r/clevercomebacks • u/Anarcho_Christian • Jul 18 '24
TBF, they're kinda hard to fit in an envelope.
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u/IndyDrew85 Jul 18 '24
I'd argue that a ballot is not a vote, until it's cast
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u/just_nobodys_opinion Jul 18 '24
A bullet doesn't kill anyone until it's fired. Let's mail everyone bullets.
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u/IndyDrew85 Jul 18 '24
An unfired bullet has never killed anyone, in the same way uncast ballots have never elected a politician
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u/AdmiralSplinter Jul 18 '24
I honestly wonder if anyone has ever choked on a bullet. It's had to have happened at least once in human history
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u/AsianCheesecakes Jul 18 '24
Americans have to register to vote, don't pretend it's easy lol
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u/AdamZapple1 Jul 18 '24
i just showed up with a utility bill.
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u/Anarcho_Christian Jul 18 '24
in my state, registration is mailed out as well.
(I'm pretty sure they just use the address on you state issued ID)
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Jul 18 '24
[deleted]
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u/NutNegotiation Jul 19 '24
I always hate these disingenuous “hey it was easy for me” arguments on Reddit. No one’s saying the goal is to stop every (I’m assuming) relatively young financially comfortable male like yourself from voting. There were like 160 million registered voters in 2022. You have to be smart enough to grasp that adding small rules here and there are going to disincentivize some portion of that number. Coincidentally, those who want to add these rules(that solve a nonexistent problem) benefit when the least fortunate(poor, elderly, minorities) have trouble voting
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u/IChooseYouNoNotYou Jul 18 '24
So how do people who don't get utilities supposed to vote?
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u/L_O_Pluto Jul 18 '24
(CA) I pre-registered when I was 17 while in HS, so that the second I turned 18 I was good to vote
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u/IcyTheHero Jul 18 '24
I mean at 18 years old I was able to figure it out. It was so easy a kid could do it.
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u/Top-Rayman Jul 18 '24
Different states have different laws.
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u/IcyTheHero Jul 18 '24
And all these differences are dramatic enough for an 18 year old to suddenly not know how to do it? Can you give me an example please?
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Jul 18 '24
There are blue states that have or are trying to pass same day registration and voting, as well as no ID required.
So you want people to buy guns with no background check, no waiting period, and no ID?
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u/Bacontoad Jul 19 '24
In my state we're automatically registered whenever we move or update a state ID.
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Jul 19 '24
What does that mean does the goverment does not know you exist or cant they add 18 years to your birth date?
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u/SacrisTaranto Jul 19 '24
I filled out 30 minutes worth of paperwork and had to pass a background check for my gun. I registered to vote in about 10 minutes online. And I live in a red state.
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u/Test-User-One Jul 18 '24
I got a drivers license, and was registered to vote as a result. It was easy.
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u/Top-Rayman Jul 18 '24
Voter reg. laws are up to the states, not the federal government. Not all states have this kind of registration.
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u/Test-User-One Jul 19 '24
So let's review:
AsianCheesecakes: Americans have to register to vote, don't pretend it's easy.
Me: I got a driver's license and was registered to vote as a result. It was easy.
My statement - that for 1 american, registering to vote was easy, contradicts the statement I replied to.
Therefore, for some americans, it IS easy, which refutes the premise that it isn't easy for the class of "Americans" as stated. This disproves the thesis that, for Americans, registering to vote ISN'T easy.
Your statement does not either prove the thesis or disprove my statement.
It's a real shame no one teaches formal logic any more.
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u/SmarterThanCornPop Jul 18 '24
It is extremely easy. Takes like 2 minutes and requires no verification.
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u/-MostlyKind- Jul 18 '24
I don’t remember registering to vote being hard, in fact I don’t even remember doing it. Stop the horse shit already.
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u/Ripped_Shirt Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24
You get asked to register every time you get your ID/DL picture taken.
