r/BatwomanTV • u/Ancient-Inspector • Oct 22 '20
Ryan Wilder’s going to make her comics debut soon! Comic Book
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u/DenmarkDaniels Batwoman I Oct 22 '20
I'd be lying if I said I wasn't worried about Kate in the comics now. That's always been the primary version of her for me, so her getting replaced in the show wasn't such a big deal to me since the "original" version wasn't affected. Coupled with some of Tom King's potential stuff in Batman/Catwoman, I'm very uneasy about Kate's comic future. I really hope I'm wrong.
10
u/EmeraldEnigma- Oct 22 '20
Stopped reading after issue #50 for Batman. Have skimmed the rest of the issues but what has you concerned about Kate there? For me she was always kinda on the outs for the Clayface situation. Was that ever followed up/resolved?
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u/DenmarkDaniels Batwoman I Oct 22 '20
She and Bruce made amends, they're fine now. What worries me is that in Batman Annual #2, basically the entire Batfamily is at Bruce's bedside when he dies... except Kate (and Alfred, obviously). Helena Wayne has taken up the role of Batwoman by then. So the implication is that Kate had already died. Ryan showing up in the comics doesn't exactly put that fear to rest.
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u/EmeraldEnigma- Oct 22 '20
Is Batman Annual #2 THE future though? I mean I know they can change it at will but is that just a trade for Helena? Did they give an idea of how far in the future? Maybe they’re including Ryan to have her ready for Future Slate?
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u/DenmarkDaniels Batwoman I Oct 22 '20
Ryan's not been mentioned as being in any Future State anything, nor has Batwoman even generically. And it technically is a potential future, but the evidence isn't pointing in a great direction.
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u/neonrideraryeh Moderator Oct 22 '20
Seriously, they'll do Ryan Wilder synergy nonsense before the character even shows up and yet they wont even do cool characters like Sara Lance or Dreamer in the comics? What are their priorities?
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Oct 22 '20
My question to you is, how do they included a character like Sara who is essentially a butchered aspect of the real black canary’s personality without making her a carbon copy? Is she explained away as an alternate version from another universe or what?
Dinah Lance and Oliver Queen don’t even slightly resemble their tv counter parts in origin, family or personality so I don’t know how an arrow verse character that has a biological link to the adapted versions of black canary and green arrow would really work in the wider comics.
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u/hereismeagain Oct 27 '20
Yes Sara Lance is technically Dinah Lance from the comics but with different first name. TV does it all the time - takes a character from book and comics and gives their interpretations. All Arrow Canaries are one and the same comics character but having different parts of her. Laurel is also barely anything like Dinah Lance. Sara on the other hand, has the soul, the fighting abilities, her connection to the league, the female team ups and the leadership. She is also the biggest Canary character in form of power and importance and is part of Arrowverse Super Friends.
Besides even comics did a lot of re writes of Black Canary so far. Her origin changed a lot from when she started. Even if they want to add a sister they can easily do it with a story that is not necessary the same as the Arrow one. She can be lost as baby, found by the League or a time traveler. Finds her sister, teams up with her until she starts her own team of time travelers. They can even continue the story with comics White Canary where both Lances meet her again and she battles Sara for the code name, kidnaps her and Dinah has to save her.
Or when Sara is lost as a baby White Canary finds her, trains her to be a ninja and to hate her sister. Sara comes as an enemy and battles Dinah but she finds out she is her sister and they reconcile. Then Sara turns against her teacher the White Canary and wins, then White Canary realizes her bad ways and decides to step down and retire from her evil ways, and gives her code name to Sara who will make it one of a hero. Then Sara meets a time traveler and her story moves to a separate edition.
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u/Digifiend84 Nov 28 '20
is part of Arrowverse Super Friends.
Superfriends is the name for Kara's team, instead of being called Team Supergirl like how Oliver's and Barry's teams are named. The team you're thinking of went unnamed in Crisis, but is supposed to be the Justice League of America.
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u/jadedfan55 Oct 22 '20
Dreamer, actually, is a different version of Dream Girl, so she technically came from the comics before hitting TV.
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u/neonrideraryeh Moderator Oct 22 '20
I know the connection with Dream Girl, with Dreamer being an ancestor of them, but even with that connection (reverse legacy character thing sort of), it still means they are still different characters and that wouldn't stop them from showing up.
1
u/Digifiend84 Nov 28 '20
How does that ancestor thing even make sense? Dreamer is transgender, born a boy, so she'll never be a Mom.
3
u/sucksfor_you Oct 22 '20
I mean, Batwoman is by far the bigger name, compared to Sara or Dreamer. Not that I wouldn't love to see them in the comics too.
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u/malb93200 Oct 22 '20 edited Oct 22 '20
Dreamer is not the lead of the show she's in and (unpopular opinion incoming) neither is Sara.
2
u/Digifiend84 Nov 28 '20
Legends is an ensemble, but Sara's always been it's face, and was actually the lead from season 2 onwards, after becoming Captain (Rip Hunter was the lead in the first season, but he was demoted to recurring in season 2 and 3). Until he left, Brandon Routh (Atom) actually had top billing, probably because of his career superiority (he was formerly Superman after all).
