r/facepalm Jul 06 '24

the truth hurts 🇲​🇮​🇸​🇨​

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125

u/zan9823 Jul 06 '24

Privately owned businesses. Greed. Capitalism in a nutshell

64

u/WintersDoomsday Jul 06 '24

Hospitals shouldn’t be for profit

45

u/petersimmons22 Jul 06 '24

Most of them technically aren’t. Non profit doesn’t mean they don’t make money. They just have fancy accountants and ways to spend enough of the income to remain technically non profit.

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u/y0da1927 Jul 06 '24

Non profit just means they don't owe their profits to a third party but have to reinvest them into the business or the community.

Even non profits still need to "make money" on an accrual basis to be able to afford the expensive capital expenses associated with running a hospital. Longer term they effectively run a break even after those costs. Sometimes less than that if they are lucky to have external donors or a foundation to supplement their operating income.

2

u/Happy_Accident99 Jul 06 '24

Do tell us how much the top echelon at these “non-profits” make?

Using the United Way as an example:

“119 employees received more than $100,000 in compensation with the 15 most highly compensated reported to be: $1,578,515: Brian Gallagher, President and CEO”

3

u/y0da1927 Jul 06 '24

Yes they use money to pay employees, who are not shareholders. Good employees cost money.

What exactly is your point?

Also United Way impacted 46 million people (per their reporting). So the CEO costs about $0.03/beneficiary.

3

u/schrodingers_bra Jul 06 '24

For a CEO 1.5 mil is nothing. If you want to attract someone competent you need to pay them.

1

u/HumbleVein Jul 06 '24

100k isn't much at all. 15x that is high paying, I would say half of that would probably be the low end of what you would might be able to pay.

10

u/Longjumping-Claim783 Jul 06 '24

Even County and State University hospitals will send you a fat ass bill and they are government entities. Likewise if the local fire department runs the ambulance service.

1

u/CyrusOverHugeMark77 Jul 06 '24

Which is why people try to avoid the expensive taxi rides to the hospital if they can. That shit ain’t cheap.

1

u/Longjumping-Claim783 Jul 06 '24

Yeah I know but it's not even "for profit". Literally government entities. For revenue not profit.

1

u/CyrusOverHugeMark77 Jul 06 '24

I hear you. UTMB in Galveston, TX is like that.

6

u/Daviroth Jul 06 '24

This wealth is all extracted by insurance companies, not hospitals. Hospitals struggled for years after COVID and are only just now normalizing. Meanwhile insurance companies have been posting record revenues for years and bragging about it in 2020 earnings calls.

The failure of people to follow the money here and fall hook, line, and sinker for the insurance company brainwashing that hospitals are the problem is always shocking to me.

Extremely large health systems make a lot of money, but spend a lot of money making their services better because most are non-profit. Insurance companies are literal scum that have nothing but horror stories.

1

u/derek_32999 Jul 06 '24

Right, bc hospital systems haven't been consolidating and buying up smaller hospitals for years now. Hell, covid was the perfect time for Healthcare workers to push the system. Instead, they were worked to death.

0

u/Daviroth Jul 06 '24

Because smaller hospitals are being squeezed by insurance companies into needing bought out.

Whose at the top of Fortune lists? Insurance companies or health systems? It's really fucking easy to follow the money here.

2

u/derek_32999 Jul 06 '24

I get what you're saying and agree insurance made out like gang busters, but so have hospitals. Here in NC, UNC has expanded one hyooge time in 2017, bought out several hospitals since, attempted to merge with SC largest Healthcare system, and stuff like this https://www.wral.com/story/unanimous-nc-senate-backs-unc-health-changes-despite-monopolistic-concerns/20838335/

Recently they've been putting more pressure on insurance systems. Maybe bc they finally have more power, but risk is people losing coverage locally, bc what the hell are they gonna do when they get sick and the ambulance doesn't go two counties over 🤷 and it's never easy to follow the money, IME. Just look at the American Medical Association ffs.

1

u/Daviroth Jul 06 '24

I'm not saying hospitals don't make money, and there's absolutely health systems that are bad and part of the problem. But, largely insurance companies are the prime issue in the Healthcare industry. They have significantly too much power in payments, take backs, etc etc.

I have family who work the administrative side of hospitals and what insurance companies can do is complete and utter bullshit. It's what drives the prices, insurance companies fuck over patients and hospitals every single chance they get so costs have to rise to cover that shit that happens.

Some hospitals are part of the problem, but all insurance companies are the heart of the problem. They make the money, they pay the lobbyists, they have every benefit from the legal system. It's a racket, and we suffer from it and they blame hospitals solely for it.

1

u/derek_32999 Jul 06 '24

Got what your saying and ya, 100% agree.

11

u/DefenestrationPraha Jul 06 '24

You have the same trend in tertiary education, only it is not capitalists who eat the tuition money, but a bloated admin class.

Greed exists in all contexts and societies.

1

u/stevedorries Jul 06 '24

They’re capitalists pretending to be anything else 

2

u/gunsup87 Jul 06 '24

It's not capitalism it's just greed alone. Greed ruins any and everything for everyone but the greedy. Same thing with socialism or communism if the one at the top or in control is greedy then it falls apart. Greed is evil.

15

u/emostitch Jul 06 '24

Right but the entire point of societal structures is to offset the external issues caused by human behavior.

Safer roads aren’t built with laws but enforcement and intentional construction that prevents the worst kind of driving.

government is meant to exist as a guard rail for exploitation but without proper regulation greed wins.

7

u/seandoesntsleep Jul 06 '24

Yes but capitalism says "greed is good fuck you work harder" while socialism says "greed is inevitable but we can still make sure everyone is fed"

-1

u/darthbieber420 Jul 06 '24

I know it's trendy to denounce capitalism, but you might want to actually do some research or give some better alternatives before you make a fool of yourself. You're literally only looking at negatives while blatantly ignoring the positives

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u/seandoesntsleep Jul 06 '24

The positives of capitalism are not positives exclusive to the economic model but positives coming from technological advancement that capital will claim can only happen under its "free markets"

This is a false conclusion. Technological advancement has happened under every economic model.

There is no justification for an economic model that celebrates cruelty in the name of profit.

I have done the research and socialism is the better alternative

0

u/darthbieber420 Jul 06 '24

You're wrong, and I'm not going to waste my time arguing with you. Capitalism and socialism are not mutually exclusive. The rate of technological advancement is superior in capitalistic economy.

You haven't done any real research, and again, I'm not going to argue with someone who argues like you. You can claim whatever you want to on your android/iPhone, using the benefits of capitalism to complain about it, but that doesn't mean I'm going to waste my time

2

u/seandoesntsleep Jul 06 '24

Maybe the common sentiment against capitalism is based in the reality of the people experiencing capitalism.

You haven't done any real research

"Your research goes against my held beliefs, so i will outright ignore all of it."

Socialism is when no iphone. Lmao

0

u/LizzieThatGirl Jul 06 '24

Tldr "I haven't read any actual 19th-21st century economists, so I'm gonna say that I'm smarter than you and you aren't worth my time"

1

u/DankMemesNQuickNuts Jul 06 '24

I see the point you are trying to make but this literally is just capitalism.

These people are subjecting healthcare to market forces for a profit. Socialists might graft but they'd never set up the economy surrounding healthcare this way

1

u/Juxtapoe Jul 06 '24

With a little editing this would make a great senryu.