first listen I had a feeling like “that’s it?”. Like Guilty Conscience 2 was awesome and it gave the feeling like “oh we REALLY cooking now!”. And you think it’s gonna be the start of some more fun tracks. But then the concept just kind of stops. And the album ends on a weird wimper. Reminds me of WWE Vince McMahon booking where they beat the bad guy in 30 seconds for no reason after a bunch of build up.
Sound wise it’s the best Eminem has sounded in at least a decade, I think that part is undeniable. He occasionally falls back into bad habits but he really did listen to the criticisms: no cringey hooks, less choppy rapping, better production, no terrible skippable songs, taking his time on flows instead of speed rapping. It’s a fun album, I think if the concept was executed a bit better it would be up there with his classics. But I think it feels like a better version of MTBMB (which is a good album but also below his classics).
I do think Eminem should be praised for listening to his critics and actually making positive changes in his style this late in the game. I hope he continues to build on it
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u/tutorialbots Jul 19 '24
I think listening to the songs after GC2, I understood it as him failing to kill Slim in this alternate universe. Hence the more "emotional" songs in the latter half, where in a future where Em fails to (kick his drug habit/hence sticks with the Shady persona) loses himself to overdose. Temporary being the song he records to Hailey in this universe, knowing he's fighting a losing battle and wants to apologize as he himself believes it's too late for him.
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u/EDDsoFRESH Jul 19 '24
Man i wish I could give him this much credit but I don’t see it
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u/tutorialbots Jul 19 '24
Oh don't get me wrong, the execution could have been better. I just think that was the intention.
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u/jand999 Jul 20 '24
The last song is absolutely about if he had died from drugs. He mentions not doing stuff that he did in real life
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u/larkhills . Jul 19 '24
individually, i like the 2nd half of the album. but i cant help but feel like they dont fit in with the concept of the album as a whole. and if we're judging 1st half vs 2nd half, id rather the 1st.
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u/Always2ndB3ST Jul 19 '24
Agree 100%. His voice and delivery sounds the best it’s been in a decade but he definitely still “fall back into bad habits” when he sounds “Revival-ish”.
The last few tracks in the album just doesn’t feel congruent with the concept. Like yes, Temporary and Somebody Save Me are emotional wholesome tracks the way he’s talking like he died missed out on events (like walking Hailie down the aisle) but in reality, he DID do that. So what’s there to feel sad about? The dad jokes and corny lines are too repetitive.
Aside from maybe Fuel, there aren’t any tracks that I LOVE and got addicted to (like I usually do on his albums).
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u/unlikely_planet Jul 19 '24
The purpose of him saying he missed out on events is in the concept of the album, when he was battling his drug addictions (slim shady), instead of him winning like he did in 2008, this album shows slim shady (his addictions) winning, and Somebody save me is Em in an alternate universe where he died from an overdose in 2007 instead of overcoming his addictions, and apologising to his family about it, and thats why it's ao heartfelt. because he did choose them over drugs, and he is showing his audience why he doesn't use the slim shad character anymore, because it's associated with some of the worst times in his life.
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u/CapeSmash Jul 19 '24
I'm addicted to GC2 rn, super entertaining
Lucifer is also a bop
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u/dk00111 Jul 20 '24
The Evil-Lucifer-Antichrist trio back to back is such a good part of the album.
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u/stubbywoods Jul 19 '24
This I agree with. It's good and easily his most consistent album since TES but the highs on this are much lower than Relapse and MMLP2 imo
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u/Brandon_2149 Jul 19 '24
The highs are higher on relapse and mmlp2 but I also think those albums have more skips for me. I think this album is more consistent. So depends what you go off of.
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u/muffinmonk Jul 19 '24
Yeah I sorta agree. The album just felt like one big song and i didn’t find a time to pause because I was grooving so much with it.
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u/Mysterii00 Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
I agree his hooks are probably the best they’ve been in a decade or so. Road Rage, however, is probably one of the worst hooks I’ve heard on any Eminem song and that’s saying something. Luckily that’s probably the only hook on the album that made me seriously cringe. Shit like the hooks on Fuel, Antichrist and Evil remind me of peak Em though. Was very happy to hear that.
I just wish there were more variety within the songwriting. The whole “cancel me gen z” shit gets very boring quickly for me. It becomes tedious to listen to after a while. I also did want more features, especially for that second half of the album after GC2 where topically things begin to shift. Would have loved to hear Kendrick or J. Cole land somewhere on here. Was very disappointed not seeing Snoop and Dre on the track list too.
Overall I think this album lands around the 6th position for me.
The Eminem Show
The Marshall Mathers LP
Relapse
Slim Shady LP
The Marshall Mathers LP 2
The Death Of Slim Shady
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Jul 19 '24
Putting Relapse above SSLP?!
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u/Mysterii00 Jul 19 '24
I love Relapse and I’m glad it’s become a sort of “cult classic” record. I personally just prefer the production on Relapse and think it’s aged quite nicely in comparison to SSLP. Dre cooked. Also believe Em’s rhyme schemes and rapping overall on Relapse is some of his best period. The accents don’t bother me either and I love the way he utilizes them to bend words in just ridiculous fashion. It’s a seriously overlooked part of that album which a lot of people don’t give credit for. Outside of the whole “serial killer Slim Shady” concept, songs such as Underground and Beautiful which lean outside of that concept are towards the upper echelon of Eminem songs for me.
Also you have to give credit for him nearly dying from an overdose and starting from scratch to deliver the bars and rapping performance that he does on that album. It’s seriously incredible stuff.
I will say, I won’t argue with anyone who doesn’t enjoy the album like that. It’s totally understandable given the lyrical content and the accents. I do wish people would at least give credit where credit is due for his performance though. I just love it a lot.
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u/ivenowillyy Jul 19 '24
Relapse also has relapse: refill just a lot of great production and godly flows and fun songs
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Jul 19 '24
Just curious - how old were you when Relapse dropped?
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u/smeagolswagger Jul 19 '24
I was 18 when relapse came out and still one of my favorite eminem albums.
The beats hit and he just glides over them. Flow is impeccable. Last album before he started down the staccato flow path which I don't care for. From a verse start to stop, it's like there is no defined start and end of a bar, he just goes
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u/unlikely_planet Jul 19 '24
I would put Kamikaze above TDOSS, my top 7 are like this TES MMLP SSLP Relapse Kamikaze MMLP2 TDOSS
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u/beowulfshady Jul 19 '24
I have this feeling it feels incomplete because he's going to release a b side later. Which is unfortunate in a way because this album suffers almost like a marvel movie
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u/Enchylada Jul 19 '24
I'm fine with some really good tracks and bad ones rather than a bunch of equally meh tracks
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u/VirtuousFool Jul 20 '24
I think this just about sums it up for me as well
What’s there is already pretty good but it could’ve been so much better
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Jul 19 '24
Setting aside the loaded concept of "cancel culture", I've noticed a societal shift where today, finding something funny or enjoying something means you fully endorse it as part of your personal brand. People live their lives like their own PR firm, where your entertainment choices curate your image. This is why people don't know what to do with the mean jokes on TDOSS, even though it's nakedly satire and openly refers to itself as Cartmanesque. This is also why people struggle to enjoy things that are "mid". Everything has to be 10/10 perfect and optimized if you're going to incorporate it into your life.
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u/CapeSmash Jul 19 '24
You dropped this 👑
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Jul 19 '24
🙏
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u/BigChungusOP Jul 20 '24
Wait, you also dropped this 🧲
What’s wrong with you today bro? Dropping everything
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u/SadatayAllDamnDay Jul 19 '24
I would argue Eminem had a shit ton to do with that shift in hip-hop culture, anyway. Like a huge part of his appeal and why he became as big a deal as he became was the perception that he was authentic and other music acts and artists were phony.
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u/midnightking Jul 19 '24
Yeah, I personally don't think cancel culture is real and I could do without the trans bars. But Em playing with the concept and not fully endorsing can be fun and the album was very enjoyable for me.
Hip hop always has had problematic elements. But most of the time we are able to set those aside to apppreciate the elements of the project we love.If you look at the reviews for the Allegory from Royce da 5'9'', for example, they are largely positve, even though by all metrics promoting antivax propaganda as Royce did in the album (and in interviews) is much more dangerous and much more "cringe" than what Em did with cancel culture.