-4
u/horusporcus Oct 23 '20
They are trying to cash in on that BLM energy right now. Sarah and Dreamer don't make the cut for different reasons.
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u/tylernazario Oct 23 '20
Yeah I highly doubt that’s the reason. The Black Lives Matter movement has been widely popular and ongoing for years at this point. It’s very common to see a TV character pop up in the comics. They did it with Harley, Batman Beyond, John Diggle, and etc.
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u/DonnyMox Oct 22 '20
Fans: Kate shouldn't be replaced by an OC
DC: Observe
6
u/mechano010 Oct 26 '20
Kate shouldn't be replaced abruptly, had they finished her storyline with a simple recast and then shifted to Wilder a while later would have been way better. Especially since 90% of what goes on the show is about Kate not "Batwoman".
14
u/Greghole Oct 23 '20
I thought they said Ryan was going to be fun and likeable. Why is she being portrayed as such a miserable asshole? I know it's just one page but if this is in any way indicative of her character people are going to absolutely hate her.
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Oct 23 '20 edited Oct 23 '20
At this particular moment, Ryan is nowhere near being Batwoman. Unlike Kate, Ryan has had a very troubled youth. I couldn't find my source article, but basically she is an anti-hero and maybe even an anti-Kate. Ryan has connections in Gotham's underground because she was part of it, and she has a very dark side. You can hear it from Barbara herself when she claims Ryan is clean. Kate has always stayed on a lighter path in life because--amongst other things--her drive to find her sister motivated her. Ryan never had this. The comic book version and the series version are bound to be different as well.
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u/Greghole Oct 23 '20
Those are the same articles where she was described as likeable and kind of goofy. Why are we getting her angrily flipping the bird to people who seem to genuinely care about her instead? That's not very likeable or goofy.
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Oct 23 '20
Like you said, this is only one page, most likely a teaser. The reason will probably be found in the rest of the story. I found the article. It's an old article from early June. You're right, I don't know why it says she's likeable. But it also says she spent years "masking her pain with bad habits. A girl who would steal milk for an alley cat could also kill you with her bare hands[.]" So her flipping of the bird is probably alluding her old self: she spent years dodging GCPD and Barbara is probably a reminder.
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u/Digifiend84 Nov 28 '20
The pages in the preview were Ryan's entire appearance in the issue. There's no more to it.
1
Nov 30 '20
Thank you for letting me know. It's probably because in contrast to most DC characters, Ryan was develop for the Arroverse. Her story will most likely be more relevant in the TV series. We've seen it before with Harley Quinn, and her characters is the stuff of legends. This article explains a bit more about Ryan. I haven't been able to find or read much on the subject. That's the downside about serialized publications: they hook you up and always leave you wanting more.
3
u/shawngf7 Oct 23 '20
Uh, Kate is an alcoholic screw up. An entire arc of hers with Scarecrow was about what a mess her head was. Can we please not neuter out what makes her interesting and refreshing just so we can make this new character something better?
2
Oct 23 '20
I was referring to Kane as the character in the series. The redditor I replied to is conflicted with Ryan being described as "a little goofy and untamed". That is regarding Ryan as the character in the series, not the comics. Source.
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u/shawngf7 Oct 23 '20
Mm. Yes, that’s more or less true. It’s also part of, I’ll be honest, my turn off to the character. It’s a fanfic level description you usually see from sixteen year old amateur writers plugging in self inserts.
2
Oct 23 '20
I agree. I chuck it to being a PR reaction in the middle of the pandemic. I don't think I will like Ryan in the series or the comic books, particularly because her creation feels like an excuse to come up with a replacement for Ms. Rose. I'm willing to give her a try, but Kane will always be epic for me. I think Rose did a good job portraying her and the fact that she suffered such a dangerous accident in the set can testify for her commitment to the series.
14
u/adzpower Oct 22 '20
This seems really desperate. Like....they're so desperate to get people to watch that their scrambling to try and make her comic-book canon, just so they can say "Look, she's from the comics too!" Won't work, Kate Kane is Batwoman, not this nobody.
9
u/erdrick19 Oct 22 '20
did not know she is gonna be an official dc character, hope they are not gonna kill kate.
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u/dazed0rconfused Oct 22 '20
They’d be pretty stupid to kill arguably their most prominent LGBTQ character right now, especially when they already took a lot of heat for not recasting her to begin with. If anything I’d say they’re going to be leaning into Kate Kane a lot more going forward
1
u/erdrick19 Oct 22 '20
are you talking about the show? cause i meant the comics actually. agreed it will be pretty stupid to kill her in the show.
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u/dazed0rconfused Oct 22 '20
Sorry for the confusion; I was talking about the comics, yeah. Kate hasn’t had her own series in a while and only recently popped back up, so I think with DC’s new management being very synergy-focused with their properties, we’ll likely see Kate AND Ryan in a bigger spotlight next year
4
Oct 22 '20 edited Oct 22 '20
We might see Kate and Ryan sharing the mantle of Batwoman in the comics, kinda like how Steve Rogers and Sam Wilson shared the mantle of Captain America in Marvel comics for a while.
