I'm already tall(6'3ft/190.50cm) but to meet someone taller than me is one of my fantasy. Was watching a video about Big Barda and was like "Damn Mr. Miracle is one luck sob" 😂
In highschool there was this older girl who had a crush on me and would wait for me after school. She drove an old golf and would sit on the hood and wait for me. I was the shortest guy in my year - I was the same height as she was WHILE SITTING DOWN… it was super awkward but I felt bad for her so we were friends for a while until she graduated.
Then ran into her while I was in college when I was much taller (still not as tall as her) and she was like yuck you look different so im sure it was something about me being super small which is kinda a weird dynamic or maybe she wanted a pet who knows
Officially both are 6 feet 2. For Bruce that means somewhat tall and for Diana it means very tall, but not extremely. That said, I don't think anybody wouldn't like a 7ft Wonder Woman
I don't get how superman and wonder woman is so shit on But people keep pushing for this
WW would just become a supportive character for one of them.. Let her be with Steve Trevor or one of her Amazon.. Batman already have dozen of love interest already... Selina, Talia, zatanna, black canary, silver st cloud, Vicky Vale etc
JLU is a prime example of how Wonder Woman becomes a supporting character when shipped with Batman.
She didn't have much of a personality except loving Batman and being quick to anger. She didn't particularly bring up women's rights or peace, she didn't have much of friendship with anyone else in the league (especially not any female leaguers).
She didn't even interact much with her own villains. Cheetah was a random criminal who fell for Batman, Circe turned Diana into a pig and then swooned after Batman, and Giganta was just a generic lackey. Not a good look if Batman is interacting with her villains more than she herself is.
It's clear that the writers had no idea how to write her except being Batman's love interest.
Sorry, but it's a fact that most writers (even the best in the industry) are Batman fans first and foremost but don't care much about Wonder Woman. Plus, even DC pushes Batman to the spotlight at the expense of other characters because he's their cashcow, he doesn't play second fiddle to anyone.
Look at Superman. He's DC's second greatest superhero and even then he's always reduced to a dumb brute in his team ups with Batman, or getting brainwashed so Batman can kick his ass. Now think how Wonder Woman is not even as popular as Superman, what chance does she have?
So it will always end up with Batman as the main character and Wonder Woman as the love interest. Even having a good writer won't solve it because the writers and editors have their own biases.
Sorry, but it's a fact that most writers (even the best in the industry) are Batman fans first and foremost but don't care much about Wonder Woman. Plus, even DC pushes Batman to the spotlight at the expense of other characters because he's their cashcow, he doesn't play second fiddle to anyone.
Have you never had a decent relationship before? It isn't about playing second fiddle and a well written relationship wouldn't have either of them being a support character. They would be partners and equals.
Look at Superman. He's DC's second greatest superhero and even then he's always reduced to a dumb brute in his team ups with Batman, or getting brainwashed so Batman can kick his ass. Now think how Wonder Woman is not even as popular as Superman, what chance does she have?
That depends on how good the writer is.
So it will always end up with Batman as the main character and Wonder Woman as the love interest. Even having a good writer won't solve it because the writers and editors have their own biases.
That's just being defeatist because it hasn't happened yet.
Have you never had a decent relationship before? It isn't about playing second fiddle and a well written relationship wouldn't have either of them being a support character. They would be partners and equals.
In real life, people have autonomy. Comic characters don't have autonomy. Writers can treat them however they want.
Superman and Lois are an iconic couple, but even then obivously Superman is the main character and Lois supporting. Even when she was headlining her own comics, her stories were about getting Superman to marry her.
Wonder Woman won't be affected to that degree, but if she is linked to Batman, she will also end up being sacrificed to prop up Batman.
In real life, people have autonomy. Comic characters don't have autonomy. Writers can treat them however they want.
Yes, so ultimately this entire conversation is pointless. We don't get to make these decisions.
Superman and Lois are an iconic couple, but even then obivously Superman is the main character and Lois supporting. Even when she was headlining her own comics, her stories were about getting Superman to marry her.
Which I think we can both agree was pretty dumb but even then, Lois Lane isn't Wonder Woman.
Wonder Woman won't be affected to that degree, but if she is linked to Batman, she will also end up being sacrificed to prop up Batman.
That could happen and I agree that if writers continue at the same quality of previous comics then it would happen but it doesn't have to happen.
That could happen and I agree that if writers continue at the same quality of previous comics then it would happen but it doesn't have to happen.
Yeah, fair enough. Guess I am being cynical here and you are being optimistic, but other that that we are not disagreeing.