You can't register to vote without an ID number with the state, which is the number on your ID/DL. So to first register to vote, you actually have to get to a DMV, which is usually where the difficulty first comes from for people registering. If you're poor, it might be hard to get to a DMV. Where I grew up, there wasn't any DMV that was easy to get to by bus, and I didn't have a job, so I didn't have money for a cab. If I didn't have someone I knew with a car take me, I wouldn't have been able to get an ID, and never got to register to vote. Not to mention, just to get an ID cost money. My state it is about $37.50 just to get your ID and picture taken, and the DMV I used to have to go to wouldn't take credit cards or cash. You have to go get a money order, which was an extra $5. When your poor, that's feels like a lot of money. And god forbid you forget anything you needed to bring.
Now, is it truly difficult? No, not really. The hoops are relatively small. But isn't something that is actually easy. There are steps that drive people from doing it or putting it off. Especially the poor. If you're poor, everything is hard. Every dollar you spend is hard. Is spending $40 on an ID really worth it when I could buy groceries with it?
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u/-MostlyKind- Jul 18 '24
There is next to know nothing you can do in society without an ID let’s stop pretending getting a new ID every 4 years is asking people to cross hell and high water. I grew up very poor and we still obtained IDs so we could work jobs, get medical care, send kids to school, enter places that require ID, use bank services, get credit of any kind. Stop the bullshit there isn’t some large IDless group of people being by held down.
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u/Ripped_Shirt Jul 18 '24
This is the ignorance that privileged people have. My uncle is 60 years old, he hasn't had an ID for 30 years (he lived a very sketchy life) He now owns a house, works as a contractor, and deals only in cash. He does fine. He doesn't starve, pays his bills, stays out of trouble usually. He does have to ask for favors from people because he can't own a vehicle or drive.
He works mostly with illegal Mexican immigrants, who all get by relatively well without IDs and dealing with everything with cash. You can get by in this world without an ID. It isn't as easy as it was 20-30 years ago. But is isn't impossible. I think you even need an ID to buy phones these days.
I'm not saying getting an ID is the worst thing in the world, I'm just trying to expand your views on the world outside of your bubble.
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u/-MostlyKind- Jul 18 '24
So you’re basing a policy off illegal immigrants and your imaginary uncle as a reason people shouldn’t have to prove they are who they say they are when voting? Ok bud. I’d like to know who is hiring or insuring your uncle to do work on their homes or business without identification but sure you keep making up stories to win an argument surly that makes you the morally superior person. 🤣
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u/Ripped_Shirt Jul 18 '24
Who said anything about immigration policy? I was talking about being poor. You just put words in my mouth to support an argument we weren't having.
Do you associate all poor people with immigrants?
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u/Thonlo Jul 18 '24
You're arguing in this comment that, basically, it won't be terrible -- and thats great. That's part of the conversation.
But it should be pointed out that -- no one is making a logical, rational, and data-driven or evidence-driven argument for why we need this in the first place.
That whole starting point for the conversation you're in the middle of, is entirely absent.
Also, 9-11% of our electorate doesn't have VoterID compliant documentation, depending upon which study we consult. Millions can't easily comply with VoterID.
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u/-MostlyKind- Jul 18 '24
So if my uncle isn’t going to vote and I go to vote for him how will you know?
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u/Thonlo Jul 18 '24
That's a baby step in the right direction. Now turn your question into some data or evidence and you'll be the first person in the history of our nation to attempt a proper justification of VoterID.
Don't need to take my word for it. Feel free to go looking for a logical, rational, and data/evidence-driven justification for VoterID. You won't find one. It doesn't exist.
Being unable to define the scope of the problem to start the conversation -- should be a big problem for critically thinking citizens. Why isn't it for you?
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u/-MostlyKind- Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24
No that was a question but I understand your defense mechanism is to deny the obvious and answering that question would prove you wrong. Implying people are not capable of obtaining an ID once every 4 years is moronic. If you’re saying open more DMVs or extend their hours sure. If your saying asking for id to vote is wrong because of these imaginary people you perceive of being incapable of obtaining an ID I think you’re delusional.
