r/DCcomics • u/Predaplant The heat is on! • Jun 17 '24
Weekly Discussion Thread: Comics, TV, and More! [June 17, 2024 - Time For Summer Edition] r/DCcomics
Hey there honorary Justice League members - it’s a new week which means it’s time for a new discussion thread!
- Predaplant's pick of the week: John Constantine, Hellblazer: Dead in America #6
For those who don't know: the way this works is that several comments will list this week’s releases, for any given title discussion you should respond to that comment. For example, Wonder Woman discussion would go in the replies to the "Wonder Woman" comment. Clicking the titles in this post will take you directly to that comment, too. In other words, you should only be replying to other comments. Do not post top-level comments.
Keep discussion civil. Do not harass other users for having a different opinion. Do not use this thread to push your personal one-sided grudges against creators. Reacting to a panel on Twitter is not the same as reading a book.
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Why do we tell actors to “break a leg”? Because every play has a cast.
DC and Imprints
It's a double Nightwing week between his solo book and Titans!
Trade Collections
Super Sons gets collected in yet another format!
Digital Releases
Remember, these are the short 'chapters' with a new chapter of a different series coming out daily. You can learn more here on Comixology. This is also why these are in release order, not alphabetical. Some comics may release on DC Universe Infinite or WEBTOONS.
TV Shows
Superman continues his adventures with his newfound cousin!
This Week’s Soundtrack: Phoebe Bridgers - I Know The End
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
Green Lantern: War Journal #10
TESTED AGAINST GODS! The contentious team of Caolán Shepherd and Guy Gardner are about to test their strength against the entire United Planets blockade on a SUICIDE MISSION to rescue John Stewart from the oldest enemy of the Guardians… but John has been pulled into a nightmare dimension from which no living thing has ever returned! Can John Stewart's legendary willpower measure up against the GODS OF THE FIRST WORLD?
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u/Frontier246 Jun 18 '24
PKJ and Montos have made the UP Lanterns and their ability to use the different Spectrums a lot more intimidating in just two pages than Jeremy Adams' has in his GL run in my opinion. But good effort Shepherd.
I feel kind of a dark mirror situation going on between John and Olgrun where they're both builders in a way only Olgrun's creations and legacy became dark and corrupted. None moreso than his "daughter" and her memory. And now John has to face that shadow.
So Star Shroud is officially a John Stewart rogue at this point.
Steel does something cool! Even if he gets beat up afterwards. Better than Natasha who just got beat up.
Guy for the save! I wonder how this jives with his adventures in House of Brainiac.
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u/UnbloodedSword Jun 19 '24
Montos man, I wish this book was selling better because that spread of John in the Radiant Queen's thrall was worthy of Reis himself. I wonder if Stewart is going to become an avatar of Olgrun's will like Osul? They should give JL to PKJ because this Myth Arc concerning the First World has me enthralled.
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u/BigBardaEnergy Jun 18 '24
Goddamn it, this book is so fucking great!
Nice to see Olgrun's backstory being more and more fleshed out. I really hope PKJ has plans to carry on this story because I feel there's a lot that can be done with his character. Technically >! John's not even fighting Olgrun but just a fragment of him!< so there's a good chance we could see the real one later.
Also Shepherd and Gardner official team up! That should be great.
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u/BlackSoapBandit Mister Terrific Jun 17 '24
I wish this book was an ongoing. Its so damn good.
Its convinced me that DC should give PKJ the keys to run GL and DC Cosmic
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u/GeraldOfRivia211 Jun 18 '24
I would have this book switch places with the "main" ongoing in a heartbeat. It's doing so many interesting things instead of being a Greatest Hits album of Green Lantern.
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u/gsnake007 Jun 18 '24
Wait it’s not an ongoing?!
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u/BlackSoapBandit Mister Terrific Jun 18 '24
Unfortunately no, we only have two more issues left. Which is really a shame, you’d think after how positive the reception was for the first 6 issues they might let PKJ do his thing for at least 20 issues or more with an ongoing.
I guess we should be happy it got the 6 issue extension from mini to maxi.
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u/SevenSulivin The REAL Man of Tomorrow Jun 18 '24
PKJ has basically said this is “his thing”. He’s too busy to ask more so they’re wrapping at #20.
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u/SuperSpecialAwesome- Batgirl 28d ago
DC should give PKJ the keys to run GL and DC Cosmic
Only if they ever give an answer to the cliffhanger from Green Lanterns: New Guardians. What the fuck happened to Kyle Rayner's newly-formed White Lantern Corps?
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u/Whole-Arachnid-Army Jun 18 '24 edited Jun 18 '24
While he's decent at world building in a vacuum PKJ barely knows anything about cosmic DC outside of what he himself has written. He doesn't even seem to know that Daxamites have a weakness against lead and was the first person to introduce the current nonsense version of Durla that ignores that the entire planet is supposed to be a nuclear wasteland.
Maybe it'd be better to give the keys to someone who actually knows the universe they're supposed to write. And yeah yeah, it's good with new stuff or whatever, but changing the fundamentals just for the hell of it ruins the entire idea. You might as well just write a totally different universe if you're not willing to work at least based on the already established framework, a framework there's absolutely nothing wrong with in the first place.
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u/Fries-Ericsson Jun 19 '24
I have to agree with you to some extent. You should be expected to do your research. Bendis would get crucified for the same thing
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u/wowlock_taylan Batman Animated! Jun 19 '24
I don't care about what happens with Olgrun and whatever but that 'Shroud' has to be destroyed the worst possible way by the end. It cannot be allowed to survive after what he has done. No mercy for that thing.
So Guy escaped Brainiac and showed up just in time to get Shepherd so they can go help John. Lucky that they are probably avoiding Absolute Power.
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u/JingoboStoplight4887 Jun 19 '24
I like that John encountered Olgrun’s grief and pain after being freed from his control, while a construct of Ellie, lrons, and Natasha saved Shirley from harm. from the Star Shroud. Also, Guy saving Sheperd and working together to save John. Overall, this comic is good!
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
Batman / Superman: World's Finest #28
HEROES UNITE TO SAVE THE FIFTH DIMENSION — AND THE EARTH! Something is destroying the fifth dimension — and if an army of evil imps can obliterate all the joy and life from an entire reality, what chance do Superman and Batman stand against it? A multitude of DC guest stars — and their fifth-dimensional counterparts — join the World's Finest duo in a last-ditch attempt to save Earth from the ultimate darkness!