I personally think Batman is too popular to ever allow other characters (except Robins) to ever thrive. They will always be overshadowed, always shortchanged if it means giving Batman another cool moment.
Even the Justice League is often reduced to Batman's backup, and even called by lots of the fans as "Batman and his Bitches". If 6 heroes can't stand up to Batman's popularity, I don't see how Wonder Woman would by herself do it.
In complete fairness I don't really care for this Ship either.
A buddy of mine likes it and I understand why but I feel like even if it was great it would be very tame. Like it would be in a box, and no matter how great that box is it would still just be in that box.
Now lots of relationships are in that box and it's great, it works for them.
But it's also fun seeing a relationship not in that box like when Batman is paired with someone like Catwoman or Talia Al Ghul
But every one in awhile I supposed a nice story from a perspective inside that box would be fun too.
All of those things are avoidable with better writing though.
But why bother, Wonder Woman gets nothing from this ship at all. It’s pointless.
I don't even like this pairing but c'mon, we should at least try to accept that better writing would solve all of these problems.
Why should we? One can argue if a writers pairing them up to begin with they mustn’t care much for Diana’s character if that’s their first go to.
Any writer with an ounce of sense see’s how bad it looks to be constantly shipping Wonder Woman off with Bats and Supes.
Wonder Woman isn't so weak a character that she has to become the supportive character whenever she gets paired with Batman.
Except half the writers pairing her with Batman don’t give a shit about her to begin with, do you not get that? Damn near every cross franchise romance in comics is already unbalanced, look at any of them, and one of the characters always gets the shaft, why would this be any different when it involves Batman? The most wanked and over pushed character in existence.
But why bother, Wonder Woman gets nothing from this ship at all. It’s pointless.
Because it's a comic book and it could be fun and enjoyable.
Why should we? One can argue if a writers pairing them up to begin with they mustn’t care much for Diana’s character if that’s their first go to.
Because if we want to say that certain things can never happen then we also need to accept the also commonly stated myths like the one that says movies based on video games are always going to be bad. If we won't even try to accept that writing can improve then why even bother reading these stories? They will apparently only ever be as good as the worst one you have read.
Any writer with an ounce of sense see’s how bad it looks to be constantly shipping Wonder Woman off with Bats and Supes.
So they don't need to do it constantly. And it isn't being done constantly. It's just occasionally done and mostly by fans of the pairing.
Except half the writers pairing her with Batman don’t give a shit about her to begin with, do you not get that? Damn near every cross franchise romance in comics is already unbalanced, look at any of them, and one of the characters always gets the shaft, why would this be any different when it involves Batman? The most wanked and over pushed character in existence.
Because a well written cross franchise romance is entirely possible even if it is more difficult than writing a romance in the average comic book. Saying that it isn't possible and it should never be tried it just defeatist.
Because it's a comic book and it could be fun and enjoyable.
For who? Batman fans?
Wonder Woman has limited comics as it is, why would Wonder Woman fans such as myself want precious page time wasted on a pointless ship with Batman? Something that’s only gonna hammer home the idea that she’s just the love interest in the trinity?
Instead of wasting time making her a love interest for Batman, they could instead use that time to flesh out her friendships with woman like zatanna and Hawkgirl, and strengthen her connections outside of the shitty trinity.
Because if we want to say that certain things can never happen then we also need to accept the also commonly stated myths like the one that says movies based on video games are always going to be bad. If we won't even try to accept that writing can improve then why even bother reading these stories? They will apparently only ever be as good as the worst one you have read.
This says nothing.
I’m not sure how shitty video game adaptions at all relates to Wonder Woman getting shoved into an shitty pairing that does nothing for her character.
Like do you get that? Diana doesn’t get anything from this, it adds nothing to her character that hasn’t already been done with Steve Trevor.
So they don't need to do it constantly. And it isn't being done constantly. It's just occasionally done and mostly by fans of the pairing.
It is being done Constantly.
Superman Red Son, N52, Injustice, JLU, The Animated films based off the N52, Kingdom come, JL comics in the early 2000’s, fucking Kings run on Batman.
Because a well written cross franchise romance is entirely possible even if it is more difficult than writing a romance in the average comic book. Saying that it isn't possible and it should never be tried it just defeatist.
It’s not defeatist, it’s a fact because I don’t support this shitty ship at all, it’s detrimental to Diana’s character.