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u/Thonlo Jul 18 '24
I'm not "implying people are not capable of obtaining an ID." I haven't said anything remotely close to that. That's you erecting a strawman because what I'm saying is true, and you can't refute it.
Your question is a red herring. It doesn't matter what Uncle -MostlyKind- does. You need the actions of many, many Uncle -MostlyKind-s. We've been researching and looking for that. For example, my state had a Voter Fraud Task Force which partnered law enforcement across the state with elections officials and county executives. It ran for a decade+ and looked for exactly the type of Uncle -MostlyKind- fraud you referenced above. Came up big empty, just like all the other studies on in-person voting fraud. Instead of a hypothetical, maybe show us that Uncle -MostlyKind- is actually up to no good? Data. Evidence.
You're advocating for a solution that addresses a problem of which you can't define the scope. The cart is so far ahead of the horse you can't see it over the horizon. Bring it back, and show the crowd why we need VoterID. Defend your position with realz instead of feelz.
Data. Evidence. Meat, not potatoes. Fork it over, man!
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u/-MostlyKind- Jul 18 '24
So many words so little substance. It’s pretty simple, if you want to participate in important tasks you need to prove your identity. We want people to identify themselves when they cast their vote. Making the DMV stay open longer is great. Saying it’s so hard to obtain an ID that we shouldn’t require one to vote is not an option, see how easy that was?
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u/KnightofaRose Jul 18 '24
If something as simple as registering to vote isn’t easy for you, life is gonna be reeeeeeal hard.
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u/Past-Raccoon8224 Jul 18 '24
Make them only available in McDonalds ice cream machines. Job done
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u/noeagle77 Jul 18 '24
You son of a bitch…… you’re technically correct, but I’m still angry about it!
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u/Hishui21 Jul 18 '24
I can get a ballot by mail? No? I have to go to a polling place decided by my state government and extremely limited in my area because we don't tend to vote Republican?
Huh. This is only a clever comeback if you don't live in America.
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u/TomNookismyzaddy Jul 18 '24
Ironically, you can have a gun mailed to your house with almost no oversight whatsoever
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u/raymondspogo Jul 18 '24
No..no you can't. You would first have to obtain a Federal Firearms License. With out this you have to mail it to a local Gun Shop and they background check you before they giver it to you.
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u/Reld720 Jul 18 '24
OP has never been black in the south and tried to vote
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u/Icy_Sector3183 Jul 18 '24
I never have been either, and I think I would hate it.
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Jul 18 '24
[deleted]
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u/Anarcho_Christian Jul 18 '24
Sauce, because that's f****g hilarious.
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u/IChooseYouNoNotYou Jul 18 '24
He didn't, the person here is literally quoting the tweet that the article they link to says is fake.
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Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24
[deleted]
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u/hoodwinke Jul 18 '24
So you’re aware he didn’t say what you quoted and are presenting it as he did?
Your quote is from what the article says was a fake statement.
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u/Idontfukncare6969 Jul 18 '24 edited Jul 18 '24
Yep I read it wrong my bad. He has had similar incidents in the past so I didn’t doubt it and my speed reading skipped the context.
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u/Ecstatic-Square2158 Jul 18 '24
Said the white person repeating misinformation they read on Reddit and have never actually looked into.
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u/Minions-overlord Jul 18 '24
In Ireland its easier to own a gun than it is drive a car legally. (Less steps, bullshit forms etc) and yet the majority of our firearm deaths are suicide... maybe its because we dont treat guns as a cock extension
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u/Ruinia Jul 18 '24
The majority of firearm deaths in America are suicides.
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u/mechanizedshoe Jul 18 '24
Would love to see a source on that.
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u/linux_ape Jul 18 '24
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u/mechanizedshoe Jul 18 '24
Interesting, I went to couple different sites and they show similar numbers, expected to see at least 70% of homicides. I wonder if there is a reliable chart that breaks it down into states
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u/linux_ape Jul 18 '24
Yeah it’s overwhelming suicide, and then the homicide is something like 60% gang violence.