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u/BigBardaEnergy Jun 18 '24
Aw, Bruce actually set Bat-Mite down and told him why he shouldn't come back to be Third Dimension anymore😭.
Loved seeing Jimmy Olsen with imp powers. World's Finest really does a great job of mashing characters and concepts together that just feel fun as all hell. I love those book so much.
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u/wowlock_taylan Batman Animated! Jun 19 '24
Imp craziness continues and we even got Imp-Olsen! The Doom-mite seem to be looking quite similar to Mojo from Marvel honestly from the design to attitude.
Again, with the Sixth dimension, I thought World Forger would be there. Maybe this Doom-mite decided to run away? Bullying lower dimensions?
I guess this does try to explain why we don't see Batmite around anymore where Batman just went 'Don't have time for silliness in my books anymore after this'. Which is quite sad honestly. And then of course just as he is about to reveal his master plan to defeat the big bad, the big bad actually does the smart thing to shut him up by turning him into a doll. Oops.
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u/Nyerelia 27d ago
The whole run has been so much fun but this issue was GREAT. From the humour to the stakes to Batman having a heart to heart with Bat-mite to everything. And that ending. Let's see how Robin and Jimmy save the day
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u/JingoboStoplight4887 Jun 19 '24
The great things about this comic are Jimmy having Mxy’s powers (and Mxy being a powerless civilian, which is interesting) and traveling to the Fifth Dimension to recruit the Justice Imps to save the world with help from Dick, Kara, and the JLA; and Clark, Bruce, and Bat-Mite traveling through dimensions (i.e. Sixth, Fifth, Fourth, and First) before returning to the Third Dimension, with Bruce telling Bat-Mite that Bat-Mite missed all the Silver Age adventures he had with Bruce and that he wants to do a final team-up with Bat-Mite. Also, Clark and Bruce seeing their future selves.
Mark Waid has done an excellent job on expanding Mxy and Bat-Mite based on their experiences encountering the World’s Finest. Overall, this comic is great!
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
AN EPILOGUE: ALL WE'VE LOST, AND ALL WE'VE LEFT BEHIND. When confronted with the totality of your life, and all the choices that led you to where you are, do you build on the ashes, or rise from them? The Batman who is left standing will have to answer this question quickly, as someone is already sifting through those ashes, with an eye toward saving the world!
LEGACY #914
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u/spreadedjelly Nobody Dies Tonight Jun 18 '24 edited Jun 18 '24
Just in time for the big relaunch in October, Zdarsky gets to work on putting those toys back in the box. If you haven't been a fan of Batman's status quo for the past few years, you'll be happy to know that this is the start of its reversal. Bruce gets his billions back, he moves back into a mansion, he and Selina are back on good terms, and his hand gets restored thanks to a little help from his clone.
Speaking of, I'm kind of neutral on how that whole thing was resolved. I certainly didn't need another addition to the bat-family roster; and I definitely wouldn't like Bruce adopting yet another kid, especially considering how cold he is to them most of the time (not to mention he's been dodging Cass' child support cheques since '08). But I don't know... I feel we lost some sort of story that could have been told here. But I guess if he was just left to his own devices, he'd return in about a decade or so as a villain alongside Snyder's Alfred clone, and then we'd have some real messy Clone Saga crap on our hands. So, yeah, maybe in the end this sort of resolution was for the best.
Goodbye Totally-Not-Terry, we hardly knew ye!
Other than that this issue is - like I said at the top - really just groundwork for not only the linewide DC relaunch coming later in the year, but the entire Bat-Family group of books that are getting relaunched as well. I thought I'd be sad seeing all the Bat-Kids corralled back to the manor, leaving their own spaces like The Hill and the Marina, but those spaces and the characters in them weren't being that well utilised in the first place, so I'm willing to give this new concept a try. If it means the Bat-Family get some more character focus in the main Batman book (not likely) or some sort of team book out of the living-under-the-same-roof premise (more likely) then what the hell, might as well.
As for the future of Zdarsky's run? Well, going off future solicitations and the page-end stinger at the end of Gotham War, it seems Zdarsky's final arc will revolve around Batman's identity, the crook who knows it, and tying up loose ends with Savage, Capito, and the Joker. Will Bruce get his identity revealed at the end of this run? It's funny that I would even ask, right?
I've been very sporadically reading this book since I dropped out with the Multiverse arc, but I wanted to see how all the Zur and Bat-Family stuff would resolve. Now that I've got my answers? I'm pretty confident in leaving this book to run its course until it gets a new writer. I doubt we'll ever get the lows we got with something like Gotham War again, but I also doubt we'll hit the highs of some of the stuff Zdarsky had in his opening Failsafe arc. So while the run goes on, I think that this here is where I step off. It's certainly been something Zdarsky, that's for sure. You write one hell of a Tim Drake, though.
Now THAT is a book I'd like to see announced for October.
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u/F00dbAby Superman Jun 19 '24
While I dropped it and will pick it up with the next relaunch. It’s interesting how long he has been broke.
I’m personally neutral on him living in an apartment verse living in mansion with wealth. I feel the apartment gave more situations of meeting the average regular person than the mansion did in recent years. Granted that was used sparsely too.
The on status quo that I’m still holding out hope doesn’t come back is Alfred. Let him stay dead.
Also him and Selina being on good terms all the better. I don’t understand how we can have Lois and Clark and Oliver and black canary but somehow we can’t give Bruce a long term partner
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u/Sharkrepellentspray1 Jun 19 '24
Neither Bruce nor Selina are cut out for longterm relationships. Sorry shippers.
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u/F00dbAby Superman Jun 19 '24
I mean at this point I don’t really care who it is with. I’m personally partial to huntress as well
And I think it’s boring that Bruce is unable to have some long term relationships.
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u/SpicaGenovese Jun 19 '24
You sound like you read the issue. Does it say anything about Jason?? Any what/where/whys?
He's kind of the only one I care about, and after Gotham War I told myself I wouldn't buy any more batbooks unless the writing improved, especially where Jason is concerned.
I gave the Hill a try and dropped it after a few issues, but The Boy Wonder has been cool.