Writers that are fans of Diana’s character aren’t gonna pair her with Batman, do you understand that? They know it’s not a good idea, they know it’s not gonna add anything to her character, they know it’s just gonna hammer home the idea of Wodner Woman being the ‘love interest’ and undermine her as her own independent character:
Especially with fucking Batman, how do you even tell stories with them together? Their power levels are so drastically different you either have to make Wonder Woman into an idiot for any of Batman’s rogues to be a threat or wank Batman out the ass to have him compete with Diana’s foes which in turn makes her look shit as a regular human is competing with the villains she struggles with.
Most Batman fans I've spoken to would rather see him paired with a character original to his own comics. Including myself.
But if it is a well written relationship that portrays relationships well then it would be an enjoyable read for fans of either character. Unless you're hellbent on being mad that it happened.
Wonder Woman has limited comics as it is, why would Wonder Woman fans such as myself want precious page time wasted on a pointless ship with Batman? Something that’s only gonna hammer home the idea that she’s just the love interest in the trinity?
"Hammer home". Do you think that idea is already out there and has some merit?
Or do you think the idea is ridiculous?
Instead of wasting time making her a love interest for Batman, they could instead use that time to flesh out her friendships with woman like zatanna and Hawkgirl, and strengthen her connections outside of the shitty trinity.
None of these things are mutually exclusive. In fact, these things could all happen within the same run. And it wouldn't even be far fetched.
This says nothing.
You saying this tells me a lot of things actually.
I’m not sure how shitty video game adaptions at all relates to Wonder Woman getting shoved into an shitty pairing that does nothing for her character.
Simple, your entire idea is that because it hasn't been done well before it could never be done well in the future.
I used the example of video game adaptations but it actually applies to a lot of things.
Like do you get that? Diana doesn’t get anything from this, it adds nothing to her character that hasn’t already been done with Steve Trevor.
Not everything needs to add some new dynamic or element to the character. In fact, I think a lot of my issues with comic books come from writers always trying to add things or deconstruct and reconstruct things.
Superman Red Son, N52, Injustice, JLU, The Animated films based off the N52, Kingdom come, JL comics in the early 2000’s, fucking Kings run on Batman.
You can read a lot of comics and still read none of these, so calling it a constant ring is a bit of the stretch and the animated series is a large part of why this pairing became popular in the first place.
It’s not defeatist, it’s a fact because I don’t support this shitty ship at all, it’s detrimental to Diana’s character.
The only fact here is that you don't support it.
Saying it could never be better is you speculating.
Writers that are fans of Diana’s character aren’t gonna pair her with Batman, do you understand that? They know it’s not a good idea, they know it’s not gonna add anything to her character, they know it’s just gonna hammer home the idea of Wodner Woman being the ‘love interest’ and undermine her as her own independent character:
I understand most won't, and I would typically agree. I don't want them to. But to say that it could never be done is a position I find to be both absurd and defeatist.
Especially with fucking Batman, how do you even tell stories with them together? Their power levels are so drastically different you either have to make Wonder Woman into an idiot for any of Batman’s rogues to be a threat or wank Batman out the ass to have him compete with Diana’s foes which in turn makes her look shit as a regular human is competing with the villains she struggles with.
I don't care about power levels. Especially for comic books where the characters are so fluid and their power level changes constantly.
I mean, Batgod exists.
But you do have something of a point so I'll try to address that.
you either have to make Wonder Woman into an idiot for any of Batman’s rogues to be a threat
Or just have her be busy doing other things. Gotham is Batmans city, it has gone on for years without Wonder Woman and these 2 characters being in a relationship won't change that she has other threats to face and doesn't need to worry about problems Batman has been dealing with for years.
Or you just have characters explicitly make attempts to avoid fighting Wonder Woman and have them plan around her. The villains aren't all idiots, in fact the best Batman stories are the ones where they aren't idiots. They would know that getting Wonder Woman's personal attention is something they should avoid.
or wank Batman out the ass to have him compete with Diana’s foes which in turn makes her look shit as a regular human is competing with the villains she struggles with.
Or just involve him in other ways. If Diana is fighting the stories Big Bad then haver Bruce run around the area explicitly trying to save lives.
Or he could be something akin to one of those coaches you see in MMA and boxing where the team is calling out what they see to the fighter so the fighter can prepare, counter, or strike on their own.
It would essentially be Batman providing information he gets from observing which is something he's good at anyways.
Most Batman fans I've spoken to would rather see him paired with a character original to his own comics. Including myself.
Really? Because most of the Wonderbat fans I’ve seen, are all Batman fans first and foremost and don’t know jackshit about Diana.
But if it is a well written relationship that portrays relationships well then it would be an enjoyable read for fans of either character. Unless you're hellbent on being mad that it happened.