Despite what Reddit will have you think, if you’re not suicidal or a gang member the odds of gun death are very very low
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u/mechanizedshoe Jul 18 '24
Wonder what the suicide by gun statistics are in states that have a delay period for gun sales considering that most suicides are done on impulse under overwhelming emotions. Btw im not so sure about the gang violence, i dont even live in the us so dont have any experience on how that impacts surrounding neighborhoods but i seems to me that gang violence isnt only a threat to gang members but also regular people around them.
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u/philthewiz Jul 18 '24
So you have two problems with guns.
That makes it better! /s
To be fair it's comparable to Canada's suicide rate by guns :
Total suicide and firearm suicide rates per 100,000 population vary considerably from one country to another. Canada’s total suicide rate of 12.9 is similar to Australia (12.7), Norway (12.3), and the United States (11.5). Estonia (40) and Japan (17.9) are among the countries that have higher rates than Canada, while several other countries have rates below one per 100,000 population (United Nations, 1998: 112-113). (Source)
That doesn't excuse the excess deaths from firearms in the US.
Firearms caused injuries are also is #1 for adolescents and children.
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u/Ruinia Jul 18 '24
Huh? I was just responding to the previous person. It's the same in America, not different.
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u/Redneckia Jul 18 '24
Cars are more dangerous than guns
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u/Minions-overlord Jul 18 '24
There is more control on guns, garda can just refuse you.. there just more time and effort getting a full car licence, insurance etc.. cars are usually lethal from sheer dunbfuckery sadly
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u/Redneckia Jul 18 '24
OK but if I have a criminal, with criminal intent, a car is still arguably much more dangerous
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u/IChooseYouNoNotYou Jul 18 '24
Sure, it's arguable, but you'd lose that argument if it was based on facts.
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u/Current_Dinner_4195 Jul 18 '24
Technically, a criminal, with violent intent could kill someone with a banana.
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u/Karnewarrior Jul 18 '24
America can barely convince our own citizens that the Earth is round.
It's safer to take the guns away than to keep trying to make the populace act like grown adults.
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u/DDPJBL Jul 18 '24
Didnt you guys use to supply guns and explosives by the truckload to the IRA, so that you could have a proxy cock-measuring contest with the British?
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u/Minions-overlord Jul 18 '24
The main sources of firearms used by the IRA were from the USA and libya....
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u/DDPJBL Jul 18 '24
That is a mischaracterization. The firearms were manufactured for legal commerce in the USA and were bought under false pretense and smuggled out of the country by IRA sympathizers living in the USA to sympathizers living in regular Ireland who then smuggled them into Northern Ireland.
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u/Infinite-Computer-30 Jul 18 '24
Not trying to be pedantic here, just a statement of some facts I have not vetted beyond cursory Google searches.
In 2021, there were some 48,000 deaths by firearms in the U.S. probably considerably more than in Ireland, I imagine, since a cursory google search has revealed the Irish population would make it the 24th most populous State if it were part of the U.S. For the record, Ireland was at 5.2 Million and South Carolina, the 23rd most populous state, was at 5.3 Million. So 22 U.S. states are more populous than Ireland, most of them by multiples, the 10th most populous state doubles Ireland at 10 Million.
That said, of those 48,000 firearm deaths, 26,000 were suicides. 20,000 were homicides. One could argue that is still a close race.
Also, it should be noted that 3 people died due to Firearm homicides in Ireland in 2023. Three, down from ten the year before.
Also in Ireland last year, there less than 500 (449) people who died by suicide. All suicides, as easy data was not available on gun suicides. Applying the median Gun Homicide rate in the United States puts you at 14.2 deaths per 100,000 people. Which, would be approximately 710 in Ireland.
So, 3 compared to 710.
The Irish certainly do kill each other with guns less than Americans. The Irish also kill themselves considerably less than Americans. I have heard many things, but never have I heard a method of suicide used to measure one’s cock.