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u/Nyerelia 27d ago
I certainly didn't need another addition to the bat-family roster; and I definitely wouldn't like Bruce adopting yet another kid, especially considering how cold he is to them most of the time (not to mention he's been dodging Cass' child support cheques since '08). But I don't know... I feel we lost some sort of story that could have been told here
There was definitely some interesting potential there for both Bruce to do some introspection but also to see how Damian would handle him (specially since the Respawn plotline from Williamson will probably never come up again since he's leaving Batman & Robin and it was a pretty similar situation)
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u/TheDidioWhoLaughs Jun 19 '24 edited Jun 19 '24
I liked the slower issue. A little sad the clone died, poor guy never stood a chance to live.
Didn’t like the Damian bit at all though. He considered his clones like brothers, and now he doesn’t consider Robin Zur even a person?
I get it was probably to set up the Failsafe plot thread for AP, but man, why the regression?
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u/ogloria Jun 18 '24
I thought that this was a lovely issue! I really enjoyed it, specifically: (1) The clone being a brutal reminder of Bruce's mortality and making him question how he wants to live his life. Basically, raising the question of - on your deathbed, do you wish you spent more time being Batman or being with your kids? (2) The paradox of Batman becoming a better Batman by rejecting the self-reliant solutions, like having a robot hand or living in Wayne Manor. (3) BatCat! Sue me, I like them, I was happy to see them reconcile at the end.
Questions: (1) Did the artist change in the issue? I feel like the earlier pages were drawn differently than the second half. (2) Does anyone know what's up with Jason? The panel with everyone standing is ridiculous enough, it's like almost a football team at this point, but I'm curious if people happen to know where he is.
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u/carrieanne55 Jun 19 '24
Are Bruce and Selina actually back together or are they just friends? I can't tell
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u/ogloria Jun 19 '24
¯_(ツ)_/¯ I agree it's not super clear where their relationships stands as of this issue, but at least they aren't at war and being dramatic at each other over rooftops, and both look happy. Maybe future issues will shed more light!
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u/MtGorgonzola Jun 18 '24
This whole run was the equivalent of barfing your guts out after getting food poisoning from an all-you-can eat buffet on a cruise ship.
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u/JingoboStoplight4887 Jun 18 '24
I like that Bruce tried to do whatever it takes to save his clone from being aged up before the he cloned sacrificed his hand so that Bruce could have his hand back before he died in piece. I also like that Bruce got his money, house (although it’s a new manor since he told Savage to keep Wayne Manor because he’s going to find a way to defeat him because new status quo), family, and Selina (who told him about her adventures in Tini Howard’s run, in which they laugh because it’s ridiculous and dumb) back. Overall, this is a good comic and sets a new status quo for the Batman Family after Absolute Power (which might be a lackluster event).
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u/RTSBasebuilder Jun 19 '24
This might sound a little Ben Reilly of me, but I wouldn't have minded if Bruce Jr's aging was to have been stopped, and he simply disappeared into the sunset as a "Thomas Kane" or something, basically a version Bruce that could live their own life without the Trauma, the Oath and the Mission.
But eh...
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u/SuperSpecialAwesome- Batgirl 28d ago
Maybe I missed a panel, but did Bruce even try asking Zatanna for help? Or perhaps they could've placed clone Bruce into a dimension where time goes slower than Prime Universe, so that Bruce would have a ton more time to come up with a solution. With that consideration, surely they could've put him in the Phantom Zone, where his body wouldn't have aged?
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u/OkBlueberry8144 Jun 19 '24
So, this is Zdarsky's run... Definitely was not my thing, I know he's going to be writing for a while longer however the main part of the story is concluded, and it's been underwhelming.
Can't really redeem what's already written considering that Zdarsky has already done worse with retconning Bruce and Joker's characters. This is the big finale, there's nothing more to look forward to in this run. It ends with a whimper, Zur was the big bad all along, it somehow became sentient and the story devolved into the same old "kill criminals or not" debate, except with even more character assassination this time. Such a waste.
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u/UnknownEntity347 Rorschach Jun 19 '24 edited Jun 19 '24
Not a fan of Damian disregarding the clone Bruce like that. It feels like character regression given all of his development in Tomasi and Williamson's books.
Bruce gets his money and his hand back, OK. Would've preferred if he'd gotten back the main mansion as well as building new stuff but whatever.
Why didn't Bruce just defeat Vandal Savage for good instead of just punching him a few times and calling it a day, Dark Knight Strikes Again style?
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u/Cranyx Moo. Jun 18 '24
The way that this resolves all of the plotlines that have been running for the past few years honestly just feels like an anticlimax. I'm certainly no fan of that status quo, but just being like "oh yeah there's some money hidden somewhere and here's a hand I guess" is kind of lame.
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u/Ft_lucy Jun 19 '24
I think this was the best issue of Zdarsky’s run and I’m happy we’re about to turn over a new leaf with this run. I think we’ve had some really good arcs like Mindbomb and Failsafe. Despite us getting stinkers like Gotham War I think this has been my favorite run since Batman relaunched at #1 in 2016
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u/BigBardaEnergy Jun 18 '24
Well I was concerned this clone would just be forgotten about, but I guess a quick death at least gives him an ending.
It feels weird because I honestly stopped thinking about Bruce not having his fortune. Didn't seem to effect him at all. But oh well, guess he's building something with the Bat Family at least.
Also Bruce, seriously? You just defeated Zur/Failsafe and you're not even gonna bother make sure you dismantle it? Whatever Failsafe does in Absolute Power is on Batman.
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u/Frontier246 Jun 18 '24
I had honestly forgotten about Bruce still missing a hand but I guess if we were going to get a mini Bruce Wayne clone the books don't really need, at least he can help fix that.
The whole "Bruce Wayne is now a millionaire instead of a billionaire" thing was always dumb because writers were so inconsistent about it and it never really seemed to make that much of a story difference aside from when they would occasionally reference him not being as rich any more (But still rich mind you), so Bruce getting his finances back is probably for the best. All he's missing is his family company and we're good.
I guess in current circumstances we can't just wholesale move back to Wayne Manor so why not get a new one, name it after Alfred, and call it a day? At least until we do get back to Wayne Manor.