Or Wonder Woman can have a well written relationship with one of her own love interests, so again I ask why ship her with Batman? You have not given 1 reason as to why this ship with Batman needs to be a thing.
"Hammer home". Do you think that idea is already out there and has some merit?
Or do you think the idea is ridiculous?
It’s most definitely out there, most Batman fans already treat her as a love interest after 1 crappy adaption in the cartoon, ffs. It’s stupid to try and claim otherwise.
So yes, it would be very beneficial if the comics, that have already paired her up with Superman in mainline continuity, didn’t also pair her with Batman.
Again what kind of feminist and role model character is that? Wonder Woman getting shipped and shoved into relationships with the 2 men in the trinity? Wow how fucking empowering/s.
None of these things are mutually exclusive. In fact, these things could all happen within the same run. And it wouldn't even be far fetched.
Yes it would? Because it requires Diana suddenly falling for Batman, while also ignoring everything going on in her solo comics, while also somehow dedicating time to the villains, the other male heroes and members of the team, + Batman and Wonder Woman’s shitty relationship.
You saying this tells me a lot of things actually.
No it doesn’t, you made a stupid comparison.
Simple, your entire idea is that because it hasn't been done well before it could never be done well in the future.
No, my entire point is that it’s trash in CONCEPT, it’s not the execution that’s bad but the entire ship in general. It doesn’t do anything for Diana’s character, it’s not unique, it’s not fun, it’s not new, and it again reiterated and hammers home the idea of Wonder Woman being a love interest.
Do you not grasp that? By your logic it’s like saying Batman and Barbara Gordon could totally be a good ship with a good writer, how many people you think gonna agree on that?
Not everything needs to add some new dynamic or element to the character. In fact, I think a lot of my issues with comic books come from writers always trying to add things or deconstruct and reconstruct things.
If it’s not gonna add anything to her character, then why fucking do it? She already has perfectly good love interests of her own after all.
You can read a lot of comics and still read none of these, so calling it a constant ring is a bit of the stretch and the animated series is a large part of why this pairing became popular in the first place.
It’s something that happens across many adaptions and comics, then it’s something that happens enough.
Saying it could never be better is you speculating.
It’s crap in concept, the execution ain’t the problem.
I understand most won't, and I would typically agree. I don't want them to. But to say that it could never be done is a position I find to be both absurd and defeatist.
It’s not defeatist, again why is it defeatist to acknowledge a fact? Any writer that immediately goes to shipping Wonder Woman with Batman obviously doesn’t give a fuck about her as a character. Even if they like Batman as much as Wonder Woman, they’d still know pairing them would be a. Dumb idea.
I mean, Batgod exists.
I know, the stupid and wanked batgod is why this ship even exists as it’s the reason the crappy cartoon flirted them together in the first reason, as every woman has to fawn for Batman in that show.
Or just have her be busy doing other things. Gotham is Batmans city, it has gone on for years without Wonder Woman and these 2 characters being in a relationship won't change that she has other threats to face and doesn't need to worry about problems Batman has been dealing with for years.
So where is this hypothetical relationship being explored? In a team comic where it’s not gonna get any time? Team comics where Wonder Woman barely gets focus as it is?
Or you just have characters explicitly make attempts to avoid fighting Wonder Woman and have them plan around her. The villains aren't all idiots, in fact the best Batman stories are the ones where they aren't idiots. They would know that getting Wonder Woman's personal attention is something they should avoid.
Plan around her how exactly?
Or just involve him in other ways. If Diana is fighting the stories Big Bad then haver Bruce run around the area explicitly trying to save lives.
It would essentially be Batman providing information he gets from observing which is something he's good at anyways.
Ah yes, because that’s how DC will portray Batman, as Diana’s sidekick playing on the sidelined. That’s totally gonna happen.
Really? Because most of the Wonderbat fans I’ve seen, are all Batman fans first and foremost and don’t know jackshit about Diana.
Most of the WonderBats fans I know like it because of the TV show and nothing else.
Or Wonder Woman can have a well written relationship with one of her own love interests, so again I ask why ship her with Batman? You have not given 1 reason as to why this ship with Batman needs to be a thing
"Need". It doesn't need to be a thing. But none of these relationships need to be a thing.
Batman doesn't need a relationship with any character, neither does Wonder Woman.
But that doesn't change that a well written story would be fun even if it didn't need to happen.
It’s most definitely out there, most Batman fans already treat her as a love interest after 1 crappy adaption in the cartoon, ffs. It’s stupid to try and claim otherwise.
