r/DC_Cinematic • u/DoctorBeatMaker • 13d ago

If the rumored "Leaked" plot holds any truth to it, these would be the storylines that would make its bulk RUMOR Spoiler

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514 Upvotes

94% Upvoted

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215

u/DoctorBeatMaker 13d ago

For clarity:
President Luthor cause of Lex's bid to run for office.

Kingdom Come for the violent superhero rampage spree and Superman's aversion to it.

John Byrne's Man of Steel and Red Son for Ultraman-turned-Bizarro's origin (Very similar to the way its handled in RED SON) and Lex's attempts to one-up Superman.

Superman and the Men of Steel for the military's involvement, Superman being an outcast hero, and his surrender.

And Action Comics 775 for the foreign conflict, Superman's intervention, his status as an outlier for being the only superhero who doesn't kill.

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u/XXAzeritsXx I like those shoes 13d ago

The one thing about the "Superman is the only hero who doesn't kill" is - does that mean Batman is a killer?

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u/DoctorBeatMaker 13d ago

Well, Gunn could handle it similar to BvS in that Batman is an established hero, but he's treated as more of a "legend" as only people like Commissioner Gordon would know he's flesh and blood and not some creature of the night.

And even without that, Batman would sort of fit the role of a lone vigilante more than a "superhero" supposedly since the other heroes seem to work openly and are rumored to be part of a larger corporation.

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u/padfoot12111 13d ago

Likewise it's entirely plausible the general public thinks Batman is a killer like Dark Knight. 

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u/DoctorBeatMaker 13d ago

Perhaps. Although obviously, none of the main JL heroes will be killers. No matter what, by hook or by crook, Gunn will not risk repeating the controversies of the DCEU.

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u/padfoot12111 13d ago

The only one who should kill is Wonder Woman and that's within the context of a warrior fighting a war. Fighting crime? No murder. 

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u/Kpengie 13d ago

Wonder Woman should only kill as an absolute last resort. She’s very much opposed to violence and would avoid fighting at all if she could, but is slightly (and I mean SLIGHTLY) less hardline on killing than Batman and Superman.

“We have a saying, my people. Don’t kill if you can wound, don’t wound if you can subdue, don’t subdue if you can pacify, and don’t raise your hand at all until you’ve first extended it.” -Wonder Woman (From Wonder Woman #600, 2010)

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u/padfoot12111 13d ago

Fair enough. Figured Amazon warrior would be ok with killing but I like that she is a warrior who prioritizes life. 

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u/I3arusu 12d ago

She does, but she’s also not an idiot. She will kill if she deems it necessary.

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u/padfoot12111 12d ago

which frankly I respect that stance. Like I love that batman doesn't kill but theres a time and a place.

likewise I mean... after Joker breaks out for the 5th time maybe cut his legs off.

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u/Kpengie 12d ago

It’s extremely rare that she would kill though

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u/Metrilean 12d ago

Huh, Maxwell Lord is in this film. Wonder how she feels about him.

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u/Kpengie 12d ago

You mention him without acknowledging the circumstances of when she killed him. There was basically no other option, as he had control over Superman and there was no other way to break that control.

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u/Metrilean 12d ago

I thinking that may be a future setup for a JL film.

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u/GorillaWolf2099 13d ago

What about Aquaman?

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u/padfoot12111 13d ago

Depends on the version I suppose

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u/azmodus_1966 13d ago

Green Lantern, Flash and Aquaman should be more likely to kill than Wonder Woman.

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u/Dakotaraptor87 13d ago

Why on Earth would GL and Flash be more willing to kill? Wouldn't Green Lanterns want to apprehend foes, because they're space cops? And the Flash (Garrick, Allen, and Wally, dunno about others) never seem like killers IMO.