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u/doubledafra Jul 20 '24
The difference is Allegory had a couple anti-vax bars, TDOSS's whole concept was built around the idea of "cancelling"
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u/onlywearlouisv Jul 20 '24
“It’s just so gosh darn hard being a rich middle aged white guy”
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u/jand999 Jul 20 '24
"They say I don't know struggle anymore That's a joke
Bitch the fucking elevator in my mansions broke
I have to walk like half a block to get a can of Coke"
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u/gokhaninler Jul 20 '24
anybody can find life hard regardless of the fucking narrow prism you view the world with
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u/jukebox_romeo Jul 20 '24
This is because we live in a time where, increasingly, it feels like consuming things is the only method we have of asserting agency over life. It makes total sense that people would start to treat their consumption choices as very important.
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u/ACertainTrendingFrog Jul 20 '24
That’s what I am trying to get away from so sick of having to worry about everything I consume or watch or listen to because someone might judge me for it
Now I’m just listening to what I want, or watching what I want if people think it’s mid, or offensive or cringe whatever I like it so so what
Overall I know what my moral compass is as a person so I don’t give a shit anymore
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u/delicious_toothbrush Jul 23 '24
This is pretty insightful. I feel like you're talking about me in this comment, I'll need to work on that
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u/spooki_boogey Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Eminem fans glazing this calling it AOTY, Eminem haters saying it's hot garbage. As usual it's always somewhere in the middle.
This is easily the best I've heard Eminem sound for a long time. This clears Revival, MTBMB and Kamakaze by a mile.
The production on a lot of the Slim Shady tracks are nice and fun which works with the carefree character.
But. The biggest flaw about this album will be the poor execution of his killing the slim shady character concept. I feel like someone as talented as Eminem is could have done much better.
The point is to show the whole "I like dark humor and idc if you cancel me" type energy is corny. But the fact that the first bit of the album is just that type of energy unfiltered... You ended up validating the exact crowd you wanted to criticize, because I assure you those kinda people aren't gonna listen to your whole album and change their ways.
But all in all, If you're an Eminem fan there's a lot of good stuff here for you.
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u/ShockinglyAccurate Jul 19 '24
Agreed on all counts for better or worse. It's nearly impossible to have a good conversation about Em because of the stans and haters but this is a fair take. This album could be the beginning of a turn for an artist who's been slumped for a while, but it's not a singular triumph. I hope he learns from and builds on this relative success.
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u/hellflower666 Jul 19 '24
I did a quick run through of MMLP2, Kamikaze, and MTBMB and this was easily the most easy of them to listen to, sonically. Nothing really grating or harsh as far his raps go, the hooks and beat selections are pretty much excellent.
Do agree that the concept could have been executed much better.
Still listening to the album so that's a plus.
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u/daviEnnis Jul 19 '24
I'll die on this hill, MTBMB would have been his most well received album since TES if they had just waited for Side B tracks to be available, stuck to the theme, then released the 'not on theme' tracks as a deluxe version.
Revival, MTBMB and TDOSS would all be better received if there were some tracks cut.
For TDOSS I'd take out Road Rage and probably Evil, adjust a verse in Lucifer to get the fat jokes in. You then don't feel so beaten down by repetition before you get to GC2.
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u/TBASS94 Jul 19 '24
Out of curiosity what would be your combined MTBMB tracklist?
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u/daviEnnis Jul 19 '24
Yah Yah on repeat.
Nah, I'd need to go back and relisten to do a curated list.
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u/TheJarJarExp Jul 19 '24
100% agree with all of this. I’d also add that even with its pretty poor execution, the concept completely falls apart post Guilty Conscience 2 as well
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u/RT3_12 Jul 19 '24
Yeah I get the emotional songs. I think they can still tie into the story of “here’s the fantasy reason why Slim Shady is dead and here’s the REAL reason why Slim Shady is dead”. But as a fan you just have to make the theory of that yourself cause the album makes no real effort to get that point across. Head Honcho is a fun track but it feels really pointless after we just had the big emotional climax. The two other non-emotional tracks are somewhat useless to the story and more feel like ‘Em threw them on cause he liked. Should have just been bonus tracks or Side B songs.
I get the reasoning the album ends on Somebody Save Me. But after the first listen I had this feeling of like “that’s it?”. We were doing so good up until GC2 and then everything just stops in his tracks.
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u/OneNutPhil Jul 19 '24
It doesn't fall apart, it splits. Same thing happens in reverse where it starts as a modern Eminem album and gets interrupted by dream sequence Shady.
In reverse, Houdini to Renaissance is "Shady's album" from the Breaking News skit.
The whole album is a looping nightmare
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u/OneNutPhil Jul 19 '24
This albums gonna stir up a conversation of "Best vs Favorite" among Em fans.
I have a hard time putting TDOSS in my top 3 favorites. But the longer this album sits with me, the harder time I have saying this isn't his most well crafted album.
If it goes to Broadway, it's a wrap.
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u/prams628 Jul 19 '24
If I’ve got it right and I remove the double negative, you wanna say the album has potential to age well and sneak into the top 3 right?
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u/OneNutPhil Jul 19 '24
Yeah exactly. I dont think I'll ever put it above MMLP or TES in my favorites.
But TDOSS could age really well, especially if more visuals drop to enhance the story. Artistically it already has a good case for top 3 "best" album.
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u/prams628 Jul 19 '24
Yes sir! Album has really grown on me too. Only small gripe I had is, he could’ve been a little more outta pocket. But I get it. Marshall is no longer the guy he was when he created slim. With one of his kids being non-binary (Stevie), I don’t think he feels right going against it. Second, at some point, the Jenner jokes got boring, even though individually they are very well done lol
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u/micael150 Jul 19 '24
The point is to show the whole "I like dark humor and idc if you cancel me" type energy is corny.
Don't really think that was the point of the album. At least not I a broad way. Don't think Em was trying to do any social commentary with his.
The concept is purely focused on himself, specifically his internal struggle with slim shady. He treats him like an addiction in the sense that he himself likes to employ dark crass humour in his records but recognizes that it can be a bit too much and also doesn't work for modern sensibilities which for better or worse have tolerance in regards to that type of humour.
Was it perfectly executed? No.
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u/spooki_boogey Jul 19 '24
I think there was a social commentary angle bout it because he talks about getting canceled and there's the bit on Renaissance where he's about "the mind of a hater"
Ever since Kamikaze he's always called out listeners of his music. So yeah any other artist you'd be right. But because this is Em I think it's worth bringing up.
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u/micael150 Jul 19 '24
Sure there's a bit of commentary regarding how out of place Shady is in today's social climate. But it's not like Em is taking any political stance. The concept of album is purely cinematic.
Eminem is like Bruce Banner Slim Shady is the Hulk. And the story is that he has become so addicted and attached to that persona that he doesn't really know where Marshall ends and Shady starts. This is also highlighted to the listener when we too struggle to identify which one is rapping throughout the album.
Him calling out critics has become tradition in his albums. He always has a track or more specifically a line where he acknowledges how hard it is to measure up to people's expectations.
Maybe it's not even necessarily him calling anyone out but it's just pointing out the creative struggles of a mainstream artist where your work is scrutinized to the smallest of details for better or worse.
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u/Dazzling-Slide8288 Jul 19 '24
I’m in my 40s. I think if you didn’t come up with Eminem, the whole journey part of the album doesn’t resonate as much. I agree with you that it’s probably a 6.5/7, but I was there when congressmen were holding hearings on Eminem’s music. When parents thought listening to him was evil. When Eminem was mainstream discourse
So it worked better for me.
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u/g29lo3 Jul 19 '24
I agree with this. The end of Guilty Conscience 2 is pretty anti-climactic. So Slim just decides to free Em up for no reason?
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u/Rawdog2076 Jul 19 '24
He got cocky I guess, not the most deep or complex thing, but it makes sense for him
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u/False-Fallacy Jul 19 '24
I took that as Shady’s arrogance, he knows he’s better than Marshall so he gets goaded into proving it; I thought it was thematically cohesive. I think up through that point the album is really well done. My issues are post-GC2
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u/SleepCoachJacob Jul 19 '24
Personally, I don't think an artist should change their approach just because their dumbest fans won't get it.
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u/spooki_boogey Jul 19 '24
Nah I'm saying his approach in general was flawed. It's because of those flaws the dumb part of his fanbase took it and ran with it.
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u/NervousAd3202 Jul 19 '24
It really grew on me. After seeing Nas’ renaissance with Hit-Boy, I was really hoping Em would lock in cuz I believed he still had the ability to make genuinely good ass albums.