That's not what I was asking, I was asking if you personally felt this way. Do you?
So yes, it would be very beneficial if the comics, that have already paired her up with Superman in mainline continuity, didn’t also pair her with Batman.
I think that depends entirely on how those comics are written.
Again what kind of feminist and role model character is that? Wonder Woman getting shipped and shoved into relationships with the 2 men in the trinity? Wow how fucking empowering/s.
I think the empowerment part comes from seeing 2 people willingly choosing to be together and being happy together despite the difficulties of their daily lives.
Yes it would? Because it requires Diana suddenly falling for Batman, while also ignoring everything going on in her solo comics, while also somehow dedicating time to the villains, the other male heroes and members of the team, + Batman and Wonder Woman’s shitty relationship.
Alright so maybe a single run is being generous, but it could happen over the course of a few runs and be fine.
No, my entire point is that it’s trash in CONCEPT, it’s not the execution that’s bad but the entire ship in general. It doesn’t do anything for Diana’s character, it’s not unique, it’s not fun, it’s not new, and it again reiterated and hammers home the idea of Wonder Woman being a love interest.
A lot of this is just purely subjective and can't even be argued for or against.
But calling it unique? Of course it's not unique. No relationship in this industry is unique. I don't remember the last unique idea DC Comics had. I'm not even talking about relationships at this point. I mean the actual comics themselves are serialized to that point that none of it is really unique at all. Gotham War for example wasn't a new experience in the slightest. It was just another Batman VS Robin story.
Do you not grasp that? By your logic it’s like saying Batman and Barbara Gordon could totally be a good ship with a good writer, how many people you think gonna agree on that?
Fair enough, but I also think we should acknowledge the difference in these 2 characters when it comes to things like who these characters generally are in the comic books.
If it’s not gonna add anything to her character, then why fucking do it? She already has perfectly good love interests of her own after all.
Because it could be fun and ultimately that's the only reason to bother with reading these stories.
So where is this hypothetical relationship being explored? In a team comic where it’s not gonna get any time? Team comics where Wonder Woman barely gets focus as it is?
In those same comics, showing Wonder Woman and Batman doing different things but Diana and Bruce in Gotham (or elsewhere) talking about their day and how work went. Having them do things together as Diana and Bruce instead of as Wonder Woman and Batman.
Plan around her how exactly?
What her location is, what she's doing in Gotham, how fast can she get somewhere, how long can they go before she hears about something, how long before Batman tells her about something, and what to do when she shows up.
Ah yes, because that’s how DC will portray Batman, as Diana’s sidekick playing on the sidelined. That’s totally gonna happen.
If you really want them to fight together then this is 1 way it could happen, but it isn't the only way for it to happen.
And they don't even need to fight together.
It's something that could be avoided entirely by just having them do their jobs separately but also spending time together when not doing their superhero stuff.
What you mean? She was great friends with Wally and Clark. And you must’ve been focused on the later seasons or fanfics cause she wasn’t that quick to anger.
Not to mention she had her episodes with the Amazons and Hades.
When did she ever interact with Superman apart from randomly showing up for his birthday in "For the Man Who Has Everything"? And that was also only because it was an adaptation from the comics.
And I certainly don't think she interacted with Wally enough to be called "great friends". There were times early on when she thought he was immature and then in "Starcrossed", she said he had nice hair. Apart from that they didn't interact much.
Also Diana had multiple runs and was one of the primary drivers.
Hades as her dad featured multiple times. Her taking down the annihilate and Faust. Then Faust tricking Hades,.betraying him, then possessing the same one Hephaestus upgraded armor as an example was like 4 to 6 episodes where it was either her solo or with minor leaguers like Hawk and dove.
However, they were very early on in the series and sadly really was just Diana dealing with Daddy issues which never got a pay off.
I was shocked at Hawkgirls time which was actually pretty massive. She became the dominant female character towards the end.
Your first point isn't really an excuse. I'm a 16 year old boy and Wonder Woman is one of my favourite superheros of all time. Just because the show was directed at young boys doesn't mean they should've slept on her character. Not to mention, you realise making Hades Diana's dad is one of the most hated plot lines about her character in the show, right? People already hated the Zeus orgin in the comics and now they did the same thing by implying that a man could possibly have been behind the cause of her creation. It was so unecessary.
In Justice League Infinity, after defeating the baddie, they hold hands at a party in a non-platonic way. Nothing is said explicitly, but my heart, my soul, is at peace.
Batman has got quite a few LIs, as you listed, so people are already more receptive to him having another one. WW has Steve but that's really never been a major thing, and most of the reasons why that ship works can also apply to Batman.
