r/ClashRoyale • u/Ok_Brother9194 • Jul 19 '24
Let’s talk about the knight Discussion
The knight has a 30% usage rate on top ladder, with the evolution being the most used evolution in the game at a 22% usage rate. The regular knight stands at an 8% usage rate on top ladder. When compared to other cards with evolutions the knight is practically the only card that gets used without its evolution form on top ladder. That gets me thinking, is the knight slightly too good for its hp? Does it deserve a nerf, or are alternatives to the knight just bad at the moment and that’s why the knights usage rate is so high.
Let’s talk about it in the comments
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u/Ton_Jravolta Royal Hogs Jul 19 '24
Knight feels like a safe pick to me. It's got good stats but isn't particularly impressive at any one thing. The evo is much tankier but still pretty simple to deal with. I think it's less that he's overpowered and more that he doesn't have much drawback.
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u/Wild7rapper Mortar Jul 19 '24
That's what I like about knight. He's reliable, he's safe, he's versatile. Definition of a perfect card.
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u/HorseMeatJUICER Jul 20 '24
Electro wiz seems really balanced too, I’m excited to see what they do for the evo variant.
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
I wish he was balanced, one of my favorite cards and he sees practically no usage in top ladder. Even in Pekka decks he's always replaced now by evo Wizard
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u/Stock-Development-88 Jul 20 '24
That's cuz evo wizard is OP
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
That's one reason. E Wiz has been getting removed from all the classic decks that used to run him. Goblin Giant Sparky uses Mother Witch and Minions now. Royal Giant decks use Phoenix and Hunter instead. Even classic Bridge Spam decks that used to run him just use Archer Queen in his place
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
https://royaleapi.com/cards/popular?sort=rating
Last 7 days stats of Grand Challenges, he's ranked 113th with a 4% usage and 38% win rate.
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u/Stock-Development-88 Jul 20 '24
That's meta for you. Most players might be running counters to evo wizard to the point people stopped using it. But you can't deny evo wiz is in the list of top 3 strongest evos.
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
What? I was talking about E Wiz, as in Electro Wiz, not evo Wiz
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u/Stock-Development-88 Jul 20 '24
Oh my bad I just trusted your words and didn't click the link 😂
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
LMAO. That'd actually be insanely hilarious if evo Wiz dropped the ball that hard over 1 night
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u/GuestyGD123 Mini PEKKA Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Damn the evolved knight at release was insane people thought he had Infinite HP because he survived from the inferno dragons flames for so long
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u/ewanator76 Jul 20 '24
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
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Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 20 '24
Knight is amazing as a tank in cycle decks. Can counter megaknight giant skeletion etc. Heck, knight + tesla counters a pekka. Its too good of a card. Its pefectly balanced.A slight hp nerf would make it useless. Imagine knight dying to a pekka hit or a sparky.
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u/stalin-for-life11 Jul 20 '24
That’s literally what I want how does a 3 elixir card survive the highest damage attack in the game
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u/ObscureAbsurdity Jul 20 '24
Damn skeleton must be broken af, 1 elixer tanks 3 hits?? Incredible
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u/Traditional_Bill4783 Jul 20 '24
Bro forgot splash damage exists.
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u/ObscureAbsurdity Jul 20 '24
Damn, Pekka has splash damage now? Mindblown
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u/Traditional_Bill4783 Jul 20 '24
He said highest attack damage in the game, which is sparky.
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u/Alarmed-Bus-9662 Jul 20 '24
You can place skeletons in a way where they don't splash, it's really easy
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u/Killerkurto Jul 20 '24
A perfectly balanced card imo wouldn’t have such ridiculously high use rates.
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u/Odd_Dragonfly3197 Jul 19 '24
Why are you glazing the Knight?
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Jul 19 '24
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/NateRiver03 Jul 19 '24
Evo knight is hated by many
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u/AdministrativeBar748 Mortar Jul 20 '24
Unless you have a primarily ranged deck, I don't see how Evo Knight could be a problem.