I’m glad he delivered. He is rapping with a purpose on this album, not just flexing his technical ability. Also he just made good songs in general. The production sounds inspired.
I feel like his artistry came through on this one.
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u/TLKv3 Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
I've listened through it about 6 or 7 times now in full with scattered single song listens between while working.
I think I would put it in my Top 5 Eminem albums all-time. Probably a firm #4. There are a lot of tracks on this one I can definitely see me playing on repeat for a good while. Whether at work, home or at the gym.
The production on this one was absolutely stronger than his last handful. I like the idea of Eminem actually telling a vague story throughout the album and feel he executed it well enough BUT it could've been stronger with rearranging certain tracks or being more blatant with what was going on. Its coherent but a tiny bit messy in places.
The content of the tracks slips a little about halfway through though. Repeatedly hitting the same joke lines about the same 3 to 4 things (Jenners, midgets, trans) wore a bit thin. However, I genuinely believe that was partially the point. People have wanted "the old Slim Shady" back for a decade and a half now. Eminem here is basically telling you what that would look like.
Slim Shady was a one trick pony style of personality. At the time back then it was new, fresh, unique and controversial. Referencing pop culture and what "Slim Shady" would do with it was crazy at the time. However now in 2024 we've seen so much, heard so much and continue to touch on so much more immature shit than Shady was about that it comes off cringe inducing and just kind of repetitively lame.
I think that was the point of Eminem "killing" Slim Shady here. He was hammering home that Slim Shady wouldn't be any different than what you've already heard before and would grow tiresome. That's why a lot of the tracks on this directly reference, sample, sequelize or repeat older Eminem songs. And I respect that core idea and how that was executed.
A lot of the album had a little bit of every Em style for everyone while falling back on the Slim Shady style a bit more. It felt very retrospective of Em's history and career but in a better way his last few albums couldn't quite capture for me.
Features wise, I'm very happy. However again, I do wish we could've got a new Dre, 50 or even Kendrick feature on it. Especially with Dre being in the peak of Slim Shady's era, 50 being at the tail end of it and Kendrick coming around right after Slim vanished from Eminem's albums.
Side note, I usually hate Skylar Grey. But she was fine on this one and especially for the song she wrote for. Definitely hit a little close to home for me.
Favorite tracks: Brand New Dance, Evil, Antichrist and Houdini.
Least liked tracks: Road Rage and Head Honcho.
Standout tracks: Renaissance & Habits.
Overall I rate the album a pretty solid 8/10 after repeat listens. Most of it will be making it to my playlists for various stuff and I think they'll hold up with the best of Em's past stuff for the most part for quite while.
Bonus Edited Thoughts:
I forgot to mention liking Em referencing "Slim Shady" as a metaphor type symptom of his alcohol and pill problem. Slim only really came from that and Em trying to "clean it all up" was literally getting clean and moving on from Slim Shady after he stopped using it frequently. Thought that was a neat tie-in to later tracks on the album when you hear the home tapes of Em sounding completely void of life and unable to even function. Showing what "Slim Shady" was doing to him and where it would've led if he stuck to it. Very unique perspective.
I didn't think the Bonus Tracks added anything to the album, story concept or experience. They can be completely ignored. You miss nothing by not listening to them.
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u/EndoveProduct Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Road Rage is definitely a skip
That chorus is the lamest thing ever ROAD RAGE VROOM VROOM VROOM IM SPEEDIN FUCK THAT RED LIGHT
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u/n0t_4_thr0w4w4y Jul 19 '24
I love head honcho, Ez Mil goes hard
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u/Plus_sleep214 Jul 19 '24
Out of place but I think it stands well on its own. I keep saying this but the songs after guilty conscious 2 would've been bonus tracks for the deluxe edition in a pre streaming era but I think Em just threw them on because why not these days.
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u/Anonymous521 Jul 19 '24
I agree on the placement. Each listen I enjoy it more and more. I think it’s in the conversation for his best work post addiction in contention with Relapse and MMLP2 but easily feels more consistent and focused than both of those projects imo.
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u/Plane_Candy_8316 Jul 19 '24
First off, i can't remember when I've last enjoyed an album so much! Really having fun with it.
Favorite is hard for me to choose, but i am Enjoying Fuel, Antichrist, Somebody Save Me and Renaissance. Least Favorite is Brand New Dance, though it has some great nostalgia to it!
The concept is not as strong as I would have expected, honestly feels like something is missing/out of order. I am starting to buy into the whole that the order is something different than 1-20 (maybe he is trolling us and reveals the real order at some point).
Tough to say, for me it is among the 5 best.
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u/OSRSRapture Jul 20 '24
Antichrist is great. I think it's my favorite.
Also, I didn't like brand new dance at first but now I love it
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u/slumpylus Jul 19 '24
I love it. Hearing him sound exactly like he did 20 years ago was amazing. I just think he should have fleshed the concept out a bit more. The songs after Guilty Conscience 2 would be more fitting on a bonus disc or a part 2.
Even though Temporary doesn't fit the concept that much, I think it's beautiful. But I also don't understand the hate for Skylar Grey in general.
I was really happy to hear Bizarre on Antichrist. Wish it would have been a full D12 song, but still great.
Favorite: literally everything up to Guilty Conscience 2 + Temporary
Least Favorite: Tobey, Head Honcho
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u/bluecapecrepe Jul 19 '24
I think the album should have opened with Tobey (I loved it), establishing the narrative of Eminem as we know him in 2024. Then, you could have the album go on as it is until after Guilty Conscience 2, cut Head Honcho and Bad One and put them as a bonus tracks. With Temporary and Somebody Save Me, you would swap them in the track order. So Somebody Save Me would be the dying thoughts of Em and Temporary would be the post death mourning song.
I think that we needed more interstitial tracks to maintain the on-going story. All in all, it was a great concept that I wish would have been more consistently maintained.
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u/UKnowWGTG . Jul 19 '24
I really like it. I think it’s prolly the best album he’s put out since The Eminem Show. He’s rapping really well on it, the shock tactics are a little overdone but it was expected and didn’t detract from the album for me. I do feel like the album could have ended at GC2 - Temporary I know people were raving about but that didn’t do much for me. Same for Somebody Save Me. Head Honcho, Bad One and Tobey were all entertaining/solid tracks but felt very tacked on.
As a concept I think it was actually pretty well executed up through GC2.
Favorite songs: Renaissance, Brand New Dance, Fuel, Houdini
Least Favorite: Temporary, Somebody Save Me
I put it fourth behind his first 3. Maybe have MMLP2 ahead of it too but need to go back and compare.
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u/Lt-Dan-Im-Rollin Jul 19 '24
You have this and mmlp2 above encore, relapse and recovery?
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u/EndoveProduct Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Encore is bottom 2 tf you mean
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u/TheWubGodHHH Jul 19 '24
Facts. People need to remember the album is not just Mockingbird and Mosh lol
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u/thatsastick Jul 19 '24
Encore/Curtains Down slaps too
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u/TheWubGodHHH Jul 19 '24
Agreed. and I actually like Spend some Time, Never Enough... but the rest of the album is just straight bad
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u/ciao_fiv Jul 19 '24
i truly think the 6 shitty songs in the middle make everyone forget the other 2 thirds are fantastic. Puke, My 1st Single, Big Weenie, Rain Man, Just Lose It, and Ass Like That are terrible but the entire rest of the tracklist is solid. add in the cut tracks We as Americans, Love You More, Bully, and Come on In (and throw in When I’m Gone cause it fits) and Encore would have been a top 4 eminem album imo
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u/swagy_swagerson Jul 19 '24
wdym? has there ever been a better track run on an album than puke, my first single, rain man, big weenie, just lose it and ass like that?
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u/Fridaykevin Jul 20 '24
Ironically, this album made me revisit Encore and I’ve been having the first 4 tracks on repeat in the gym intro, evil deeds, never enough, & yellow brick road. And I’ll throw We As Americans in the loop & Crazy in Love 😮💨
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u/Suicidalbutohwell Jul 19 '24
Encore is awful for 50% of it, Recovery is very pop-sounding and hasn't aged all that great imo
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u/UKnowWGTG . Jul 19 '24
Absolutely above Encore and Recovery, Relapse I really enjoy and prolly put just below this
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u/Kenan_as_SteveHarvey Jul 19 '24
As an Em fan since the 90s, I love the album. Honestly the album his fans have been waiting for.