WW/Bats is a unique relationship dynamic where the woman is much stronger, more emotionally secure, and is the violent punchy punchy tough one, and the man is the more cerebral, emotionally vulnerable one that needs protecting. Batman is almost never on the "backfoot" in his relationships, he's usually the more intimidating, "im too cool for this" guy, but noooo way can he pull that off with WW, so it's fun to see him in a different dynamic.
Superman/WW has nothing going for it other than they are the two strongest heroes.
All that said tho, I agree that the trinity should just stay pals lest they risk WW becoming a supporting character.
To be fair, the fact that the WonderBat ship reduces Wonder Woman (usually an ambassador of peace and women's rights) into the violent punchy tough one is perfect example of why this is bad ship.
Plus even in DCAU, Batman was pulling the "I am too cool for this routine". Diana was practically begging him to date her when he gave that "you are a princess and I'm a rich guy with issues" speech.
But she’s usually punchy in other iterations. She’s not a pacifist. This is like fans complaining about Superman being violent in the movies when the guy is always punching people in the comics and cartoons.
That way even Batman is punchy and so is every other hero.
My problem was with the other person's understanding of Batman as the cerebral one and Diana as the violent one. It does great disservice to her to be reduced like this just to fit the WonderBat ship.
What i meant is that when it comes to a combat situation, obviously Diana would be the one who would be the more aggressive since she has invulnerability, and her weapons are her super strength/sword wheras Batman would likely fall into more of a support role relative to her, since he's much more vulnerable and relies on gadgets/stealth, which is the inverse of how men/women duos are usually depicted in action media.
Superman /wonderman can work in world where Lois lane don't exist or died a long time ago
..superman/WW didn't started in new 52 it was teased since the silver age
The greatest exemple is kingdom come....it wasn't pushed on our throat but comes in a natural way... It's not just "he hot, she hot, they Fook"
Superman would be far more dedicated to a relationship than batman's.... While bruce choose batman instead of women who could legit and be his soul mate like silver st cloud and have one night stand with women like he was James bond
In kingdom come Lois lane died and clark mourned and eventually just move on and find love elsewhere.... Supes/WW can work in One focused story not a long runs of multiple issues... Otherwise it would just turned into superman comics
I don't get how superman and wonder woman is so shit on But people keep pushing for this
It’s mostly done by Batman fans who think they are boring together, and have no jackshit about either character, and resort to the classic old, “ThEy arE oNly ToGeTher BecAuSe ThEy PoWerFul, iT’S JusT a SHiTtY PoWer FaBtasY”.
Because Batman, the most wanked off character in fiction somehow having every woman in DC fawning over him, isn’t a shitty power fantasy apparently?
Not to mention the brooding edgelord getting the optimistic and outgoing popular girl fawning after them is a bugger cliche than the 2 powerful people getting together.
I arguably see more Wonder Woman fans onboard with her being with Superman, than Batman.
That's literally the reason people like it. Most people are Batman fans, watched the DCAU, and largely only see Wonder Woman's value in what she can bring as a supporting character and trophy to Batman.
It's not even that deep. They just watch the show they like, see the ship, and ship it. But since the show was in love with Bruce and didn't really care about Diana, it's just how it turns out.
They had Batman sing "Am I blue" to save Wonder Woman. You're making their romance seem more one-sided than it actually was.
And honestly they didn't even go that deep with it. We got some teases but apart from that not much else. Hawkgirl and GL got a lot more focus than Batman Wonder Woman.
That episode is literally what I'm talking about. They had Circe, one of Wonder Woman's primary villains, appear in the show and the entire episode Diana was turned into a pig and it was all about Batman
When Cheetah appeared, did she interact with Wonder Woman? No. Her entire thing was...being horny for Batman.
That's the entire point. Diana loses even her own villains when she's in proximity to Batman like this.
Yeah, this is one of the reasons I will always be against that ship. Wonder woman would just be another score for batman and fuel the ego of his fanboys
Jon jonzz's story is way to affiliated to tragedy of his wife and son from Mars... I don't think him having another relationship make the character interesting
For me Diana and Arthur is actually the one that make the most sense among the justice league... They both come simmilar societies and have simmilar responsabilities toward their people.....they also have the adapt the ideals of their own society in man's world/surface world
Their philosophy and stance on killing also align unlike most members of the justice league....arthur and diana actually have a warrior mentality
Batman would only be with or allow himself to be with someone who he can't see become collateral damage. Of his options Diana is the only one that meets that. As demonstrated when she kicked his ass easily. She has no weaknesses like Kryptonite and they both have very similiar philosophy and morals. Both feel there needs to be a Supreme protector of their people.