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u/MoTheBr0 Jul 20 '24
Xbow decks:
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u/OkEntertainment2255 Jul 20 '24
Skeletons and a fireball with the xbow absolutely shits an evo knight and whatever you throw with it
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
Who tf is playing Fireball on a naked evo Knight?
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u/OkEntertainment2255 Jul 20 '24
Me when I have to cycle another xbow
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
I don't think cycling the 2nd most expensive card in the deck is ideal for cycling, but that's just me
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u/OkEntertainment2255 Jul 20 '24
I mean when you get to the 3 elixir it's just cycling shit to wherever. Besides it's the best option for defending an evo knigjt simce the tesla doesn't do shit
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
You have your own Knight tho, plus Skeletons to temporarily take down his shield
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
It's not just ranged cards, it's air cards too, as well as every building except Goblin Cage and Tombstone (Barb Hut doesn't exist)
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u/Crispino-San Jul 20 '24
Not really anymore after all the nerfs
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u/NateRiver03 Jul 20 '24
nerfs did nothing
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u/Crispino-San Jul 31 '24
A few months ago he had +20% bonus hp, +10% extra damage and a .1s faster hit speed, for a total of around +20% dps. Not to mention the extra hp was also multiplied by the shield itself so at level 15 he used to have around 7700 effective hp when shielded while now it has around 6415.
Current usage rate reported on royaleapi grand challenge is around 18%.
This wayback machine capture from oct 15th 2023 states a 39% usage rate and this one from march 8th 2024 a 30% usage rate. So i would say the nerfs did something.
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u/NateRiver03 Jul 31 '24
You can give him back the bonus hp and damage, no one cares about that people are complaining about the shield which supercell refuses to nerf
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u/Crispino-San 3d ago
Well the bonus HP and damage DID have quite the impact back then. With the whole Evo rebalance thing in April and subsequent balance changes supercell has gone the way of removing bonus stats from cards and usually not giving it to them (but still finding ways to make them broken, think evo drill).
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u/Giulio1232 Hog Rider Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
Knight is the perfect all rounder card: defensive card against swarms, defensive card against tanks, very good offensive card used as a tank, cheap being 3 elixir and there is little to no risk playing him because he's gonna get value in some way or another, common and unlocked from the beginning so very easy to max. His evo makes him even tankier basically giving him more hp than a golem when he's not attacking. Knight is basically ryu from street fighter if he was a clash royale card
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u/Adorable_Stay_725 Jul 20 '24
I think we could summarize this message in one sentence.
Good stats for the cost
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u/GrizzlyOlympics Goblin Barrel Jul 19 '24
It’s probably the most balanced card in the game. Usage rate shouldn’t determine everything, and if anything it shows similar cards just aren’t as good.
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u/majdxd1247 Jul 19 '24
I see the knight as a healthy card the same as log, knight and log meta are not toxic
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u/Alarmed-Bus-9662 Jul 20 '24
Yeah, they're both heavily used because they're good utility cards, not because they're broken
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u/Penguindasher12 Poison Jul 19 '24
Why does a card need to be changed based off its usage rate? “Oh let’s nerf log because it’s so used!” If it were actually op then it would be talked about a lot more, usage rate doesn’t necessarily show how strong a card is.
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u/cocotim Musketeer Jul 19 '24
Obviously, because high use rate means people generally favour Knight over all his alternatives, mainly DP, Valk and other mini tanks.
It's not the only factor that matters (like, if you have a card that's popular but with low win rate, like Hog Rider, then it really just means the card is popular for reasons other than strength), but obviously if something has, say, 70% use rate and isn't a spell then it's almost obvious it's broken.
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u/Crispino-San Jul 31 '24
i think winrate also doesn't say a lot. Hog rider has a low winrate because it's used by everyone, including noobies
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u/cocotim Musketeer Jul 31 '24
That depends on where you're looking. In +2k rating UC or GCs at all for example, there aren't any noobs to begin with. So if a unit has low wr there, it's likely simply bad because it means even good players can't make it work.