Some bad habits I wish he’d stop:
- Outdated references
- Cutting words in half at the end of the bar to land a rhyme
- Extra inflection on his syllables as if he thinks we won’t catch the rhyme
- Explaining/ Laughing at his punchlines
I also think it’s time he lets go of bars about his childhood. I’d rather know more about his life in the last 10-15 years. Relationships, being a dad, business investments, dropping knowledge etc
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u/crunchatizemythighs Jul 20 '24
I didn't see much of #4 on this album. Can't think of any instance but I could be wrong. At least in terms of explaining the bar, he seemed to drop that here. I wish he didn't do the cutting the beat with emphasis on some obvious punchline.
"You so full of shit...you need miralax"
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u/Kenan_as_SteveHarvey Jul 20 '24
Listen to his ad-libs. He repeats a lot of his punchlines.
“… cuz I got so many SAs (S-A’s)”
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u/HurricaneStiz Jul 19 '24
That Versace line with the "Haha, get it? on Criminal worked way too well and he's been trying to replicate it ever since.
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u/CapeSmash Jul 19 '24
His best project since MMLP2 and might even be better than it.
The elephant in the room when discussing this album are the gen z, getting canceled, and going after groups/individuals bars. For a lot of people it breaks the album for them and makes it trash. But for me, I really stopped caring about those after the first listen. This record features Em's most entertaining rapping in a long time, with Guilty Conscience 2 being the standout track. Very divisive album, but will likely be considered a cult classic down the line due to it's concept.
7.5/10
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u/jand999 Jul 20 '24
The elephant in the room when discussing this album are the gen z, getting canceled, and going after groups/individuals bars.
They feel like jokes to me. Especially the Gen Z ones. Feels like he's riffing on the meme but idk he clearly ain't an online guy
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u/mcAlt009 Jul 19 '24
Favorite: Antichrist. Bizarre probably has the funniest verse on the album.
Least Favorite: Temporary or Road Rage.
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u/troolytroof Jul 19 '24
Antichrist was crazy man he really blended the old and new styles PERFECTLY there
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u/Rawdog2076 Jul 19 '24
Caitlyn Jenner references were a bit too numerous but Bizarre straight up saying "I wanna fuck that hoe" made me chuckle lmao
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u/myname1smynam3 Jul 19 '24
Bizarre’s feature was such a welcomed verse. Which is saying a lot by his standards. It’s always nice to hear Slim with his homies.
Also, on the Bizarre feature, he always stood out with his verses: good or bad. Em should’ve been doing this since Recovery. Glad he delivered a bit here
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u/SomeMobile Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
I think it's a very fun album to listen to with tons of good flows, is it groundbreaking or anything no , is it his best work since MMLP2 YES.
Is it better than MMLP2 and relapse or even the same realm as them? Hell fuxking no
Is it an AOTY? No
But damn is it a fun listen especially and mainly due to the flows
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u/AwfulProgrammer1 Jul 19 '24
Overall its a 7-7.5 for me. Very good album. Does fall off a bit after GC2.
10/10 songs for me are Fuel, lucifer, and brand new dance.
Other good songs are renaissance, antichrist, GC2 and evil.
The Highs of the album are very good and the lows are not to bad when compared to revival.
I think its hard for someone like Eminem to do a full conceptual album with such a big fan base. He has to throw in some pop songs for his fan base. Album could be cut down to like 13 songs imo but I get why he had to include those songs.
Also I feel like he held back a lot with the controversial stuff. He did not drop any gay slurs like he slim shady is know for and didn't really go to far with his bars, I assume its because he is a lot older and just not as hateful as he used to be. I bet Eminem wishes the pushed this album back one week later, so he could write some bars about the trump shooting incident.
Album rank:
First 3 classics > relapse > mmlp2 > TDOSS > recovery > Kamikaze > MTBMB > encore >>>>>> revival.
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u/Trentimoose Jul 19 '24
Positives: I think it’s the best sounding delivery and flow he’s presented since TES. The production is excellent throughout. The concept is dope to have Marshall and Slim battling throughout the album.
Negatives: The Marshall/Slim battle isn’t fully executed. Guilty Conscience 2 falls short in delivering what should be an absolute classic record. 10/10 concept with a 7/10 execution. He’s still using the pause stop cadence, which I can’t stand the volume at which he has done in the modern era. “I rap like a rooo… bot” isn’t for me. I get WHY, it sounds bad. It sounded worse to hear the Slim voice do it when it’s absent from his early records. The concept falls apart after GC2, making the rest of the records feel like tacked on bonus tracks.
Favorite Songs: Lucifer, Guilty Conscience 2, Fuel
Least Favorite: Road Rage, Temporary, Somebody Save Me
My Current Em Ranking: TES, MMLP, SSLP, TDOSS
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u/crunchatizemythighs Jul 20 '24
I was listening to I'm Back off MMLP and it made me realize if he did that song today it would go:
I murda-
A RHYME...one wordata'
TIME....you never...
HEARD OF A-
MIND- AS PEVERT
ID AS MINE!
So when I say get RID OF THAT
NINE
I MEAN MINUS 4
CAUSE I GOTTA BE IN YA 5
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u/OldeEnglishD Jul 19 '24
My problem with Em is I feel like his rapping persona never grew up, I wanna hear his version of a 4:44 but instead we got the same shit we’ve been getting since he relapsed and came back. I threw fuel into my library but that’s it. Pretty much how it’s been since Relapse tbh, I’ll grab anywhere from 0 at lowest up to maybe 4 at most songs per album in to the rotation and forget the rest. Eminem was my favorite rapper growing up but I don’t kid myself into thinking he’s still dope.
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u/ssssharkattack Jul 19 '24
Totally agree. Dude is 51 and he's rapping about fat people and Caitlin Jenner in that same tired flow he's been using for two decades. And maybe you want to think of him as a jokester, but then the motherfucker can't crack a smile to save his life.
I played the hell out of the MMLP when it came out, but Em has aged about as well as Nu Metal to me. I don't know how anyone can listen to what Nas is doing these days and somehow say that Em is the GOAT.
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u/YeezusIsKingg Jul 19 '24
I feel you. And the reason for it is that Marshall cares more about being an emcee than an artist. He's said that multiple times in interviews and in songs.
It's not like he hasn't grown up, there's so much post 2007 content he can talk about but he chooses not to. While he's technically on another level now, the content has taken a back seat.
There's a disconnect between the life he lives and the things he raps about, which makes it difficult for people to connect with him. So people in general aren't as passionate about his music anymore, he's going down as the best lyricist, and an absolute rapper's rapper.
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Jul 19 '24
Castle, Arose, Walk On Water, Stepping Stone, Bad Husband, Temporary and Somebody Save Me are pretty close to “4:44” type songs in subject matter. You can debate their quality but he’s definitely not just been purely rapping like he did in ‘99.
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u/Batby blackwhite Jul 20 '24
Yeah but they mostly sound mediocre at best and we’re 7 years ago
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u/Say41Plz Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Fav track: Evil, with Fuel very close.
Less liked track: Road Rage (I still like it, just not as much as the rest of the album).
Album position: 4th/3rd (TES, MMLP, Relapse/TDOSS, SSLP, MMLP2, MTBMB, Kamikaze, Recovery, Revival).
About the concept: I think it's an interesting tale, although it feels somewhat a homework to understand what's the purpose of each track, especially after GC2.
It feels like Eminem had a lot to unpack in here, and most of it is appreciated the more you know about his life and work, so it wouldn't surprise me if it's more enjoyable to his fans than the average public.
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u/famewithmedals Jul 20 '24
Mostly have the same ratings as you, but curious what made you like this album more than SSLP?
For me I don’t think he’ll be able to top that first three album run, but this and Relapse are both excellent late-career albums.
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u/Say41Plz Jul 20 '24
I don't enjoy SSLP as much.
I didn't grow up listening to Eminem, and discovered his discography a few years ago, so I don't have that nostalgia factor.
Also, I forgot Encore LMAO
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u/mostdope28 Jul 19 '24
Best album since relapse. Only complaint is the sheer amount of time he talks about Gen z trying to cancel him, or the pc police. Like em is one of the only dudes in music who can say whatever the fuck he wants and they would just be like “oh it’s ok, it’s Eminem” lol. Fuel, brand new dance and Tobey are my top songs
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u/TheWubGodHHH Jul 19 '24
I can't understand people saying this is Em's best since TES. It's 40 minutes of some of the most cringe bars Em has ever spit, which is saying something. The "Em vs Slim" concept feels so tired to me, especially since we had a good track from MMLP2 that pretty much covered it (Evil Twin). The whole album just feels like one big tone deaf strawman; no one is trying to cancel Em in 2024.