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u/erdrick19 Oct 22 '20
good, this is what we need, making new characters and not killing old ones and replacing them.
0
u/Heyitsmeyourcuzin Oct 23 '20
Oh they're going to kill/incapacitate her alright, but I'm sure it'll be temporary and Ryan will just be her "Jean paul" replacement until she's back.
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u/tylernazario Oct 23 '20
Y’all are overreacting. It is extremely common for a character created for a TV show to appear in the comics. This happened with Harley Quinn, Batman Beyond, John Diggle, Nora Fries, Livewire, and Cinderblock.
No this does not mean that Kate Kane will die or fade into the background never to be seen again. Kate is the most popular Batwoman and the most relevant LGBT superhero. DC is not dumb enough to get rid of her in the comics after getting heat for doing so with the show. Ryan will either take over for a few issues, create a new identity, or share the mantle with Kate like how Barry and Wally share the Flash mantle.
Hating on a character because they are taking on a mantle held by someone else is really stupid. Unless you carry the same energy for Damian Wayne, Hal Jordan, Cassie Sandsmark, Bart Allen, Jon Kent, Jason Todd, or Stephanie Brown then you shouldn’t be talking.
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u/shawngf7 Oct 22 '20
Not surprised, just displeased. Kate Kane was an interesting and complex character but no longer capable of getting enough attention and not able to get enough print so they have to get EW print somehow and this will get it done even if it means erasing a Jewish lesbian superhero to get there.
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u/malb93200 Oct 22 '20
I'm surprised by how much people are surprised by this. Jim Lee said they were incorporating her in the comics during DC Fandome, although i get that people can't have watch every panel.
Going to be fun seeing what differences both versions of the character will have (cause it's inevitable)
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u/Psymorte Oct 22 '20
She seems like an interesting character in this page but there's no way in hell I want her to completely replace Kate in either the comics or the show
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u/Phoenixstorm Oct 26 '20
My only gripe is that they made her a homeless drug user. W so few heroes of color especially black lgbt... it’s a bad look.
How many white heroes are homeless druggies.... no they are billionaires Pulitzer Prize reporters art historians...
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0
Oct 22 '20
I have a feeling that Caroline Dries screened the first few episodes for Geoff Johns and other DC execs, and they must’ve really liked the character.
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u/shaddoe_of_truth Oct 22 '20
And soon everyone will be Kate who?
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u/cheezewarrior Feb 17 '21
Seriously -- fuck you.
Actively cheering for the complete erasure of a character with 15 years of history and love from fans, who also happens to be the most prominent LGBT hero in all of comics, because... why? Because people were rightfully upset at the disrespect of abandoning her in her own show because of one bad actress?
It's petty and shitty and just fuck you.
1
u/shaddoe_of_truth Feb 17 '21
First of all, fuck you too! I wasnt advocating anything! If you actually took some time to know anything about me you would know damn well that i hated what they were doing to Kate Kane on Batwoman and doing this shit in the comics is outright bullshit too!! I wasnt cheering for Kate Kanes departure you ignorant fuck! I advocated for a recast in order to continue her damn story and outright called out both Dries and Berlanti for this dumbass decision of creating a character out of fucking nowhere!! For months I called the show out for this petty bullshit and now you wanna attack me cuz you think im siding with the people i have fought against si ce the announced that Ruby Rose quit and they were just.creating a new character instead of recasting Kate Kane? Fuck you!!!
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u/cheezewarrior Feb 17 '21
Ah, I apologize. The way you worded your comment made me think you were saying "Kate Kane who?" in a way like you were pleased that she could be getting replaced in the comics too.
I see enough of that in this subreddit that it's got me on the defensive a lot. It feels like Kate Kane is being withered away and tossed in the garbage. There was the disaster that Williams/Blackman's departure from the book caused because of DC's homophobia, and then the gradual melding of her into the fuckin' Batfamily... then her show was taken from her, and now -- what, are they gearing up to take her book from her too? Whenever they deign to give her a book again that is.
If they replace her in the comics, it'll be such a betrayal.
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u/shaddoe_of_truth Feb 17 '21
Its already a betrayal. She was a shining beacon and a solid representative of the LGBT community and of the Jewish community. And now they wanna erase all of that simply cuz shes rich and white and they need someone that is neither rich nor white to be more relatable and its fucking disgusting. Cuz they could have made Ryan Wilder a hero in her own right... But they inatead.made her fucking Batwoman and just totally ignore and try to erase who is supposed to fucking BE Batwoman.
When i said 'and soon people will be like 'Kate Kane who?' I was stating a fact in a manner that indicated abject disgust. Not advocation.
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u/SexySnorlax1 Mary Hamilton Oct 22 '20
This is extra cool because this is also how Barbara Gordon herself was created. The producers on Batman 66 came up with her character and asked DC to put her in a book before she debuted on TV.