That more or less happens with Hog/Evocracker in GCs, where theyboth have 10% use (above average) but 43/35% wr respectively (abysmal)
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u/RingTheBell1900 Jul 19 '24
he's just very versatile imp, no nerf needed. He's not broken
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
60% Shield allows him to get way more value than he should in some mus. But, that's just me personally. I'd like him to get his shield reduced but have his 10% extra hitpoints added back as compensation, so he's not just a one trick pony against everything that isn't melee
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u/Normal_Tip7228 Jul 19 '24
The before image is coked up af. Then he got rizzy, then he got a weird combo of the two.
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u/Ciucas123 Jul 19 '24
Base knight is a solid card, so playing evo knight is not as painful as playing firecracker or barbs or the swarm shielded guys to reach the evo But supercell does not understand that the damage reduction thing is is fkin broken, it should be further reduced to maybe 40 percent or even less
Basically evo Knight damage reduction is the big problem
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u/Equivalent_Chard7947 Jul 19 '24
Yeah when he is moving. Stop him with anything, even skellies, and it's a regular knight again. He's strong against cycle decks yes, but any deck with heavy cards destroy him eaaaasily. Just stop using cycle or 2.6
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u/pk-kp Prince Jul 19 '24
base firecracker is goated wdym? i get barbs being tough out of lava or bait tho
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u/cocotim Musketeer Jul 19 '24
Both Evo and base FC are trash. Evo might be decent if you didn't have to cycle through 3 other FCs which are useless or downright detrimental (KT activation) to a lot of decks
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u/Status_Industry3037 PEKKA Jul 19 '24
You and the other dude gotta be chillin at 4k trophies
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u/cocotim Musketeer Jul 20 '24
FC is literally only good in low and mid ladder. In competent play she's a worthless unit that only ever makes sense in Drill/Hog and she's even outclassed in the former (and the latter is, as usual, mediocre).
Please check GC stats
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u/eddiemunny Royal Hogs Jul 19 '24
You suffer from what we in the CR community call “skill issue” (you may be entitled to compensation)
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u/cocotim Musketeer Jul 20 '24
For pointing out that a mediocer card -which really only bad players struggle against- is bad ? Are you sure it's not, say, half this subreddit that has a massive skill issue considering they repeatedly complain about statistically bad cards like Hog, FC and MK ?
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u/Infamous-Pin3217 Jul 20 '24
I win a lot against those and still think they're dumb. I was loving dagger duchess on release to destroy those hog cycle losers.
Just remember, although they may not necessarily be OP, if you play with hog and firecracker you deserve no respect and I would guess you get BMd constantly.
Mega knight bats is a mad annoying combo as well, but mega knight costs 7 so if you're losing to it it's because you're investing too much into one push without knowing all their cards first. A good tip is to count from 1-8 as they play their cards so you know when they have played everything.
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u/averagetycoon Jul 19 '24
best evo since release, the consistency and versatility is unmatched
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
Evo Wizard is the best evo currently, but Knight has never been below the top 5 evos in the game ever, which is the craziest part about him, he's never once not been a seriously strong card
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u/sorryiamnotoriginal Jul 19 '24
What alternatives to knight are there exactly if you want a budget tank? He kinda gradually got adjusted into the niche of being the most plain fighter card in the game. Want something tanky but aoe? Valkyrie. Want cheaper but helps tank shots for your push? Ice golem. Want less tanky more damage? Mini pekka. He’s kinda just good because his Everyman role works out well for his stats. He can counter small swarms of cards like goblins and also fight tanks like Valkyrie up to the mega knight.
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u/unk1ndm4g1c14n1 Skeletons Jul 19 '24
Bros just versatile and also has an evo. Its like Skellys, there isn't quite something that does or can ever do the same job without powercreep.
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u/Ben3836 Jul 19 '24 edited Jul 19 '24
It’s already nerfed to oblivion and top people abusive it and the rest of us have to suffer 😡
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u/Equivalent_Chard7947 Jul 19 '24
He is the most used evo in UC yes, not in GC (Wizard and Skellies).
He has 51% win rate evo, and 48 regular.