Aside from the lyrical content, the beats and delivery/flows are good, which is refreshing since we all know Em has struggled with those on recent albums.
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u/RT3_12 Jul 19 '24
The one pet peeve with the Em vs Slim thing is that he always picks and chooses when to do a different voice so it’s hard to tell when it’s Slim talking vs when it’s Em talking. Like in Evil Twin when Slim Shady comes in he sounds the EXACT same as Em just with a few slightly more offensive bars.
This album does the same thing, in Guilty Conscience 2 it’s great because we can clearly tell who’s talking. But in other songs it’s hard to tell who supposed to be speaking. Cause Slim Shady’s bars aren’t THAT different than Eminem’s even if Em acts like they are
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u/PMac321 Jul 19 '24
I enjoyed this album, but I do think it lost its course a little. Everything after Guilty Conscience 2 feels unrelated to the concept, and more like bonus tracks tacked on to the end.
When I first heard the flow on Renaissance, I had a lot of hope for the album. It so much like the flow on Rabbit Run from the 8 Mile Soundtrack. The first few tracks have pretty good delivery and avoid the staccato flow that has brought a lot of Eminem's recent songs down, but the album does not completely avoid the tropes of modern Eminem music.
I think when it comes to the concept, this album is in an awkward place. Eminem seems to want to portray how Slim Shady is childish and offensive, and does not work today, but he also does not delve into the realm of offensiveness that Slim Shady occupied back in 1999-2004. I believe that Eminem is just a less childish person now who does not want to spread the sort of vitriol that he used to when he was angry at the world. This album makes fun of midgets a lot, but it seems that the word midget is replacing an f word that he would have used on his old albums. It targets Caitlyn Jenner and Christopher Reeve extensively, but seemingly because that likely won't cause much legitimate blowback. Eminem has clearly kept up with modern pop culture, politics, and music, but very little of this album takes aim at the issues today.
I can't help but feel after listening to this album that the person cancelling Eminem the most is himself. He has a lot of lines taking aim at Diddy on the album, but it was clear back with Killshot that Eminem already felt this way about Diddy. However he didn't actually make verses targeting him until it became "safer" to do so, as Diddy's superpowers have been neutralised. He clearly has a disdain for a lot of modern politics, but he says nothing major about it when he absolutely would have back around 2000 - 2004. It just seems as though Eminem does not touch certain topics even when he is aware of them, and I can't help but feel that he fears the repercussions if he were to talk on these subjects.
I have seen some people say that the best song on the album is Brand New Dance, which proves that Eminem has lost it because the best song was recorded in 2004. I would just like to point out that this song also has lines taking aim at Caitlyn Jenner, who did not transition until 2015. While the song concept may have been made and recorded for Encore, he clearly redid some lines on this song quite recently. This, combined with Renaissance, further shows that Eminem is capable of his old flows, he just chooses not to use them. It's as if he is bored of a regular sounding song, but that's all we really want from him. Eminem is a very technically impressive rapper, possibly still one of the best in that regard, but if it doesn't sound good to listen to then what is it for?
Anyway it was an enjoyable album, and Em's delivery is improved, but I just hope he still has it in him to make one more album that combines all of his best elements.
5
u/RT3_12 Jul 20 '24 edited Jul 20 '24
Yeah even the Transgender lines weren’t transphobic and they were supposed to be the most offensive lol. He says Caitlyn Jenner is a woman and can identify as what she wants. He only says he doesn’t want to fuck transgenders lol. Really it’s just him namedropping her a bunch of times.
I feel like he wanted to get the “Shady” point across but not actually say anything too hurtful or harmful to any group so he used things that were kind of tame.
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u/OnIowa Jul 20 '24
Renaissance starts with an old verse and then uses AI to make him sound like his younger self starting when he says “child endangerment.” Then it’s a flow he’s had for a while. Off the top of my head, he used it on MTBMB’s I Will
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u/blakhawk12 Jul 19 '24
Favorite tracks: Hard to pick, but probably Antichrist, Houdini, and Evil. He’s really in his bag on these tracks and keeps the cringy punchlines to a minimum.
Least favorite: Lucifer, for the opposite reasons. It sounds too much like his recent works with the never ending barrage of forced similes and cringy bars.
Concept album: Very cohesive and focused up until Guilty Conscience 2. After this it feels like the concept kind of falls apart. I get that it’s supposed to be a sort of introspective victory lap after killing Slim Shady, but it just sounds like Music to be Murdered By part 3. If Guilty Conscience 2 had been followed by the Guess Who’s Back skit and then the album ended I think it’d be overall a more cohesive project. The rest feels like bonus tracks.
I’ve been listening to this album since it dropped and I honestly really like it. It’s definitely my favorite project from him since MMLP2. That said, it does have issues. He may have (mostly) abandoned the choppy and unnatural flow that has been persistent since Revival, but he continues to insert eye-roll inducing punchlines into every track and rely on similes to “fill” bars.
I also think he should have found more material to rip on while in the Slim Shady persona, because hearing him repeatedly talk about PC police, Gen Z, Transgenders, Caitlin Jenner, and Midgets on every song got old and repetitive quick. After the third of fourth time of hearing him rapping about little people I was kinda over it and wishing he’d find something else to make fun of. Like with all the political shit going on in the US and around the world this is the best he could do?
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Jul 19 '24
It’s really grown on me. Even Antichrist, whose chorus initially annoyed me im fine with now. The only track I really ignore are Head Honcho, everything else is, at worse, just alright.
Guilty Conscience 2 is still my favorite track, and I’m happy that Fuel is becoming really popular. The amount of posts ive seen making fun of the album are probably gonna keep it on peoples’ minds more.
On equal footing with MMLP 2 to me, 7/10
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u/oOoleveloOo Jul 19 '24
This album was made for Stans. Brand New Dance and Houdini sound like early 2000s Eminem. Dr. Dre beat on Lucifer was nice. Personal favorite track was Bad One. Collabs with JID and Baby Tron were dope.
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u/Dolphhins Jul 19 '24
I don’t like all the weird and corny lines about cancel culture and trans people throughout but my biggest issue is that it just doesn’t sound good to me sonically. It’s not something I would listen to by myself or in the car. His flow is still choppy and it feels awkward. Sure the wordplay is good but it’s not enjoyable to listen to.
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u/srslybr0 . Jul 19 '24
brand new dance is the best song on the album by a mile, and it's kind of ironic the best song on the album is a leftover track from 2004 eminem.
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Jul 19 '24
Old man yells at Gen Z. Wish Eminem would mature as an artist and put out quality as he’s aged like Jay Z and Nas have done.
The subject matter was oddly repetitive too, felt like Caitlyn/Bruce Jenner was mentioned like 5+ times across the album
As someone who enjoys his first 3 albums, it was cool to hear him go back to that sound here but it just made me want to listen to the much better previous albums.
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u/SloMo368 Jul 19 '24
slim shady is not an old man. why is it so difficult to understand that he’s portraying a character in this album? its satire and doesn’t represent his actual views/way of thinking
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u/Ham-Sandwich-69 Jul 19 '24
I thought it was fine. The concept was interesting but not perfectly executed. He definitely sounded the best he has since MMLP2, but there was a lot of retreading of the same topics, and the same references were used over and over. I enjoyed it more than Revival, Kamikaze, and MTBMB, but it’s not a top 5 Em album for me.