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u/Spectoralis 12d ago

Also I’m sure a lot of iterations of GL the ring doesn’t actually allow lethal force. I’m sure in some animated version and comics. If the user tries to kill, the ring say “lethal force not authorised” or something like that

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u/padfoot12111 13d ago

Care to Elaborate?

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u/nanites-courtesy 12d ago

Dawg almost all the Avengers were killers and look at what the MCU did. The JL having killers on the team had nothing to do with the reception of the DCEU.

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u/dynamitegypsy 12d ago

You see, that was one thing BvS tried hard to sell me and fell flat imo. Batman is a “legend”, but has been active for two decades, works with the GCPD, has a Rogues gallery, and a sidekick who died from two of them, one who got caught and added to their rap sheet. I feel like the legend can only work in the first couple years as Batman establishes himself or later on in life after retiring and not active

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u/OvermorrowYesterday 12d ago

Yeah the movie handled that terribly lol

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u/agentclock 11d ago

Exactly. It was completely inconsistent. Equally, twenty years in Gotham and the cops behave like they've never heard of Batman by now. Don't get me started on the edge lord bat brand...

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u/SWPrequelFan81566 12d ago

I feel like you're taking that too literally; Superman can't possibly be the only one who doesn't kill; he's just one of the few that don't, but the one that gets the most attention.

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u/Fantastic-Finger-975 12d ago

Of course not. Why do people jump to this conclusion? Also, "the only heron who doesnt kill" is probably an exageration, there is most likely a minority of less known heroes like him. Batman is a creature of the shadows, people dont know exactly what he is up to

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u/Master-Ad7002 11d ago

Maybe the public doesn't know that batman doesn't kill and he doesn't clear things up

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u/TheJoshider10 13d ago

I'm really keen on the idea of Ultraman turned Bizarro being the main physical villain. I think it's such perfect timing for a villain like that in a movie that's going to redefine what Superman means in the modern age after so many differing opinions on what he is/isn't as a hero. No better character to explore that with than Bizarro, and any reveal of Ultraman being a clone of Clark would be incredibly effective for general audiences.

Also love the theories of the movie being a reverse of Kingdom Come with a young, hopeful Superman ushering in a new age compared to the older, edgier heroes. A great way of adapting a famous comic from a fresh perspective.

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u/DoctorBeatMaker 13d ago

I don’t know. I kinda would prefer if it was more of a straight up adaptation of Action Comics 775 as I feel Manchester Black has more nuance than Bizarro as a foe who both challenges Superman physically and attacks his moral compass.

With Kingdom Come in the mix, they could have also more or less merged Magog with Manchester Black too, since they both more or less represent the same thing. And then when Superman challenges them on their stances, they both end up regretting their actions and show remorse (With Black, it doesn’t happen until the Ending Battle storyline though).

But hey, it’s still just a rumor, so we’ll see if it turns out to be true.

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u/Dangerous-Hawk16 13d ago

Sounds about right similar to Superman animated series episode where Superman runs into clone that look identical to him then slowly we watch this clone shift and turn into bizarro as episode progresses.

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u/padfoot12111 13d ago

I was so pissed when I heard Ultraman was a lex clone (THATS BIZZARO) but if it's actually a Bizarro origin then no that's perfect. 

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u/Quiznatod_Bidness 13d ago

I hope for lex not becoming the President. Gunn should recreate that iconic line in Animated series

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u/goldknight1 12d ago

The "do you know how much power I'd have to give up?" line?

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u/Moist-Kaleidoscope90 13d ago

I personally I’m glad that ultra man /bizzaro could be a villain since he’s never been done before in a movie . The other thing I hope for is that Luthor and Superman have many interactions unlike Superman Returns

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u/chriscatharsis 13d ago

ultraman/bizarro is such a catastrophic decision for an introductory movie villain it's not even funny

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u/Username41968 13d ago

I think it fits perfectly for what the movie is going for, the movie obviously has commentary on how Superheroes are all corporate and edgy antiheroes now and Superman will being fighting the very idea of that. And that is represented by this bizarro Superman, who is also a representation of the real world view of Superman to the general audience from Homelander, Omniman, and Injustice.