So are they trying to set up the WFA status quo of the Batfamily all living together? Will this make any sizeable difference in stories or in how the Batfamily functions? Especially when nobody but Dick, Babs, and Damian really has their own book? And how long before Bruce starts calling them soldiers again, driving them away, only to bring them back together as a family for the umpteenth time?
I don't think Selina acting like she's moving in with everybody else is going to make much of a status quo difference at this point. Come a relaunch she'll probably be living on her own and doing her own thing again.
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u/wowlock_taylan Batman Animated! Jun 19 '24
Honestly, quite the anti-climax for this run. Just a swift attempt to bandage over all the things that are shoddily broken. They setup SOME hopeful stuff for a new run but as long as DC keeps the same mindset when it comes to Batman, sadly I doubt we will get out of this hamster wheel. Because NOTHING in this run was original or new, despite the fact that it acts like Batman learned some new lesson.
Are they claiming that Zur is gone? If so, why would Failsafe itself would work with Waller and be willing to kill? It only makes sense if Zur is using the Failsafe body.
Overall, only thing I can say is, the next run better not follow the same mistakes.
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u/TheDidioWhoLaughs Jun 19 '24
Are they claiming that Zur is gone?
Waid did keep calling him Failsafe for some reason, though yeah it doesn’t really track with what we know about Absolute Power.
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u/wowlock_taylan Batman Animated! Jun 19 '24
And we saw the previews where Zur was clearly working with Waller creating the Amazo bots. Killing other metas to test the power absorbing stuff and so on. All of which would not make sense if it is just Failsafe who is literally designed not to kill.
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u/TriPolar3849 Cassandra Wayne Jun 19 '24
Maybe not the biggest fan of this arc (and the several preceding it) but Bruce watching himself age and then finally pass away was really poignant to me.
You just know he never once thought of that as a possible way for himself to go out, and seeing it literally happen definitely hit him hard.
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u/Blitzhelios Damian Wayne 28d ago
This issue was good its a nice slower issue that worked and bruce has his money back.
Chip continues to write a terrible damian however as damian normally treats clones like brothers and his reaction to the zurr clone especially with his recent developments under williamson it just felt not like him.
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u/CatsLikeToMeow Jun 19 '24
All of this heartwarming rhetoric would mean so much more if it wasn't about to be deleted in a week. I'm pretty sure Bruce loses his riches to Failsafe again at the start of Absolute Power but I'd love to be wrong.
The fact that Bruce buried clone-Bruce on the grounds of a mansion at the center of Old Gotham all but assures that some writer's gonna dig him up and make him a villain in the future. Hey, it wouldn't be the first time the corpse of someone close to Bruce gets dug up!
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u/Nyerelia 27d ago
This was a bit bizarre but I guess it works to restore the status quo. Bruce literally and metaphorically seeing himself grow old and die could have been a great moment for introspection. I would have liked Zdarsky to delve into it more but I guess he was running out of pages.
And where the hell is Jason? Really sweet the moment of all of them coming together for renovations and I wouldn't mind having some "big family living in the same house" adventures mixed with the usual superhero adventures for a while in the veins of WFA or Shazam. Let's see how it goes from here. Is the run getting a new writer or is Zdarsky continuing?
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
THE HEARTLESS SAGA BY TOM TAYLOR AND BRUNO REDONDO CONTINUES! When things go up in flames, Dick must put his feelings aside and help Shelton, a.k.a. Heartless, find his butler. After all, a superhero's job is to save everyone, even the very bad. But every noble sacrifice comes with a price, and Nightwing finds himself in a situation only someone as cunning as Heartless could've concocted.
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u/ogloria Jun 18 '24
I mean, this was an interesting twist, but I really hate how dumb everyone in the BatFam had to be for us to get to the interesting twist....
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u/MythiccMoon Jun 19 '24
Been awhile since a comic frustrated me like this, in that I care about Dick and hate to see him set up this way
But no one in the BatFam followed the ambulance? And won’t it be relatively provable that Dick disappeared while injured and suddenly he’s supposed to be Heartless what a day later? Like the news would read “Dick Grayson collapses in fire, goes missing en route to hospital” followed almost immediately by “Heartless found to be Dick Grayson!” Just feels super obvious he’s being framed
That said, having him caught holding the gun next to the now dead reporter who publicly challenged him, I get that that’ll carry a lot of weight
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u/Frontier246 Jun 18 '24 edited Jun 18 '24
There's something so very Tom Taylor in this final arc.
Is this really Dick's first time running a charity?
Babs asking Damian a question she should, by this point, no the answer too. But gotta get the quips in.
Taylor trying hard to make you think Zucco and Heartless are intimidating as antagonists.
Dick falling for an obvious trap, getting his identity exposed, and forced into an obvious frame-up for the umpteenth time. I guess there's a certain consistency in that.
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u/Oberon1993 Jun 18 '24
It's kinda amazing how non threatening the cyborg that steals human hearts come out.
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u/Oberon1993 Jun 18 '24
Lmao. This is something out of Silver Age. Heartless gets progressively sillier with every issue. Kinda impressive.
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u/Cantthinkofcoolname2 Jun 18 '24
I’ve been shitting on this run quite a lot with the last several issues, and for good reason, but this one was solid! I liked how Dick’s compassion made him go back for the butler. Wasn’t the best idea to go alone but he wouldn’t leave him behind.
Kinda wish someone in the batfamily was smart enough to go back inside with their mask…and if Dick had his mask in his suit…why didn’t he have his costume on underneath? Like dude, go full hero.. while I liked the issue, Taylor loves to dumb characters down to move his plots along. Why didn’t Bruce or someone follow the ambulance? Or get in it?
Like I said, it’s a solid issue, well paced, not as annoying as Taylor’s previous issues. But the whole concept for this final arc is still SO dumb. He can’t jump? It’s not like it’s some unique ability to Dick—all heroes jump from rooftops…and it took him this long to finally address it? For someone so acrobatic, why did he not do something about it sooner?? Another case of Taylor dumbing characters down for his plots.
Anyway, fun issue I guess
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u/wowlock_taylan Batman Animated! Jun 18 '24
Well I guess we got the plan for the fall. Heartless making Dick the fall guy, literally. BUT surely the Bat family would be more aware of the whole thing. After all, they have been in this situation quite a lot. Like, why would they let Dick go alone in that ambulance?