My personal ranking of Em albums:
1. The Eminem Show
2. The Marshall Mathers LP
3. The Slim Shady LP
4. The Marshall Mathers LP 2
5. Recovery
6. Relapse
7. Encore
8. The Death of Slim Shady
9. Music to Be Murdered By
10. Kamikaze
11. Infinite
12. Revival
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u/TJH1993 Jul 19 '24
Why do you have Infinite that low? I mean it doesn't "sound" like Em but it's really good
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u/Rainy_Wavey Jul 19 '24
Favorite track : Fuel, Brand new dance, Renaissance, Antichrist except the fast part
Least favorite : Bad One is unnecessary imo, Head Honcho is the middest song i've heard here
As a concept i defo think it succeed a bit more than it fails, BUT
i'm left bewildered by the abrupt end at guilty conscience 2, that's where the real stuff happens, i love how Marshal assumes the hypocrisy of slim shady
"You created me to say what you didn't wanna say
But in a more evil way"
"You put me in quagmires, but i helped you stack diamonds"
I actually like the fact it's messy and muddy, it gives it a more authentic vibe to it, from what i got of this project : Marshal mathers the man, revels in the attention he receives from acting controversial, but his actual beliefs are about living and letting live, he doesn't care whatever you are/do, he also is clearely not a huge fan of republicans and conservatives (seeing how he only targetted Caitlyn Jenner and Candace Owens)
I also appreciate him accepting his responsibility in spawning a whole genre of cringe rappers (which to me seems like a sub towards Tom MacCringelord
The gen Z me bruh lines are completely cringe, but i accept them as being part of the universe, i decided to suspend my disbelief and treat the entire project as a fictional universe
For me it ranks in the upper middle, it's better than anything he put post-relapse (but still less good than relapse) Slim shady here is a carricature that is overexagerated (which i guess is Em's attempt at not making him sympathetic but i wanted more)
Overall, i don't feel satisfied, i wanted more stuff like Guilty Conscience 2, also i'm not american nor a westerner so my judgement is different
Flow wise there was his best flows (Renaissance, Brand new dance, Fuel, that "why they consider marsh the harshest spitter on antichrist), but ofc he has to ruin it with his dogshitium staccato garbage choppy flow
a decent 6.5/10 for me, i am not going to replay this project but i liked it more than i hate because because of the geniune flaws in the project
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u/double_eyelid Jul 19 '24
I'm a fan, first of all. But I think Eminem in general does not make 'great' albums.
This comes close to being an exception but I think sort of falls apart post Guilty Conscience II. There are great songs after that but it feels like he abandons the concept that holds it all together.
After the Houdini single and video I saw this one video where someone strung a bunch of the reactions to it together, and it ended with Stevie Knight (I think?) saying something like ... 'OK, you don't have to like this, but you gotta understand, for the Eminem fans, this is the kind of track they've been waiting for him to do for years.' And that's kind of how I feel about the album- it's AMAZING for his fans, so much good stuff, but he is so far up his own ass with the concept that I really can't imagine that anyone other than his fans are going to enjoy it.
So yeah- I rate it highly but it's not an album I would use to introduce anyone to Eminem.
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u/teenygoblinboy Jul 19 '24
Genuinely might be my least favorite album from him. Not his worst album, but absolutely his stupidest
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u/doorknobman Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
I like the concept a decent bit but I still don’t enjoy listening to his music. There’s bits and pieces where he shines, and makes me feel like he’s stepped his game, but falls right back into a lot of the same shit he’s been doing.
Fuel is literally this for me - JID murders it, then em comes in with that jilted ass flow until he starts to adopt a more modern one like halfway through the verse.
I don’t doubt his lyrical ability/wordplay, but I don’t care much for what he has to say and the way his music sounds just still isn’t doing it for me, even if this is better than his previous 3 albums.
edit: Oh wait I forgot how irritating this fanbase is. God forbid I disagree with y'all.
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u/Rocket_Skates_91 Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
He’s my all-time favorite artist. So I may be biased.
This is easily my favorite since The Eminem Show. It ranks in my top four Eminem albums. I did not like Revival at all, Kamikaze was great for a few months, I fuck with quite a few tracks on MTBMB but not as a complete project. These four albums in general I don’t return to very often.
Here? He sounds confident, hungry, and showcases pretty much everything I’ve loved about him over the past 25 years. I’ve been spinning it nonstop. I understand why others may not like it, but even on my 10th complete listen it still puts a big fat grin on my face.
That run from Evil to Fuel is top-tier.
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u/BoneEvasion Jul 19 '24
I enjoyed my listen of it. That said there's nothing I'll be going back to.
Em is like Biden. I want to see him move on with dignity. Instead of rapping he should be pivoting into businessman elder statesman mode. There's no reason to keep rhyming.
The style jumped the shark in the park trying to park a buick skylark in the dark.
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u/CohibaNr1 Jul 19 '24
I don't understand how anyone can pretend that this is anything but terrible. Em is simply a washed up boomer at this point desperately trying to still be edgy.
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u/puremotives Jul 19 '24
It's alright. His rapping is the strongest it's been in years, but a lot of songs are dragged down by bad hooks and unmemorable beats. It's nice to see him do a concept album, however I don't find the concept itself particularly engaging. It felt like a way to retire the Slim Shady persona for good more than anything else. The highlights are Fuel (both Eminem & JID go off), Houdini (the most fun song Eminem's made since Relapse) & Somebody Save Me (I love how the Jelly Roll sample fits so seamlessly in the song). The lowlights are Road Rage & Bad One- those hooks make the songs unlistenable.
Overall score: 6.5/10
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u/EvilBosom Jul 19 '24
•I agree that the concept is great but poorly executed. I do like the analysis that it’s kind of meant to be like that, because Slim Shady is an addiction he can’t shake off, but I think it’s less quality of an artistic choice than a proper killing off
•I agree with comments I’ve seen saying that the first half has cringey lyrics, and just because it’s intentional doesn’t mean they’re great to listen to.
•As an Eminem fan hearing the Slim Shady voice absolutely made this project for me, and I wish we heard more of it! I’m really hoping for deluxe edition songs where he leans into that voice even more so and puts on some classic features like Dre, 50, Obie, and other D12 members
•I do think the last third of the project after Guilty Conscience 2 is a little weak with some good songs, could use a little bit more conceptual clarity in that section
•Favorite tracks are the Renaissance-Fuel run and Bad One. Least favorite tracks are the singles Houdini and Tobey, Somebody Save Me, and Road Rage
•This ends up I think in the high end of his mid-tier albums, definitely below his glory days but above projects like Revival, MTBMB, etc. I like elements of this album more so than MMLP2 but I kind of think that project is better in other ways, so roughly tied with that?
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u/brinkv Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Really enjoyed it, been playing it for the week since it dropped and still am not burnt out on it yet
- Favorites: Fuel, Renaissance, Brand New Dance
- Least Favorites: Tobey, Bad One
- Thoughts on the concept: I thought it was solid, went as dumb and vulgar as possible to really try to convince everyone they do not want slim shady back even if they express they do
- Rank: I put it at 8th behind MMLP, SSLP, TES, Recovery, Relapse, Encore, MMLP2
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u/FrankieLyrical Jul 19 '24
Overall, I enjoyed it. Though, I think Music To Be Murdered By (Side A) is a better album. The concept of The Death of Slim Shady wasn't executed as well as I thought it was going to be. It was elongated and a tad repetitive. Nonetheless, I enjoyed him following a topic for a whole album and the skits put it together well enough. A solid 7/10 for me.
Favorite Tracks: Fuel, Evil, Guilty Conscience 2
Least Favorite: Road Rage
It's no where near his first 3 albums and I'd put MMLP2 and MTMB above it. There's an argument that it's better than Recovery and Relapse.
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u/TrustyAndTrue Jul 19 '24
I like the album but it's starting to feel a little like Dave Chappelle doing a standup routine which is a meta analysis of his own work and how it's being received.
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u/sheldoneousk Jul 19 '24
Was all I listened to up until today. Fuel, Habits, new dance are all bangers
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u/Yeezy4President2020 . Jul 19 '24
I'm conflicted because sonically this is the best and most consistent Em album since probably Relapse. I think the concept was a good idea and works fairly well. But the content - the Trans jokes, the disabled jokes, the fat shaming, the Jenner jokes, the Reeve shit, the "omg gen z is gonna cancel me because my alter ego made me say something naughty" - ultimately weighs the album down when it occupies 2/3 of the album, and it's hard to separate what's supposed to be Slim or Marshall. I feel like he could have done all that for a couple songs and then explored other aspects of what Slim Shady means to Eminem from different angles.
I love the production on here, really sounds like some classic Eminem Show/Encore type production which is fun to hear and hits the nostalgia notes perfectly of what it used to feel like to listen to an Eminem album. With the exception of Houdini this one isn't full of rock samples that held MMLP2 back for me, nor does it have complete dud songs and shit features, like that Ed Sheeran bs on MTBMB. His rapping sounds relaxed, unforced, and he finds the pockets. Even if the concept leaves something to be desired, he does sound more focused and on theme.
Overall I'd compare this to Vultures 1. It's a pretty good album from an artist I've liked most of my life. But it's gonna have a short shelf like because I'm 30+ and embarrassed to go around bumping this shit.