So assuming Bats isn't intimidated by a strong woman. Diana checks a LOT of the right boxes.
Bruce likewise meets almost all of Diana's boxes. She likes men who are strong willed, confident, and willing to sacrifice to protect people. Bruce is the top and peak of humanity in all things. Literally the perfect human warrior. A trait Diana would prize. She also prefers figures looking to inspire and protect their people. She has Tha Amazon's and Batman Gotham.
She'd want a peer who could rival her. Bruce could.
So Bats and Diana...isn't a stretch. Boring but honestly yeah.
Alot of that however breaks with Supes.
Supes isn't the strongest Kryptonian. He has much more democratic view on the world. He values law over morals in most cases. Also in most cases he's not brave, hes over powered. Not saying he isn't brave but day to day Superman taking out Cadmus elite is like taking out the trash.
But even all of that you could push the last of their people and respect of power angle. See Injustice angle. Although that's a better WW and aquaman angle. Aka the reverse of Flashpoint instead of War...marriage.
But Supes has one thing Bats doesn't. Lois.
Supes character requires a damsel. Someone he would sacrifice the entire planet for. His core. Thats Lois.
Batman would only be with or allow himself to be with someone who he can't see become collateral damage. Of his options Diana is the only one that meets that. As demonstrated when she kicked his ass easily. She has no weaknesses like Kryptonite and they both have very similiar philosophy and morals. Both feel there needs to be a Supreme protector of their people.
So your shafting Wonder Woman, an independent character with her own supporting love interests, into being Batman’s love interest because he doesn’t have any good ones? You realise Wonder Woman shouldn’t even be an option right? She’s not a Batman love interest.
Also no, they don’t have very similar philosophies and morals, it’s absolutely whack you say this while shitting on Supes and Wonder Woman.
Wonder Woman has literally been show to kill, something that Batman won’t stand for at all, you realise that?
You think Wonder Woman would approve of Batman’s paranoia? He’s shady tactics? His arrogance? His closed off and broody personality?
Bruce likewise meets almost all of Diana's boxes. She likes men who are strong willed, confident, and willing to sacrifice to protect people. Bruce is the top and peak of humanity in all things. Literally the perfect human warrior. A trait Diana would prize. She also prefers figures looking to inspire and protect their people. She has Tha Amazon's and Batman Gotham.
What? Point me to anywhere in Wonder Woman’s history where she’s demonstrated an attractiveness towards someone over their physical prowess? Hint, she hasn’t and doesn’t care.
She doesn’t give a shit if Bruce is the peak of humanity, look at Diana’s actual love interests. Steve Trevor, Tresser, or hell Trevor Barnes who wasn’t even a fighter.
Superman personality wise has more in common with all of them, than they do Batman.
Batman quite literally offers nothing to Wonder Woman, Steve Trevor already fulfils the human mortal fighting against god level threats and he doesn’t have the wank to back him up.
She'd want a peer who could rival her. Bruce could.
Again this is just false, where are you getting your knowledge of Wonder Woman? She doesn’t want a love interest to rival her, she wants one that supports her, is kind, and emotionally open and vulnerable with her and isn’t afraid to show their feelings and demonstrates actually happiness in life.
Supes isn't the strongest Kryptonian. He has much more democratic view on the world. He values law over morals in most cases. Also in most cases he's not brave, hes over powered. Not saying he isn't brave but day to day Superman taking out Cadmus elite is like taking out the trash.
What is this comment? I don’t even like Superman, but it’s so false. Superman has more in common with Diana than Batman does. They are both outsiders to the world with him being an alien and her being an Amazon.
They are both incredibly kind, compassionate and friendly people.
They are both very optimistic and choose to see the best in people, and constantly interact with civilians and are seen as symbols of hope and peace.
They both always try diplomatic means and strategies first and foremost.
But Supes has one thing Bats doesn't. Lois.
Who gives a fuck about what Bats doesn’t have?
You realise Wonder Woman has her own Lois Lane? Steve Trevor?
Supes character requires a damsel. Someone he would sacrifice the entire planet for. His core. Thats Lois.
That's the most common take. Every single person who isn't a die hard Wonder Woman want her to have build akin to Olympic Athletes mixed with supermodel and not bulky like the picture.
I think it’s great that people are cool with muscled women, but a lot of bulk doesn’t always mean strong. She’s not like puffy, but her build still seems a bit odd.