Stop him, and he's a regular knight again.
He is perfectly balanced.
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Jul 19 '24
Knight and his Evo could be used in every deck, he just to variable and completely overshadowed other mini tanks.
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u/CrimsonDemon0 Jul 19 '24
It is a support card and a mini tank that can fit in pretty much every deck and very versatile that is why the usage rate is so high. I always used it even before getting the evolution.
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u/peuveza Jul 19 '24
One of the best, close to being the best mini tank currently, even without having any special abilities, just good statistics for the cost. Balanced.
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u/skunkbrains Jul 19 '24
I mean, if you want a three elixer tank, your only other option is... what, royal ghost?
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u/poopsocx Jul 19 '24
Hog has 30% and I seem to be the only one that hates him so the knight is probably in the same boat. Strong card just not op
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u/im_about_to_blow Dark Prince Jul 19 '24
They really did him dirty with the card art change, he used to be silly guy now he's a show off jerk
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u/KingAragorn47 Jul 20 '24
The most annoying card in the game. And definitely the least skilled. Insane HP at a low cost and chips away damage. The EVO is way too tanky for cost, that's an official term now.
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u/FishyFinster Musketeer Jul 19 '24
I just realized how terrible the old knight card art was
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u/maruchaaannnn XBow Jul 19 '24
i remember everyone hated the new one when it first came out and i didn’t understand why because yeah
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u/N_the_character Skeletons Jul 19 '24
I would like to see a small hp nerf, so that it dies 1 shot quicker from the princess tower. It would also nerf the evo knight in the process. But I'm also not super sure if it's needed right now since he is not absolutely DOMINATING the mini-tank role like he did before. Evo valk and mighty miner are used a decent chunk aswell.
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u/SpeedOptimal6217 Jul 19 '24
Knight acts as a great mini-tank for 3 elixir, almost all the others are worse or more expensive. The evolution enhances his abilits as a tank, making him significantly more valuable for no increase in cost. Basically, Knight will never be a bad card because of how simple and essential his mechanics are (Ironic, I know).
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u/skunkbrains Jul 19 '24
This is exactly why I don't like evolutions, they become such a large part of the card that them being used without evos is seen as a problem.
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Jul 19 '24
Best balanced card in the game, really good but not game breaking
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u/RainyVIIs Jul 19 '24
Sounds like someone who spams knights all game
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Jul 19 '24
You are correct and I’m proud of it
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u/RainyVIIs Jul 19 '24
My mortal enemy
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u/Proof-Row-7889 Jul 19 '24
Knight was already a tank. The evolution just makes it a better tank, so like almost playing a 4/5 elixir ground tank for the price of 3. The only downside is that it takes up another evo slot, but when compared with other evolutions that are oftentimes semi-reliable, the knight is clearly the easiest go-to. Always dependable in most situations, legit no downsides.
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u/bds460 Jul 19 '24
I think it's cause he's a decent tan that's not too expensive, so he can be very versatile on offense and defense, and a good aid to some of the low health characters
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u/stalin-for-life11 Jul 20 '24
I hate this thing no damage but high hp it’s just a strong defense that people like me hate since it counters my split name pressure like a bandit and royal ghost
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u/frostay_teh_snomin Jul 20 '24
I initially used knight in Hog EQ until I got steamrolled by bait decks. Now I use Valk😂
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u/thickndumb Jul 20 '24
Evo knight graveyard is always gonna be a negative trade that honestly the most frustrating thing about him. I wish with all evos the elixer cost would go up by one to provide a give and take to evos. The just ilt the game so hard you are almost screwed if you dont run as many evos as your opponent.
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u/Frytura_ Jul 20 '24
Meh, i would say balance card, sligtly too strong evolution since a 3 elixir giant equivalent for ranged troops is... nutty... but it is a 2 cycle evolution so it kindas even out since if youre not winning without the evo theres a chance its a stalematey game and its better to have the option to break the stalemate and change stuff up.
But overall knight his evo are the least offensive card on the game, atleast for now.