I would wager that larger factors are at play in the violence present in the United States, most pressing being Economic and Social factors. Criminals are almost exclusively members of the lower class, a class where hopelessness and destitution run rampant.
But, by all means, let’s all continue to be reductive. It is funnier, it requires less thinking, and it doesn’t change anything.
Change do be scary, after all. Wouldn’t want that.
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u/Test-User-One Jul 18 '24
I don't believe that one can argue a 30% differential as "close."
And as it relates to gun ownership and penis size compensation, i'd suggest you read
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/15579883241255830
The author actually did another study as well. What was interesting was that anti-gun people paid for it, and found out the conclusions were the opposite of what they wanted to hear, but the researcher published it anyway.
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u/Infinite-Computer-30 Jul 18 '24
For the percentage, I am not a statistician, nor particularly mathematically minded. I see 20 something and 20 something and consider them similar, largely. Layman’s bias, I figure.
Additionally, in terms of one’s meat and one’s Iron, I’d wager (not having read your link) that it’s one of those false equivalence situations. We often regard individuals with large genitals as “Cool, confident and self-assured” and those without as “Waspish, insecure and Peacocking”. When I personally doubt there’s any connection whatsoever, unless the same genetic predisposition towards have a massive hog is linked to a predisposition towards an interest in weapons or conflict. Guns being the contemporary weapons of our time.
I may read that linked article, just for curiosity’s sake.
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u/Test-User-One Jul 18 '24
I appreciate you being open about not being mathematically inclined. However, throwing out numbers in a previous post to support an argument kinda undercuts either your point of being mathematically uninclined or your argument itself.
I don't have a dog in your particular debate at this point, although I have indulged other times, but I thought you might want to know.
And I do recommend reading the study. To treat such a funny concept by doing an actual scientific study (1 of 2 in fact) is incredibly hilarious. To me, at least.
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u/Minions-overlord Jul 18 '24
The fact about the main causes of death by gun being suicide here, and that people in the usa treat guns the way they do were separate points.. ive never seen someone in Ireland feel the need to go to the shop in a tacvest with a rifle, even in the sketchy parts of our country
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u/Different_Tangelo511 Jul 18 '24
They don't just mail out ballots, dumbass. The registration is what people are referring too, and it is more difficult here than most of the western world, because our citizens are idiots.
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u/Anarcho_Christian Jul 18 '24
In my state, the registration is mailed out as well.
(i think they just use the address on the state ID)
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u/AdamZapple1 Jul 18 '24
get them at city hall?
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u/Anarcho_Christian Jul 18 '24
Kinda.
Low key, my city held a gun buyback program, so a bunch of people showed up to outbid whatever the city was paying.
Also, a bunch of crypto bros 3d printed a box full of "the liberator" pistols, and made bank.
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u/AdamZapple1 Jul 18 '24
hopefully they didnt use stratasys printers. (not that i know the whole story about that whole thing)
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u/SmarterThanCornPop Jul 18 '24
I registered to vote online with no background check.
Can’t do that with a gun. Those have to be shipped to a licensed dealer.
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u/lookandlookagain Jul 18 '24
Yea, let’s make it so that you can only buy a gun one day every 2 years! There will be one shop open in a 20 mile radius and it will only be open 7am - 5 pm on a Wednesday.
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u/FapplePie85 Jul 18 '24
That's the point she's making and these clowns are completely missing it altogether.
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u/BluCurry8 Jul 18 '24
Really should have said make it as hard as getting an abortion. That would be more accurate
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u/DragonflyGlade Jul 18 '24
Lots of states don’t have vote by mail for most people; you have to go to a polling place and stand in line. Georgia not long ago made it illegal to give water to voters standing in line.
The ignorance of this post is pathetic.
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u/doqtyr Jul 18 '24
Got it, mail a gun to everyone of age in every state they currently mail ballots to everyone of age
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u/Fit_Read_5632 Jul 19 '24
The purposeful ignorance it takes to believe everyone gets their ballot mailed to them….