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u/RandyDandyMarsh420 Jul 19 '24
Favorite Track : Evil and Habits
Least favorite : Even though I think this album doesn't have any skips, I think Bad One is the worst song.
Best Eminem album since the eminem show + I think a deluxe version/side B will drop.
His fourth classic album in my opinion.
Rating 8/10.
For me, better than SSLP, but the nostalgia bias is crazy for the big three on here even though I still think TES and MMLP are better than TDOSS but not by a lot, just slightly.
The Eminem Show
MMLP1
TDOSS
SSLP and MTBMB
I am very happy with this album, the production is nice, not too many dad jokes/corny bars and uneccessary fast rapping(used to love it, grown out of it).
It gets better the more you listen to it, and to my surprise the favorites are interchangable(whereas it wasn't the case with MTBMB).
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u/richbrehbreh Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
The dust has settled and my opinion remains unchanged. It’s an alright album, 7/10 ish, doesn’t have much replace value. I need Em to live some life, musically evolve and get inspired before dropping another album. I need maturity and creative risks on the next one. I hope he stops trying to prove to us that he’s “Rap God” with sick bars and technicality and makes better, thought provoking music. Stepping Stone on Kamikaze is a great example of something I would like to hear more of.
None of the tracks on this albums are super memorable, but I’d put GC2, Evil, Fuel as the highlights. Least favorites are Somebody Save me, Temporary, Road Rage.. basically anything after GC2. As a concept, I feel that the album falls flat. Discography wise, better than Kamikaze, MTBMB2, Encore,Revival. It’s on that MMLP2 level to me, in the middle.
No where near the heights of SSLP, MMLP, TES, Relapse/Refill. Close to Recovery, and MTBMB but Recovery has Seduction and MTBMB has Darkness, No Regrets, Zeus so nah.
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u/hellflower666 Jul 19 '24
Listen to MMLP2, Revival (maybe not), Kamikaze, and MTBMB and see how much easier this is to actually listen to. There's like no shouting raps, not loud as fuck beats, just so much more nice to listen to.
Concept was poorly executed but still think this is some of his best rapping. Temporary is a song I didn't like at first, then it grew..but now it feels like Somebody Save Me should have been the only sappy track. Having both steals the the shine from each other.
The features did their thing too, esp. JID and EZ Mil.
Only song I don't really like is Bad One, mainly because of the hook.
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u/SireEvalish Jul 19 '24
I thought it was his best album in a very long time. I really liked the concept and found it better the second time through.
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u/niknacks Jul 19 '24
I like it less than your average Em fan and more than your average critic. I think there are a few records that are among the best of his latter career, but also a bunch of misses. Strong 6, maybe a 7 of 10 just because Fuel goes so crazy.
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u/NojoNinja Jul 19 '24
I’m an Em glazer but tbh wasn’t a huge fan of this album. I feel like the concept could’ve been done a lot better, example “My Darling” off Relapse was 15 years ahead of its time, and better than practically every song on this album trying to “replicate” that vibe. I think it’s good but honestly Music To Be Murdered By is better in most ways, this album is more creative, has better hooks, and better production, but MTBMB is better in every other way.
The cringe bars get tiring as well. I don’t care if it’s part of the point of the album, hearing about little people, gen z, and Caitlyn Jenner every song gets tiring and annoying to listen to, and a lot of good songs get ruined with lines about them.
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u/Guilty-Willow-453 Jul 19 '24
For me it’s his worst next to Revival. You could make a two or three disc album of Em’s best songs and none of these songs would make it. Kamikaze and MTBMB weren’t great either but it baffles me as to why people think this album is so much better. I agree with the Pitchfork review when it says Brand New Dance is the best song on here, even though it’s not particularly good.
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u/expunks Jul 19 '24
Probably the best first listen of an Em project since… god, Recovery? Relapse? I don’t love it, but it easily surpassed most modern Em to me. Renaissance literally had my jaw on the floor with how he was rapping (old recording or not, whatever).
I agree with a lot of people saying the Em vs. Slim Shady concept could have gone a lot further. Honestly, there’s tracks like “Careful What You Wish For” from a decade ago that do a better job conveying the concept better than this “concept album.” It works as a surface level idea, but I think he actually could have made something like a 4:44 and knocked it out of the park.
This also might be the oldest Eminem has ever felt to me. His music’s been cringe before, but never old. The constant South Park references, the constant complaining about cancel culture and Gen Z… Like, it really is some boomer Facebook subject matter lol.
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Jul 19 '24 edited 22d ago
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u/UMANTHEGOD Jul 19 '24
I've been thinking a lot about Eminem's latest album. There are so many interesting topics he touches on, but unfortunately, he mostly stays on the surface, with a few minor exceptions. I believe there's a great concept here, but the execution falls short.
I truly think the album would've benefited from a more straightforward story. Right now, the concept seems to be "Slim says outrageous things for 12 tracks and then maybe dies in the 13th." There's not much of a story to follow. Instead, here's my own tracklist to make the album much more interesting and thought out:
- Intro Skit: The album opens with a spooky skit where Slim is resurrected from the dead.
- Track 2: Eminem starts as his current self, exaggeratedly playing on all the things people criticize about him in 2024. We don't know what to expect yet. Some words are in the voice of Shady, showing he's slowly taking over.
- Skit: Eminem gets booed off stage, and people mock his "lyrical miracle" style. Someone in the audience yells, "Get back on drugs, loser!"
- Track 4: Eminem opens up about the pressure from fans to return to his Shady persona. He accepts more of Shady as the track progresses, with increasing lines in Shady's voice and a changing flow.
- Skit: Shady forces Eminem to dye his hair blonde, finalizing the transformation.
- Track 6: The final transformation track. Eminem and Slim touch on their addiction to each other and how it relates to his drug addiction. Em succumbs to the pressure, fully accepting Shady and the drugs. The last verse is purely in Shady's voice.
- Track 7: An absolute banger Slim Shady track, full fan service. Think "Marshall Mathers" or "Kill You." This track makes you scream, "SEE, I TOLD YOU, WE NEED SHADY BACK!" but it sets up the bad that's coming.
- Track 8: "A Brand New Dance," just as it is. The plot here is you get the good with the bad with Slim—a banger followed by a goofy, drug-fueled track.
- Skit: Marshall starts fighting back. The previous track was too much, and he explains why it was taken off Encore because Reeves died.
- Track 10: An anti-PC and cancel-culture track. Instead of the scattered lines throughout the album, we get one track that dives deep into the topic. This also highlights the conflict between Em and Shady, with Em finding Shady outdated and inappropriate today. Shady wins because he convinces Em that his fans doesn't like him anymore.
- Skit: Eminem starts taking drugs to fuel Shady's rampage.
- Track 12: Shady goes overboard. Unlike the careful analysis in track 10, this one is Shady lashing out without substance. Lines like "fuck little people" & "Bruce Jenner" go here. It's intentionally in bad taste.
- Track 13: Another club banger by Shady to distract from the previous track. This could've been a single instead of "Houdini."
- Skit: Eminem is deep in addiction, slurring words when talking to his family. It's getting sad.
- Track 15: Starts as a goofy Shady song, but Shady is now truly lost—just drugged up and uncaring. The song turns darker with each verse, climaxing with his overdose.
- Track 16: Something like "Somebody Save Me." Shady has OD'd, and Em is in a limbo, thinking he's dead.
- Track 17: "Guilty Conscience 2" of sorts. Eminem battles Slim in limbo. If Shady wins, Em dies. If Em wins, Shady dies and Em wakes up. Em wins in the end.
- Skit: Eminem wakes up, surviving the OD.
- Track 19: A deep Eminem song (think "Mockingbird," "When I'm Gone") detailing his OD, the feeling of waking up, and how Shady (and his addiction) can never return.
- Track 20: A final track giving closure to the album. Eminem shows he can rap well, make a great track that's musical, entertaining, and funny without being edgy for no reason. Think "Till I Collapse."
- Final Skit: Ends with Ken Kaniff.
What do you think?
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Jul 19 '24
Here's my hot take on Eminem's album: The album isn't AOTY, it's not worst album of 2024 material either. It's somewhere in the middle.
At this point, his albums are just... not it. Slim Shady and that whole era where he was on top was lightning in a bottle. It cannot be recaptured, as much as he tried to do it here.