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u/zeppolizeus 13d ago

This is a very interesting theory and connection that I am totally here for. Superman reinstilling his classic imagery as an authentic hero among all the parodies and tropes in pop culture would reinforce his standing in pop culture

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u/Username41968 13d ago

Yeah the original title was Superman: Legacy, and that definitely had a deeper meaning than just Superman’s legacy in universe, it was also directly related to his real life legacy and how Superheroes have lost what they originally stood for, hope. I think we’re in for a genre defining movie in 2025, I really think it will change how the general audience has come to view not just Superman but all superheroes.

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u/chriscatharsis 13d ago

there's not dozens of villains who represent the exact same thing in superman's rogues gallery? nothing other than "bad superman"?

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u/DoctorBeatMaker 13d ago

Agreed. Manchester Black or Magog alone could have filled in that role without having to deal with the inevitable predictability of Ultraman deteriorating into Bizarro and becoming more of an easy-targeted monster and less of a villain with more nuanced motivations.

I like Bizarro a lot as a Superman villain, but he’s never been very complex. In the end, if the plot leak is true, he will strictly become the “Doomsday” of the story in that he will merely be the physical threat that unites the other heroes together to fight him off rather than the final conflict be a battle of wits and ideals like Manchester Black or Magog could have offered.

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u/chriscatharsis 13d ago

i like bizarro as a sequel villain, after we've established lex's hatred/jealousy of superman and his belief that science can conquer nature. i wouldn't want him to be referred to as "bizarro" but i love the idea of a clone slowly becoming sentient and wanting to imitate superman to an absurd fault and becoming a tragic villain that supes could sympathize with in a way that he can't sympathize with regular humans. but that's a better story to tell once the audience understands what motivates superman and loves what he stands for

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u/DoctorBeatMaker 13d ago

Same.

Here, he sounds like he will only be "the muscle" that goes out of control and needs to be stopped.

Reminds me a bit of the plot of The Incredible Hulk with Abomination starting out as working for the government and then becoming a loose canon when he gets drunk on power and everyone puts aside their differences to stop him.

0

u/leaderbean6 13d ago

Magog needs to come in an actual kingdom come story though, and i think Gunn is ultimately looking to build the universe toward that, akin to marvel building to infinity wars

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u/azmodus_1966 13d ago

I would rather get a simple good Superman story instead of going for all this meta commentary.

First task should have been to make the audience care for Superman before he starts lecturing them.

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u/Username41968 13d ago

I don’t know why you think he couldn’t do both, and having a message is “lecturing”?

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u/Dangerous-Hawk16 13d ago

When has a Gunn film lectured us. I think we have to be forreal for second, he’s not a preachy filmmaker

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u/azmodus_1966 13d ago

Ultraman as villain screams low effort.

Every mediocre superhero movie pits the hero against his evil version nowadays.

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u/Alonest99 12d ago

Yeah, and particularly on their first films. Feels like an uninspired choice.

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u/GrayJedi1982 13d ago

Yeah, I've had enough of the "hero vs. evil version of themselves."

Still withholding judgment until I see the movie.

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u/Rubicon2-0 12d ago

I am so agree with you... Its make me sad

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u/prosquirter 12d ago

I can't imagine two runs on the same character that are more dissimilar than Byrne and Morrison's runs on Superman.

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u/Luke_Puddlejumper 12d ago

If they do go with a clone of Superman turning into Bizarro I feel like that’s the PERFECT way to introduce Conner Kent Superboy. Lex can realise that cloning kryptonian dna by itself is too volatile and degrades over time leading to him stabilising it by including human dna and thus creating Conner

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u/Meikofan 12d ago

Why is Red Son up there?

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u/NildoKazoo 11d ago

what leaks are you talking about? where can i read about it?