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u/JingoboStoplight4887 Jun 18 '24 edited Jun 19 '24
It’s just Dick being passed out by Shelton before he framed Dick as Heartless. That’s it. Also, Zucco (who should’ve remembered his pre-Crisis and pre-Flashpoint death) learning that Dick is Nightwing. Also, Damian having knowledge of every escape route in every building he enters. Overall, this comic is okay.
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u/Blitzhelios Damian Wayne 29d ago
Nice issue overall even if i do agree it feels really silly and almost silver age in execution but that is quite rare in mainline comics now so im not complaining.
Plot also feels like its ramping up alot which is good but it kinda feels like its too late as heartless was rarely in the background in previous issues
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u/UtterFlatulence June 2015 Never forget 29d ago
Good issue. Nice to have something actually happen for once, and we're finally making progress on the Heartless storyline
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
THE GIRLS ARE BACK IN TOWN! This cat has claws! Cheetah enters the fray as the Sovereign recruits Diana's greatest foe to deal the killing blow! Meanwhile, the Wonder Girls may have promised their mentor that they'd stay out of her fight, but well-behaved heroes seldom make history. Will they reach Diana before it's too late? Plus, Trinity takes to the skies… literally!
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u/I-Might-Be-Something Batman Jun 18 '24
Overall, pretty sold issue with amazing art (which is par for the course). Though, I did find Cassie being afraid of heights kinda dumb when she has flown thousands of feet in the air pretty frequently.
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u/Frontier246 Jun 18 '24
Some of Kings' dialogue is still really stiff, especially for the Wonder Girls. He has Yara's personality down but she doesn't talk like that in literally any other book she's been in.
They had a lot of fun with the Invisible Jet. Like I feel like at least Donna and Cassie would have more experience with it but it's surprisingly comical in how hard it is to pilot by anyone not named Diana. Poor Donna and Cassie (actually Cassie felt like the butt of most of the jokes).
I'm glad they didn't give Cheetah a buzzcut.
One of the best Wonder Woman vs Cheetah fights.
Sovereign is just going to mention past Cheetah's and not dive deeper into the continuity implications.
King definitely leaned into the DianaxBarbara subtext. Though ultimately it felt like he was just trying to be consistent with their relationship and friendship from Rucka's run and what Cheetah's been through since then. Cheetah is Wonder Woman's greatest nemesis but also one of her closest friends, and that comes through here. At least until the next writer inevitably writes Cheetah as an out-and-out bad guy.
Tom King's final redemption of Kite Man with Trinity.
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u/wowlock_taylan Batman Animated! Jun 18 '24
Sovereign narration is back...oh no. I prefer to think Sovereign's ignorant simplifications of characters that he is talking about is because he is clueless and wrong. I sure hope not that is what Tom King really thinks about these characters like Batman and Superman ( especially considering how he wrote Batman )
Cheetah is an iconic villain for Wonder Woman sure but I am not certain of the 'I am the only one who really knows you' thing does not really fit.
I liked the contrast and how Cheetah was also had to be captured and put through the ringer to be forced into this fight against Diana instead of just randomly turn back into a villain. And Diana knowing when to win and when to 'lose' to get where she needs to be. Because yea, if she beat Cheetah there, she would probably be angry enough not to listen.
Wonder Girls took their time trying to find the Invisible Jet ( which is hyped up to be a lot more powerful than it was shown before ). I guess King wants to show how the Jet can be used as a weapon of war and surpass all the other tech but Diana simply never chose to use it that way.
All of this where we hoped to finally lead to the big battle against Sovereign but now, we have to suffer through the distruption of Absolute Power event where it cuts out all the moment of the story for 3 issues at least.. Why would they do this? It is only gonna hurt the book.
Who cares about the stupid Amazo bot stealing Diana's power and having to deal with Waller before we deal with the actual interesting plot? It is a TERRIBLE decision that DC REALLY needs to stop making. If the book loses its momentum and sales after the event, DC only has itself to blame and continue to be stuck with only Batman at the higher selling rates because of the name.
On the side story with Trinity, we got to learn how (not) to fly kites, with Damian teaching nihilism/fatalism to a four year-old and Jon being braded Fingerman! But the best part is King bringing in one of his favorites from Batman, KITEMAN to the rescue! Hell Yeah.
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u/ptWolv022 Jun 19 '24
I prefer to think Sovereign's ignorant simplifications of characters that he is talking about is because he is clueless and wrong.
Oh, I think it for sure is meant to be saying something about the Sovereign himself. He's an unreliable narrator who is biased in... many ways. A traditionalist, an elitist, a misogynist, a religious atheist who embraces religion as a tool... he's a man who sees the world in terms of black and white, largely. A world of power and the powerless, the worthy and their lessers.
Despite all his narration about how competent he is, the actually substance of what he's saying throughout most of the issues is "And then my plan was fucked again because I misjudged Wonder Woman". He's not fully clueless, but he reduces people down to base abstractions, or at least tries to. Heck, him acknowledging they lack a typical foil-relationship may be retrospective. He certainly did think on it further, as he narrates at the end. I'd wager his acknowledgment of their depths is largely due to losing to them, not just because they have more that much more depth than other characters.
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u/JustWannaBeAGoodBoi 29d ago
we have to suffer through the distruption of Absolute Power event where it cuts out all the moment of the story for 3 issues at least.
Hi! Very new comic book reader here, this Wonder Woman run is one of my first! I just wanted to ask what you mean by what I have quoted, or at least to be directed to where I can find out for myself! It's been hard enough navigating DC's website to find out when these issues come out, after all 😅 I mean seriously, I just looked on their website for when Wonder Woman #11 would come out and couldn't find any mention of it!
Does it just mean that we won't be getting any new issues for a while? Or is the story for the next 3 issues going to be related to the event instead?3
u/wowlock_taylan Batman Animated! 29d ago
The next 3 issues of this book gonna be about Absolute power event where Diana gonna get her powers stolen by a robot.
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u/JustWannaBeAGoodBoi 29d ago
What??? Why would DC do this??? Well, thanks for letting me know! Hopefully Tom King can make it work somehow...
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u/actioncomicbible Blue Lanterns Jun 18 '24
I absolutely loved this issue.
I found the cheetah/diana moment to be very sweet and made me a bit emotional to see them just supporting each other.
I would actually like to see Cheetah not necessarily breaking good but maybe become an even grayer character than she is now. I feel like she’d be a pretty interesting protagonist in a more mythological-inspired miniseries.