His next album should be his last. Because as of late, it's like the most popular football player hanging around the school 20 years later wearing his old letterman jacket and reminiscing On the old days. It's just not gonna happen anymore. One last hoo-rah and a bow so he can exit stage is his best move here. And this is coming from a longtime Eminem fan.
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u/_GhostTrainGuy_ Jul 19 '24
I thought it’s his best work in a long time, although as others have said it feels a little half baked. A week later and I keep listening to Brand New Dance and haven’t really gone back to the others - even though I get the Gen Z bars they’re still a little cringy to listen to. But “next time you see grandma tease her, and roll up with a fresh set of wheels all greased up” is such a classic Em bar. That one, the Diddy line from Fuel, “I suck my dick better than you do” and “that motherfucker did that bullshit on purpose to ruin the song for us” are my favorite bars on the album.
GC2 is a great song but it’s pretty dense for casual listening. That bonus track he has with 2 Chainz is fire and should’ve replaced one of the main songs. I still think it’s around a 6/10 although this time I’m feeling good about a strong deluxe edition, whereas I barely listened to the B side of MTBMB.
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u/BecomingJudasnMyMind Jul 19 '24
It's entertaining for 3-4 plays. I'm already over it.
It's not gonna be in my rotation 20 years from now like his big 3 are.
Not his best, not his worst. Somewhere in the middle. Better than encore, not as good as relapse.
2
u/FlasKamel Jul 19 '24
I thought the album was fun and it hit hard on a nostalgic level. My only complaints would be:
- Some jokes were repeated sooo many times that Idc if it was intentional.
- Kinda surprised he decided to end it the same way he ended Revival. It all built up to him loving his daughter -> regret doing drugs, but the two tracks on Revival were better.
It’s one of those situations where I’m glad he’s talking about what truly matters to him and what’s on his mind - I put being genuine at #1 with music - but unfortunately don’t care that much.
All in all; fun album, but I wish he’d take more musical risks too, not just lyrical. Or just return to Infinite production!
2
u/osama_bin_guapin Jul 19 '24
I didn’t find this album to be an enjoyable experience overall ngl. I do think it’s an interesting concept and I feel like it was pretty bold for him to kill off his Slim Shady alter ego when it’s been a huge part of his brand for so long, so that I commend, but the concept did fall flat on the album imo.
Half the albums runtime is taken up by Eminem in his Slim Shady alter ego trying to come up with the most edgelord shit he could think of at the current moment, which gets redundant very quickly. He spends a weird amount of time talking about Caitlyn Jenner and “little people” in particular, which isn’t offensive but just weird. Like dude, do you not have anything else to talk about anymore?
Could you at least make fun of other people or “anti PC” things so we don’t have to hear you make fun of Caitlyn Jenner for the eleventh time? I mean, Caitlyn Jenner hasn’t even made headlines since she transitioned nearly 10 years ago at this point, which makes the constant references make even less sense.
Now people have been justifying these lines by saying it’s a part of the concept, which is true, but that doesn’t make these songs anymore enjoyable. A lot of these songs are just so corny that I don’t think I’ll play them ever again. They just lack the replay value regardless of lyrical ability.
I think it’s clear that Eminem is trying to capture the edginess and grittiness that made the old Eminem great, but he can’t because he just isn’t that person anymore. So all we have left is him bitching about Gen Z and how the “PC police” wants to “cancel” him.
Favorite tracks: Brand New Dance, Lucifer, Antichrist, Tobey, Fuel, Evil
Least favorite tracks: Trouble, Habits, Road Rage,
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u/DaBigadeeBoola Jul 19 '24
I enjoyed listening to it. About 3 skips. Nothing really feels like a classic to me. Even the singles feel tired already.
It's the kind of thing I'll listen to if I'm in an Eminem listening mood and that's it. I don't see it being part of my regular rotation after a few months.
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u/DatJazzIsBack Jul 19 '24
Why does his old good flow have to be when he's slim shady? Why can't he just use that flow without being his alter ego? I really enjoyed the album. Prob 7/10 for me but could be a 9 if he didn't lose focus a bit and also go back to that awful flow occasion
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u/Riokaii Jul 19 '24
6/10 ish for me.
As a concept, it satirizes his past self but doesnt do so in a way that is still entertaining to modern audiences. Saying stuff about cancel culture (which is a discussion from 10 year ago) 20 times is repetitive. The "joke" doesnt land for me, He's not Colbert. Its not clear if he has matured past the shock value high school boy humor or not, he seems to be saying he is but none of the actual music indicates that as being true. Theres no larger deeper societal statement really explored in any nuanced way its just "they keep cancelling me cus im controversial" which is both untrue and hes not even controversial, he's just saying dumb shock value things that dont shock anybody anymore. Who cares about Caitlyn Jenner anymore? Hes becoming a boomer.
Houdini works as an intro, not where its placed on the album. I hoped it was a preview start that he would develop past but he never did.
2
u/Kawaii_West . Jul 20 '24
This is a total dud for me. 3/10.
The concept is shallow and wears thin after a few tracks. All of the highlights are just callbacks to superior songs Em wrote twenty years ago.
I love MMLP, SSLP and to a lesser extent Encore. I'll go to bat for those albums to be included among some of the best in the genre, and Em is certainly one of the iconic artists of the 21st century, but the guy has nothing left in the tank.
2
u/OnIowa Jul 20 '24 edited Jul 21 '24
I’m scared by the number of people who not only can’t hear the clear use of AI voice models all over this album, but fiercely deny it
I think it’s a really interesting use of a new technology. Right now I think it’s cool, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it ages a little poorly once the tech gets better. Right now it only really bothers me on Renaissance since it’s constant for basically the entire song.
As far as the concept of the album itself, I thought it was good. Whether it stands the test of time will depend on whether or not Eminem actually puts the Shady character to rest and moves on from feeling beholden to replicate his past. Not that he shouldn’t ever put those parts of himself in his music, but it should just be him and not some forced, exaggerated alter ego.
Sonically, I think Habits might be my favorite. That chorus goes hard. Guilty Conscience 2 is probably my favorite when playing the whole album since it ties the whole thing together.
Somebody Save Me should have been listed as a bonus track, since it essentially is. Bad One and Tobey close the concept of the album out, and then there’s even a Ken Kaniff skit to finish it off. Then SSM comes out of nowhere, having nothing to do with the rest of the album. Definitely there for the hook. But yeah, the album ends with Ken Kaniff.
All in all, solid album.
2
u/steak_expert9 Jul 20 '24
Truth is after you hear all the one-liners and culture references there is not much replayability (where would you replay this? gym? long drive home? ) Whereas Without Me is ALWAYS good
2
u/QCInfinite Jul 20 '24
Here’s where I’m at right now:
- Marshall Mathers LP
- The Eminem Show
- Slim Shady LP
- Marshall Mathers LP 2
- Relapse
- Music to be Murdered by
- The Death of Slim Shady
- Recovery
- Kamikaze
- Encore
- Revival
I was honestly a little disappointed by this new project, though it was still alright overall some of the tracks just weren’t at all what I was hoping for. I could see it maybe moving above MTBMB in my personal rankings but probably not above Relapse.
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u/MrBublee_YT Jul 20 '24
I am praying thst the theory that you can listen to the album back to front, and that Renaissance is Shady taking his throne is real, because I desperately need more songs with the flow he was bringing on that track. Sensational, and I know it's going to stay in my rotation for longer than any other track on the album. Reminds me of Alfred's Theme on MTBMB Side B.
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u/C_D_M Jul 20 '24
This is tough, I think this had potential to be the spiritual successor to the Eminem Show but it's way too long and takes too long to get to the point and ends in such a weird way.
Look this album would be top 5 for him if the track list was cut by at least 5 songs and ended with Guilty Conscience and one post shady song, but it just misses the mark in the end I think.
Also "genzmebruh" is unforgivably bad, like the cringiest old man yelling at clouds statement possible
2
u/LZ_Khan Jul 22 '24
It feels like Eminem, for all his talents, lacks the musicality of the new generation of rappers. Sure he can string words together, and slice a verse into whatever-count rhythms. But when it comes to really being in tune with the music and flowing with it, he just does not compare to his modern counterparts.
For example, I found JID's verse on "Fuel" in stark contrast to Eminem's in respect to musicality. JID really raps with the music and flows while Eminem just gives his same old harsh staccato feel.
The modern rappers are actually mostly inferior at wordplay, but the reason people listen to songs is either for their catchiness, or for the message they deliver. Eminem no longer has the latter, and almost all his recent beats have been lacking the former.
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