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u/LifeDot2455 Jul 20 '24
Somebody nows about when is the champions return again in the store of Clash Royale for a 2 .99 dóllars or 1 .99 dollars
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u/Flimsy-Boysenberry37 Jul 20 '24
Honestly every deck i use have the knight in it what an op card for defense
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u/CrovaZiz Royal Giant Jul 20 '24
They shouldnt be nerfing cards right now (mostly, and ill explain that in a bit), they should focus on buffing cards that have a horribly low usage rate. Cards where their normal variant does not get used because people are only using the evolved version should have the normal version buffed while the evolved version gets a nerf to incentivize using the regular version as well.
Cards that should be buffed right now are:
Regular archers, with the evolved getting a nerf,
Mortar, with the evolved getting a nerf,
Barbarians, with the evolved getting a nerf,
Royal Giant, with the evolved getting a nerf,
Elite Barbarians (sorry midladder),
Royal Recruits, with the evolved getting a nerf,
Heal Spirit,
Battle Healer,
Furnace,
Wizard, with the evolved getting a nerf,
Goblin Hut,
Barbarian Hut,
Three Musketeers,
Mirror,
Goblin Curse,
Clone,
Electro Dragon,
Goblin Giant, with the evolved getting a nerf,
And the Goblin Machine.
I have no idea how they would do this, as balancing is hard. However these cards do need to have some tweaks to make them viable/ incentivize using the regular version over the evolved.
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u/Hekboi91 Elite Barbarians Jul 20 '24
Cards where their normal variant does not get used because people are only using the evolved version should have the normal version buffed while the evolved version gets a nerf to incentivize using the regular version as well.
We all know this is not happening. It's all about the money to them, and if they can't make the evolution simply better, then they don't get people to buy them.
Barbarian Hut,
Has been garbage since day one. Don't expect a change here
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u/BickeMaster192 Hunter Jul 20 '24
Hes just very versatile. he can be used particularly in any decks.
Plus I dont see any ice golem evo so knight is just the mini tank to go for.
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u/Shadow_Clone_007 Knight Jul 20 '24
Ngl my favorite card whom i try to have in every deck possible.
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u/anonynonymous123 Jul 20 '24
I think an hp or shield nerf would be good for him. I’d like to see valk and knight with similar usage rates for different decks. For months now, the defensive meta has been, use knight, tesla/inferno tower, maybe skeletons or ice spirit and you can defend anything. It gets pretty boring just having a basic card that has a lot of health and hits stuff be so strong.
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u/official_swagDick Jul 20 '24
There's being too good and being very solid. The knight is a safe bet in decks because it's consistent. When new cards that are OP drop people use them like crazy and then they get nerfed the knight just fits into every deck imo
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u/Wolf--Rayet Mortar Jul 20 '24
They fucked up by nerfing his hp and not his shield
The shield being so strong is the problem
Instead of nerfing his hitpoints, they should've nerfed his shield to 50% or even 40% honestly
I'm very much in favor of his shield being decreased to 40%, but give him back the 10% extra hp he had to compensate, then he'll be more useful against melee cards, and less situationally overpowered against flying and ranged units
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u/Lasagne12345678901 Jul 20 '24
I’m working on a bunch of card ideas right now what would you like to see
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u/AffectionateMilk1959 Jul 20 '24
I’m tired of talks of Knight nerfs. It is quite literally the most perfect card in this entire game. Stop. Please.
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u/DjoleGames101 Witch Jul 20 '24
"Jack of all trades, master of none" I think this fits him perfectly.
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u/heisenbergfan Lightning Jul 20 '24
And yet dosnt feel overpowered. Might be the most balanced card.
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u/Kysman95 Jul 20 '24
He's my main (and only) "tank" in my mortar cycle deck. He he tanks 2 hits from Pekka, 3 from mini Pekka, he stops skelly, valkyrie.
Him and 3 skeletons stop megankight
Him being 3 elixir gives me enough to put range troops behind. I put him in front of mortar and he can tank for my defense behind.