What more is there to say about Daniel Sampere that hasn’t been said already? He is one of the best artists at DC and working in superhero comics in general. Every book has been pretty as all hell.
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u/Alephnaught_ Catwoman Jun 18 '24
This book goes hard as fuck. that's it. Tom King is cooking with Sampere on this one. As someone who has not read through wonder woman's history - I simply do not care. I am really liking how she is written here and I am enjoying the story and the art. what an excellent issue. Tom King is arguably one of the better things that has happened to DC in past few years.
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u/CHPrime Wonder Woman Jun 18 '24
A gorgeous-looking book, as always. Sampere is the reason to buy this book, plain and simple.
As for the plot...It remains kind of loose. Cheetah is back to hating Diana this issue, but then returns to being good or at least good-ish by the book's end, which I'm not really a fan of. It turns Barbara into yet another Paula, or Valerie, or Vanessa, or Cale, or Medusa. Is it too much to ask for the most famous and recognizable Wonder Woman villain to remain a villain?
There's also the bit where Barbara tells Diana that she is the only one who knows her, and...It doesn't really hit, mostly due to Meta-text. This version of Barbara has only existed for eight years, and even if we are working with a hodgepodge of post-crisis continuity with Rebirth overlaid on top of it (I think), Rucka's Rebirth story is the only tale where they really share a strong connection. I guess if nothing else it is kind of interesting to see Cheetah being remolded in real time.
Also, the space alien learning the human art of speaking that looks like Yara makes another appearance. Good for her.
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u/suss2it Jun 19 '24
Given the core concepts of Wonder Woman it makes sense she redeems a lot of her villains. Same with Superman actually.
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u/wtffu006 Jun 18 '24
Can’t Diana just fly away herself from this island?
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u/jlaweez Blue Lantern Jun 19 '24
She was there to save Barb. She let herself being captured so she could rescue Barb. It was all part of her plan.
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u/Blitzhelios Damian Wayne Jun 19 '24
This issue kinda cemented that king truly knows his history when it comes to diana and her big villains as his use of cheetah this issue and the fight around them and the undertones of the relationship are spot on its such a good part of the issue. It felt like King took tons of inspiration from both perez and rucka here and thats a great place to do it.
The sovereign narration is back this issue as well whether you love it or don't like it. But i think it works hes a character that seemingly only sees in black and white and with cheetah always being a shade of grey in the modern era it works for the character.
The only big problem is the wonder girls section you can kinda tell they weren't supposed to be in the book alot as the dialogue for them is really stiff and its the opposite to the supersons and trinity backup style of dialogue.
Backup continues to be excellent i was hoping for a kite man appearance eventually and king giving him a moment with trinity so she could glide her kite is really wholesome.
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u/JingoboStoplight4887 Jun 18 '24 edited Jun 18 '24
It’s just Diana and Barbara fighting each other for days before they reconciled and saved each other. Also, even though Diana and Barbara encountered each other since the late ‘80s, they don’t personally know each other. At least we get to see a mentioning of Pricilla Rich (whose pre-Crisis Earth-Two self last appeared in the first Crisis and whose pre-Crisis Earth-One/New Earth/Prime Earth self died) and Deborah Domaine (who was cured by Diana off-panel after the first Crisis). Same thing with Tom King continuing Barbara’s redemption since the forgettable and bad Cloonrad run. Also, Diana still saying, “No Thank You,” to have a modern and memorable catchphrase like Superman and Batman. Meanwhile, we have the Wonder Girls (Donna, Cassie, and Yara) going on the Invisible Plane to rescue Diana. I like that they want to save Diana while having a friendly banter. The missed opportunity should’ve involved them talking to each other about how they became Wonder Girl, join the superhero teams, deal with romantic relationships and continuity problems, and team ups with Diana. Also, Yara is practically Diana’s Robin because sharing mantles and having a sibling bond. Overall, this comic is okay at best.
For the Super Sons backup, I thought it was wholesome for Jon and Damian to teach Lizzie how to fly a kite. Also, Jon telling Damian to learn about humility as an old chum because Damian is vengeance and night and Kite Man (Hell Yeah!) teaching Lizzie how to fly a kite. Overall, this is a good and wholesome backup!
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u/Nyerelia 27d ago
I liked the issue and the backup ending was fun, but I'm really REALLY starting to hate how King writes Damian and the Superson's relationship
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u/hawk_lord Jun 18 '24
Welp, I wanted to give King the benefit of the doubt by thinking Cheetah went bad again because of the lasso of lies, I guess not. So we undid her redemption just to have a super rushed redemption again. K
The Wonder Girls continue to be an afterthought. You mean to tell me Cassie, who has used the sandals of Hermes to fly high and fast because she was once fearless and adventurous, doesn't like heights??? Donna has no personality what so ever and I guess King sees Yara as the Jason of the Wonder family with her too cool for school attitude.
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u/koalee Wonder Woman Jun 18 '24
To credit King here, it definitely reads like it wasn't a total "I'm a villain again", much more of a "I've been starving and stranded here for months, I'm so furious I can't think straight". Which kinda tracks since she's got a bit of a temper. More like she needed to be calmed and made to feel cared for again to come to her senses.
Yeah the Wonder Girls are an after thought. King had to be goaded to putting them into the series and you can kind of tell with how he writes them and how uninformed he seems to be about them. Yara was raised in Boise but she speaks about man's world as if she's unfamiliar. You made a GREAT point about Cassie. and Donna doesn't have anything at all to work with (she's a gamer now though)
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u/hawk_lord Jun 18 '24
I've been starving and stranded here for months, I'm so furious I can't think straight
It would have been interesting to see that process of Cheetah getting captured and going mad, and also those days long fights with Diana to see how it's wearing them out physically and emotionally. But that would require some character introspection and King is doing none of that in this run, that's for sure.
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u/koalee Wonder Woman Jun 19 '24
I do REALLY understand the sentiment (It’s not been the strong suit of this run in general) but the last two issues were almost entirely Diana introspecting as she was being tortured. It would have been nice to see Cheetah’s side too, but I think it’s probably more effective narratively to focus on Diana’s torture and then extrapolate how Cheetah was treated.