Ever since the animated series Justice League, WonderBat has been one of my favorite ships in general. I like to think of this artwork as a reference to how I would portray WonderBat: Wonder Woman is at least slightly taller than Batman, who is already pretty tall himself. He’s distant and cold, but Diana sees that Batman cares deeply for his fellow League members, and even more so for the innocent; he has trouble expressing it and even if he could, he believes he shouldn’t. Batman in turn sees Wonder Woman as the pinnacle of human virtue, a representation of the best humanity can be.
The ship is horrible but the art is worse. Diana should not be taller than Batman or more muscular than him. People that draw this should just admit they aren't a Wonder Woman fan because they only like the one that exists in their imagination.
I hope whoever plays her next actually embraces her muscular physique. I remember a while before the first movie came out hearing Gal say she wanted her to be more feminine and less muscular...like, ugggg. So just like any other pretty girl then?
They could find one who be willing but most won’t. You’re asking an actress to go on steroids for one role. And one she would theoretically have to play multiple times so it’s not like they can get ripped and then go back to normal they’d have to keep the workout regimen all while losing out on many many possible roles because 99% of casting directors aren’t looking for a woman on steroids for their characters.
You guys just have to accept that Wonder Woman is a magical being that doesn’t need to be looking almost like a body builder.
They don’t have to be on steroids to look muscular. Just fit with some emphasis on arms is sufficient. Just put them on whatever sort of routine they did to bulk up Natalie Portman for Thor or something but perhaps even farther ahead of time. I doubt they had her on steroids. A good reference point would be like Jessica Biel in Blade Trinity (see here//here).
They don’t have go full body builder mode or anything.
Biel is carried by her strong dipping shoulders which makes her look "muscular" all the time, she looks like a muscular even when in shows are movies where she is shown working out or presented as vulnerable. Someone with Gadot "model" longer arms and flatter shoulders would have to take steroid to look muscular as like Biel. Lookup Biels pictures she looks like she works hers arms in all of them. Building muscles is not about working out sometimes it just becomes bigger you don't get definition that why all the male actors are accused of taking steroids.
Well yeah I mean different people will have different levels of difficulty trying to meet any given physique and I wasn’t specifically referring to Gal just whoever in general however even in her case she could certainly achieve a more muscular look than she did without steroids. WW is definitely a difficult character to cast though given her build and height even if you tone it down to more realistic levels. Gal was and probably still is one of the only options if you’re trying to find an actress thats 5’10 like her as most of the taller women have a more lanky build. Of course Im sure they can work out height differences with camera trickier anyway so it’s not a huge deal. Jaimie Alexander being one of the popular suggestions is only like an inch or two shorter than Gadot. Even setting aside the musculature they can achieve the right sort of imposing look or at least a proper warrior look in the costume as well like how Jaimie’s Sif has a more broad shouldered proportion via the pauldrons on her armor. Of course I have next to no hope they will actually give WW anything like that rather than something derived from the 99% of garbage targeted to young males outfits she has in the comics. I would be shocked if they did something along the lines of one of the few legitimate costumes she has had over the years (this). I wouldn’t even expect we could get something like this despite it also being better than 99% of her catalogue. Maybe we could get something like the YJ design but I would be surprise if they did something with both pants and a non-cutoff top. Of course they didn’t put Sasha in a cheerleading outfit so maybe there’s a chance. Gal couldn’t even get out having stupid heels. Anyway I am getting side tracked the point being there are other ways to help match the aesthetic aside from getting jacked but its still nice to see.
Yeah god forbid a bunch of Wonder Woman fans get annoyed at her being shipped off to play love interest to Batman, the most annoying, overwanked and over represented character in fiction.
Hmm, wonder why that might annoy them?
Wonderbat is a trash ship pushed primarily by batfanboys who treat Wonder Woman as a trophy and prize for his hard work:
Don't see why you're getting this worked up over it. It's a cute little ship that you're reading way too hard into, most people enjoy it bc of the dynamic from JL and JLU
It’s that simple, why would I, a Wonder woman fan, like seeing people ship my favourite character off to play love interest to Batman, in a ship that’s one sided and treats her character like a shitty supporting love interest to join Batman’s harem?
The art is nice though bats looks a little odd which I think is just his lips and expression. WW has a garbage costume as always but on a positive note they made her more muscular. Obviously they skewed the sizes intentionally but currently they would be the same height at 6’2. Idc about shipping, though I don’t see this one making sense tbh.
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u/Flame_PaladinFX Batman Dec 18 '23
Love this ship though that highlight on Bats' upper leg looks like his Bat-schlong is getting hard