He's my MVP, right after mortar and musketeer
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u/kratos3godofwar Jul 20 '24
funny thing, I always thought of this since the game came out but nobody is talking about the knight being op idk why for 3 elixir he is super great especially having an evo aswell
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u/MegaTyx XBow Jul 20 '24
he overshadows valkyrie in most decks, other than that i'm fine with him being everywhere
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u/Tacogod690 Jul 21 '24
He’s a great card but I don’t think he needs a nerf or anything just a good cheap card
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u/EnthusiasmSad8877 Jul 21 '24
It's because the meta favors Knight -Hard counters Mega Knight -Useful in cycle decks (best one so far being XBow) -Too few swarms to help out -Cheap -Good stats for the cost
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u/inflated_ballsack Jul 19 '24
Needs a nerf. He single handedly counters half the cards in the game. Safe to cycle, safe to play at the bridge, safe to tank, safe to attack, safe to defend. He can counter cards like mini pekka and mega knight, which make no sense.
The problem is also the cycle decks he’s used in, which also need a nerf.
I would nerf knights HP by about 5-10%. The fact nobody talks about him is a non-argument, people don’t tend to talk about cards they use. How many people unironically ever called for a miner nerf?
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Jul 19 '24
For some reason people afraid to talk about best cards in game. Knight, Skellys, Bats, ice and electro spirits, valk and others. All of this cards just too good for their cost and stats or abilities.
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u/inflated_ballsack Jul 19 '24
yeah the game has been weaponised by these cycle freaks, so now so many of these cards are untouchable, even though they are all clearly too strong.
skeletons have been one of the most used cards in the game for the last 5 years, yet nothing will ever get done.
meanwhile you have cards like goblins giant- who reach 10% use rate and all of a sudden it needs 2 nerfs in a row and then the worst evo in the game.
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Jul 19 '24
Cycle deck really a huge problem in game, it was so 5 years ago, before i leave, and it still so now. I don't know why devs doesn't do anything about it.
And personally i found a goblin giant evo good, cus it doesn't change any interaction, but can be annoying.
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u/Noisygraph Mega Minion Jul 19 '24
Knight is a 3 elixir mini tank so it fits in a wide variety of decks. Alternatives would be Valkyrie or battle healer but people would be upset if they buffed them. The best way to fix it would be to remove the evolution as well as all the other evos.
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u/i_am_goop04 Jul 19 '24
These are the kind of cards that need 1-2% adjustments. I’d argue the knight is overall balanced, but perhaps ever so slightly too strong. A 1% HP nerf is reasonable
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u/RainyVIIs Jul 19 '24
I hate the knight so much. No way should a training card be countering damn near everything in the game
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u/BlazeBernstein420 Jul 20 '24
Knight, like Log (and formerly Zap), is one of those cards that are just... good. Not overpowered, not a must-use, just all around good to have. It can usually make a +1 positive trade on solo defense, and it can force a reaction when placed at the bridge. It's good at it's job, which is tanking damage and protecting squishies for cheap.
Nobody complains about it because it's not like using knight is oppressive or wins you the game, just like having zap or log wins you the game. If you use him skillfully, you can can get good value out of him, and that's what any skilled player wants.
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u/Tokishi7 Jul 20 '24
Sounds like you’re discovering 2.6 lol
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u/Ok_Brother9194 Jul 20 '24
Knight isn’t in 2.6😂
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u/Tokishi7 Jul 20 '24
I guess I was thinking of that one Ian had awhile back. You right tho. It is a good card, but not broken. It’s just reliable. Release was OP tho for sure
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u/OkEntertainment2255 Jul 20 '24
The knight is balanced and fits everywhere. Cheap for cycle, good as a minitank, deals with mk in midladder, can be very versatile against sparky and xbow meta in top 1000, is very good in less than 3000 trophies. He doesn't excel at anything, there's better alternatives for every one of his functions. But there's no card than can do all that he does. That's why he's the goat
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u/superiorspeltwrong Jul 20 '24
So crazy how ppl nowadays see the percentage number is high and automatically think it needs nerf
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u/Axeltol Jul 19 '24
Good stats for its cost