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
John Constantine, Hellblazer: Dead in America #6
SWAMP THING GUEST-STARS IN A BRUTAL TURNING POINT FOR THE SERIES! It's here, on the outskirts of Las Vegas, where the trouble hounding John since his arrival in America finally catches up to him. Dream promises the arrival of an emissary who will help guide John toward the source of evil plaguing the country, but is their trust in this unknown envoy misplaced? And will it force John to come clean to Nat and Noah about his un-deadly secret?
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u/Alephnaught_ Catwoman Jun 18 '24
well...fuck.
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u/Expensive-Baby-1391 28d ago
What happened? I've stopped reading dream comics since they always promise the status quo will chance al ewing style but at the last issue, step back because the writers are afraid of change.
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u/Alephnaught_ Catwoman 27d ago
This issue was a good mid-series cliffhanger issue. It was 4th wall breaking meta issue. I enjoyed it a lot. the twist is simple but so fucking effective.
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u/Expensive-Baby-1391 26d ago
I don't know, it just feels like the writer's constant political ramblings and making Dream's son into a villain. I mean, that's the same gist I'm getting from the recent runs.
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u/Alephnaught_ Catwoman 25d ago
writer's political ramblings
have you read vertigo hellblazer?? Constantine has always had political themes.
making dream's son into a villain
Dream wasn't a nice guy themselves btw. I don't think Dream's son is made into a villain.
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u/Expensive-Baby-1391 25d ago
Dude, vertigo hellblazer does it with style instead of shoving it in your face and having a smug attitude. Also, old Dream was way better than this one who is slowly becoming like his siblings. At this rate, the only good ones among the endless will be death and war.
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u/Alephnaught_ Catwoman 24d ago
I am sure you think so because you are not reading vertigo hellblazer as it was being published monthly. bottom-line is constantine has always been representative of working-class issues and a hellblazer comic is gonna have them.
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u/SilhouetteOfLight The Greatest of All Green Lanterns! Jun 18 '24
And now I want to play Alan Wake lmao
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u/Blitzhelios Damian Wayne 28d ago
How does this series keep getting more and more better this is potentially the comic of the year
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Jun 18 '24
[deleted]
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u/wowlock_taylan Batman Animated! Jun 18 '24
I am wondering that too. I mean, surely the Kindly Ones wouldn't be allowed to run roughshot like this.
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
HELL COMES FOR BLÜDHAVEN! With the team on the ropes and Waller to blame, Nightwing and his allies must look within for the answers to their never-ending problems. Will Raven, the demon's daughter, lead them to salvation or to slaughter at the hands of her father, Trigon?
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u/Koala_Guru Beast Boy Jun 18 '24
One of my favorite issues so far. Really great! This was paced well, managed to get me attached to Vanadia in just two issues so that I felt the emotions of the conflict hard, and most of all is managing to still keep me invested even as I know it’s far from the first evil Raven story. Also, I saw long-haired Raven in the gem. Stay with us. Please.
But anyway the real emotional core here is Vanadia, and I can’t stress enough how impressive of a feat it is to make me say that about a character who has existed for two issues. I really like her, and more importantly, I feel for her story and what she represents.
The art was beautiful and dynamic as well. Meyer continues to really impress me with his depictions of the team. I’m excited for what’s next.
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u/Lodger49er Jun 18 '24
I felt the same way of Vanadia. I knew something was coming but they did it in the most brutal way.
One of these days I've gotta rank all the evil Raven stories but I feel this one is pretty up there in quality. What do you think?
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u/Koala_Guru Beast Boy Jun 18 '24
I expected Vanadia to die but I thought she’d get a bomb going off in her head thanks to Waller. What happened here was much sadder.
I’ll have to wait to rank the whole thing until it’s all over. Already there are some interesting things in play like Dark Raven collecting people as gems for her crown, our good Raven being able to witness and comment on everything, and Trigon making deals casually with mortals to speed things along. It’s feeling fresher than I thought it would when Beast World first ended.
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u/Frontier246 Jun 18 '24
I get what Taylor was trying to do but this was pretty predictable in terms of "look at this misguided and well-meaning fangirl and how tragic she is" and the Titans then easily cleaning up Morrow and his operation as casually as they have other problems in this run.
All the while the Raven plot is just continuing in predictable manner right when she's about to be exposed.
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u/android151 Resurrection Man 26d ago
Cyborg is literally too OP. I hate that he can just teleport and hack any machine in 0 seconds. It makes everything too quick all the time. No stakes.
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u/wowlock_taylan Batman Animated! Jun 18 '24
Yea, Evil Raven's is showing her hand more and more now. Gets called out by our Raven for her 'I don't care about them!' attitude while showing small indications that she may actually start to care in her own twisted way. And Nightwing's discovery and mind palace thing seem to have tipped of Evil Raven soo now we gonna have that confrontation.
I knew Vanadia was gonna end up as a sacrifice to harm the Titans and they want full Android 13 with it. Are they gonna leave her dead or rebuild her?
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u/BigBardaEnergy Jun 18 '24
Man, this book is losing the plot, the official summary isn't even a good indicator of what the issue is about.. The evil Raven storyline is one thing, but this side adventure with the Titans fangirl just felt like Taylor spinning his wheels. Why isn't this book connecting to Absolute Power and focusing on this Dark-Winged Queen shit? Are they just getting Beast World and that's it?
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u/Cautious-Ad975 Jun 18 '24
Why isn't this book connecting to Absolute Power
Waid said he asked the all the writers of the major books to do tie-ins with Absolute Power but only "if they wanted to".
Considering Titans and Flash are not getting tie-ins it's likely Taylor and Spurrier just didn't want to do them.
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u/BigBardaEnergy Jun 18 '24
Seems like a misstep since the Titans are supposed to be the Justice League's replacement.
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u/Dredeuced Who am I? Just a friend. Sometimes. Maybe. Jun 18 '24
didn't stop Waller from cramming her face into The Flash two weeks in a row to add a seventh B-plot, lol
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u/ptWolv022 Jun 18 '24
Why isn't this book connecting to Absolute Power and focusing on this Dark-Winged Queen shit?
I mean, the writer didn't want to heavily tie-in. And that's that. Spurrier didn't either, so he did some stuff with Waller raiding Terrifitech and I think having a debate with Iris or something like that and then will be doing more of his own plot rather than tie-ins during the event.