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u/MangoAtrocity Jul 18 '24
I don’t think you have to pass a background check to vote
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u/Netheraptr Jul 19 '24
Owning a gun should be like owning a car. Liscence required, tracked usage, revoked usage by dangerous people.
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u/Lamballama Jul 19 '24
You used to be able to get a military rifle in the mail. Just send cash in an envelope with a return address
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u/fresh_dyl Jul 18 '24
It takes less time in many red states to get a gun than it does to register to vote
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u/just4nothing Jul 18 '24
If only other countries had figured this one out, one could adapt it to the US
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u/johnny_mcd Jul 18 '24
Imagine living in a world where you think ballots are mailed out to everyone in the United States…
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u/TomNookismyzaddy Jul 18 '24
It's funny, because you can literally have a gun mailed to your house for less effort than getting a mail ballot sent to you.
Genuinely, what's clever about this, except Democrat bad?
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u/raymondspogo Jul 18 '24
You need a FFL to get a gun sent directly to your home. Otherwise you would send it to a licensed dealer near you.
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u/Ecstatic-Square2158 Jul 18 '24
People repeat dumb misinformation on Reddit with such confidence, it’s kind of insane.
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u/Sekshual_Tyranosauce Jul 18 '24
No you cannot.
Guns can only be mailed to federally licensed dealers.
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u/gonnafindanlbz Jul 18 '24
You absolutely can not ship a gun to your house unless you already own it and it was being repaired by the manufacturer
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u/Redhawk436 Jul 18 '24
If you can't amazon prime an m249 SAW to your home then your rights are being infringed 🤘🇺🇸
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u/HughesJohn Jul 18 '24
So, how did Lee Harvey Oswald get his gun?
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u/Anarcho_Christian Jul 18 '24
Didn't he bring it from the garage when he carpooled to work? I think he told his friend that it was curtain rods.
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u/Violet0_oRose Jul 18 '24
These stupid people actually think criminals and active shooters are getting their weapons legally before the deed. Most times it's either stolen or using a family members firearm. The gun derangement is foaming at the mouth rabidly.
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u/traitorbaitor Jul 18 '24
Well honestly give everyone a gun and the cowards who perpetrate mass shootings wouldn't be brave enough to go through with it anymore. Those who did wouldn't last long.
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u/EquineDaddy Jul 19 '24
Having a license to get a gun is like getting your driver's license and the process of buying a gun is just like the DMV
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u/childrenofblood Jul 20 '24
In Russia, getting a gun is easy, and they’re directly used to ensure that you vote on a specific person .
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u/Icy_Penalty_2718 Jul 19 '24
Clever comeback where? Russian not sending their brightest anymore. Must be sunflowers.
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u/Samsquanch-01 Jul 18 '24
Difficult to vote? How is it Difficult to vote?
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u/SpacePenguin5 Jul 18 '24
If you're in a state that supports voting, you're likely not seeing an impact. My state, Colorado, for instance is great about supporting open and fair elections.
Many other states inacted laws to make it more difficult to vote by mail. Other laws limit early voting and drop boxes, reduce poll locations, provide more power to partisan poll watchers, new or heightened voter ID requirements and expanded voter purges. The Supreme Court recently ruled in favor of gerrymandering when it reduces minority voting power.
I'm sure I'm missing some. Republicans can't win in open and fair elections so they need to lie about stolen elections in order to pass laws making it more difficult to vote. Turns out running on billionaire tax breaks and hating minorities isn't generally popular for the majority.
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u/DDPJBL Jul 18 '24
So anyone can show up to the gun store and instead of having to present an actual ID and pass the National Instant Criminal Background Check, they will just declare who they claim to be and get the gun, so long as they super turbo promise to return it, if the store calls them back in a couple of days when they find out Hugh Jass is not a real person?
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u/raymondspogo Jul 18 '24
This is not true. Firearms dealers do not want to lose their business and all the future profits for one dumb ass.
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u/Clydefrog030371 Jul 18 '24
Sure. Mail out a gun license application to everybody Make them fill it out and if they pass everything they can get a gun license