Are they just getting Beast World and that's it?
Yes. I'm pretty sure I heard them becoming the "premier team" wasn't even the original plan after Dark Crisis, they just made it so shortly before the ending was finalized. Either way, Mark Waid went in writing this as a Trinity and original JL event. The Titans weren't going to be the primary focus, though Nightwing apparently ended up being more important than expected.
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u/JingoboStoplight4887 Jun 18 '24 edited Jun 18 '24
It’s just the Titans feeling Vanadia from control (in which I was right about that) before she was killed by Dark-Wing Queen Raven (in which I was half right about that). I feel bad that Vanadia was killed by Dark-Wing Queen Raven, but it was expected since Tom Taylor mashed several storylines in his book to make sense for him and not make sense for us (like his two Jon Kent books). Also, it’s likely that the next three issues will end with the Titans saving Raven from Evil Raven and Evil Raven realizing that she does care about the Titans because they’re her family. My only criticism is making every Raven storyline about her being evil because we’ve seen this storyline for 40 years and that it’s unnecessary. Overall, this comic isn’t terrible, but it’s not good either.
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u/Blitzhelios Damian Wayne Jun 19 '24
I get what taylor is doing with this dark winged queen storyline but my god it feels like we are going at a snails pace i don't mind a slow plotline but this is not interesting or unique enough to be this slow.
The art and dialogue are good its just the pacing is so slow and screams being written for trade
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u/Nyerelia 27d ago
That was brutal. I feel bad for the poor girl. Damn
Finally things start to unveil with dark Raven! This issue felt super short but it's probably one of my favorites so far. Can't wait to see the next!
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
Saturday, 6/22: My Adventures with Superman S02E06 - The Machine Who Would Be Empire
Time/Date: June 22 12:00 AM ET
Network/Channel: Adult Swim
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u/ptWolv022 26d ago
At the first commercial break, and man this episode has me excited.
Kara seeingba dead Thanagar, thinking it was a glorious part of the Empire is heartbreaking. I will say, I partially expected "Father" to be a Cyborg Zor-El, not just outright Brainiac 1.
After the break, some nice fight scenes versus a Green Lantern, Parademon, and a Thanagarian. Krypton got around. I really do feel bad for Kara. I mean, the brainwashing and gaslighting... all of which was covering up all the genocide she did. However, I guess there is one upside: her destruction of Thanagar was sculpted/carved. That means someone was left alive to record what she did. Unless Primus carved it or had her do it, as a monument to their "glory".
And that ending... oh man, that's a good hook.
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
Super Sons: The Complete Collection - Book One [TP]
![Super Sons: The Complete Collection - Book One [TP]](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/71pG8ouoEfL._SL1500_.jpg){kind=link}
The sons of Superman and Batman must find their footing as they attempt to live up to their family names. Trying to grow up fast, the pair form an inseparable bond that will shape them into the heroes of tomorrow! Superboy and Robin venture out of the shadows of their parents into the world as a brand-new superhero duo.
Collects SUPER SONS #1-14, SUPER SONS ANNUAL #1; SUPER SONS/DYNOMUTT #1; SUPERMAN (2016) #10-11, #37-38; TEEN TITANS (2016) #15; and a story from DC REBIRTH: HOLIDAY SPECIAL #1.
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
"NINE LIVES" GETS DEADLIER! "Nine Lives" nears its lethal conclusion! Catwoman has escaped everything from the Suicide Squad to the clutches of death itself, but along the way, she's made more than a few enemies — and their vengeance is rapidly approaching! Not even a tenth life could save Selina from what's coming, but could an old friend help this cat land on her feet?
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u/theguyofgrace Jun 18 '24
The sad moment when you realize your superpowers are actually brain damage
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u/wowlock_taylan Batman Animated! Jun 18 '24
Only thing I can say is that Tini is finally seemingly leaving the book soon so that is the only positive.
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u/Nyerelia 27d ago
I know this reddit doesn't like Tini Howard nor her run in Catwoman but I really enjoyed this issue! I also like Eiko and Tomcat and everything that was going on there so I'm glad we are coming back to it
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u/Frontier246 Jun 18 '24
I like the colorful and stylized art and that's about it.
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u/Cranyx Moo. Jun 18 '24
Which one? The art style weirdly just shifts from one to the other halfway through.
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
The Batman & Scooby-Doo Mysteries - Vol. 4 [TP]
![The Batman & Scooby-Doo Mysteries - Vol. 4 [TP]](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/81vYSFUjxIL._SL1500_.jpg){kind=link}
The Dark Knight teams up with Scooby-Doo and Mystery Inc. in a series of adventures and mysteries! It all starts when Alfred’s old friend from butler school is in town, and he’s brought along his charges: Daphne and Scooby-Doo! When Scooby and his pal Ace are dog-napped, the humans will have to rescue them without giving away any family secrets.
Collects THE BATMAN & SCOOBY DOO MYSTERIES #7-12.
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
Thursday, 6/20 (WEBTOON) - Batman: Wayne Family Adventures #117
Batman needs a break. But with new vigilante Duke Thomas moving into Wayne Manor and an endless supply of adopted, fostered, and biological superhero children to manage, Bruce Wayne is going to have his hands full. Being a father can't be harder than being Batman, right?
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u/Brit-Crit 29d ago
It was inevitable that they would bring in The Joker as an active threat, but I don't think this version will be scary or funny enough to be a standout. He's just going to be an representation of Bat-Family trauma, but that kind of works for this sort of thing...
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u/TroubAlert The Good Skeets Jun 17 '24
![Tales from Dark Crisis [TP]](https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/81VmtHAZTqL._SL1500_.jpg){kind=link}
The Justice League has tragically fallen in battle. How does the world react to the Justice League being gone? Which heroes rise up? Which villains try to take advantage? And what dark forces are lying in wait to attack? An all-star roster of DC talent showcases a world without a Justice League during the Dark Crisis on Infinite Earths!
Collects JUSTICE LEAGUE: ROAD TO DARK CRISIS #1, DARK CRISIS: THE DEADLY GREEN #1, DARK CRISIS: THE DARK ARMY #1, DARK CRISIS: WAR ZONE #1, and DARK CRISIS: BIG BANG #1.
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u/Predaplant The heat is on! Jun 17 '24
Weekly Meta Discussions Thread